Heavy Handed Teacher of Seven Year Olds.

In several primary schools in this area including the one in which my dd teaches they are not allowed to reprimand the children In any way so discipline is practically nonexistent. this has resulted in complete chaos With one child intimidating the others, disrupting the class and throwing tables and chairs at his teacher. Young children are swearing at their teacher with impugnity. Teachers are off sick with stress and leaving the profession.

This is going too far in the opposite direction but tearing a page out of a child’s book should never be allowed. It is disgraceful and what kind of example does it set.

That's a sad start to the school year for your family Ashcombe, especially when things need to be kept upbeat and positive.
There could be so many possibilities as to the reason behind it.

Firstly, has your daughter spoken with the other 3 parents to get the full picture? This isn't being sneaky. Parents discuss school life constantly in messages, it's part of today's world, and they often pick up truths about what was actually said or happened. Before seeing the Head it is good to have the proper picture from all involved.

I also feel * Lucca* may have a point. Was the page removed because it was at the beginning of the book? Was it also removed straight after the title or further along the line? No one wants to look back at a glaring mistake every time they open the book and pages are sometimes torn out to avoid this, especially before there is any accompanying work. It would have been far more upsetting if it were after a lesson of exercises. Of course it should have been done in a helpful manner and not aggressively.
I would have thought any heavy handed behaviour from a teacher would immediately get back to the head anyway. Your daughter should be in a very good position as a Parent Governor and a deputy Head herself to gauge the atmosphere and communication within the school. She is well equipped to act appropriately via the correct channels.
Finally, the concern should be for your little granddaughter. If this incident has knocked her confidence badly and she is still distressed, then she too needs an explanation. If, however, she now appears unperturbed, it us important to let her move on from it quickly. Children themselves have a very strong sense of fair play and justice.

Maybe the teacher simply wanted to give the pupil a fresh start with a clean page.

Your GGC seems an intelligent girl. I personally have not used this technique of learning. As a retired teacher you will appreciate children will have become lazy or forgotten established rules especially after the long break and home schooling.
If a child has produced a piece of work far below there usual expected standard and you want them to do it again - tearing the page out ONCE at the start of the school year makes a point they will remember and it much easier for them to copy work out, rather than having to flip backwards and forwards. I believe this is excepted by most education authorities.
Missing a line out between the title and the writing sounds trivial but expected learning from a 7/8 yr old . I wonder who will to be to blame if the children get marked down on this point at the next kS2 test?
I would be interested to know how your DD would have handled this situation in her school against a member of her staff as a complaint of bullying?

flyinghandbagisback

If this was a relative of mine, the teacher would have a lot more to worry him than a child's English work. Please do something before another child has a similar experience. X

This sounds very threatening ?

Thank you for your concerned responses which are appreciated by my DD and me. I think the Headteacher is aware of issues with the teacher involved. As I live over 200 miles away from my DD and family, I don’t have direct contact with the school. We will wait and see how things unfold.

Speak to the teacher.

It is far too early in the school year for his stress level to be so high and, of course, he should never behave in that manner in class.

Try explaining to your granddaughter that her teacher must have been having a very bad day, and that he had no right to behave like that to her.

Do you only have the child's word that this is how it happened, Ashcombe?
aggressive? strong reaction?

You may find, as has been suggested, that this was a new exercise book being used at the start if the school year and that to have an error on the first page could in itself knock a child's confidence.
Perhaps the teacher thought that the children would rather copy out the work correctly, making a good start to the year's work.
It would have upset me, as a child, to make a mistake on the first page of a new exercise book and I would probably have ripped it out myself and done it again.

Children can be quite good, also, at putting their own spin on events.

of not if
(We can't correct typos on GN.)

I suppose it is pertinent to ask if the other parents complained?
I hope they at least enquired as to why this behaviour happened?

Something very similar happened to my son when he was about 9yrs old at his prep school. The teacher scribbled all over the page of work he’d just finished, he also put him at the bottom of the class when he’d alway been at the top!. When he came out of school he was crying so much (almost hysterical) he could hardly speak. He was crying so much in the classroom that it upset the whole class. I waited for the teacher to come out and let him know how I felt about my son being treated in this way, I was so angry I could hardly get the words out. I feel uncomfortable just remembering it. It most definitely wouldn’t be allowed to happen today.
My husband got in touch with the headmaster and we threatened to remove both our sons from the school. Looking back I wish we’d had.
Please get in touch with the head even if it’s just to make sure it doesn’t happen again. Poor little girl.

Lucca

Off topic a tiny bit. The granddaughter of a friend was in the school playground with her friends practising their cartwheels etc. Aged 5-6. She was told that now she was in year 1 she shouldn’t show her knickers...........
Really shocking attitude.

I’m quoting myself here... just ordered what people thought about this

Lucca
^Off topic a tiny bit. The granddaughter of a friend was in the school playground with her friends practising their cartwheels etc. Aged 5-6. She was told that now she was in year 1 she shouldn’t show her knickers...........
Really shocking attitude.
I’m quoting myself here... just ordered what people thought about this.^
Do you mean wondered Lucca?! I'll offer my thoughts.
It is a sensitive area.
Not that it makes a lot of difference to what was said, but was it a male or female teacher. I could see myself letting such a comment slip in the playground back in the day. Oops!
If the teacher humiliated the little girl in front of her friends, then that is not on at all. If, however, it were a passing off the cuff comment, I wouldn't make a great fuss. As several girls were all doing the same thing I would have expected it to have been a general observation.

Book checks. The BANE of a teachers life (well, one of many).

Not the student who will be blamed for the mistakes made, but the teachers. It will be assumed the teacher hadn't given instructions clearly. Work in student books will be part of a teachers performance management annual review, which directly feeds into job retention and salary.

I have never taught children that young, but I've certainly removed pages from children's books from the age of 12 and up.

Children can be quite good, also, at putting their own spin on events. Exactly, Callistemon. A student I'm responsible for, reported to his mother he didn't get to eat lunch last week because the queue was so long and the bell for his lesson went before he was served (2 lunch sittings, his was first sitting).

Reality was he couldn't be bothered to wait and wanted to play foodball with his friends. She was livid that her child didn't get lunch and I got it in the ear.

I had an experience when a child lied about getting into trouble.
The father came up, all guns blazing, wanting me to be reprimanded.

That is until he was told that his darling child, had ripped apart a door stopper animal, filled with rice and threw the rice all over the ICT Suite. You can imagine the mess.
While we had his attention, I took the opportunity to list all the other misdemeanours she was guilty of.

I got a profuse apology.

Has the teacher concerned been given an opportunity to explain his actions? Or has he been ‘hung, drawn and quartered already’.

He has been hung, drawn and quartered already on this thread.

I'm certainly not condoning what he did, nor saying the pupil wasn't telling the truth, but there are always two sides to a story. We only have one, the OP's.

Gwynneth?

It certainly was an OTT reaction from the teacher, but one thing’s for sure.....the children will all remember to leave the right spaces next time.
I suppose it shows how teachers have changed if this behaviour is viewed with horror though, it would have been normal years ago ( when the vagaries of teachers never amazed us children.)?

Gwyneth

Has the teacher concerned been given an opportunity to explain his actions? Or has he been ‘hung, drawn and quartered already’.

A good question.

I do wonder, too, if a Head Teacher would express an opinion to a parent on issues they may have with a particular teacher.

As we don't know what actually happened, I don't think condemning a teacher like this is appropriate.

Neither do I Callistemon I don’t think judgements can be made when hearing one side of the story.

How very upsetting for your granddaughter. It seems an unnecessarily aggressive action and not at all up to the standard of today's teaching.
Being in my late sixties, I can remember the teacher coming around the class to inspect our exercise books. We were meant to crease each page in the middle, and I had been too zealous and made a crease with my thumb that tore the page. The teacher sent me to the headmistress with my torn book and I got a spanking for allegedly 'destroying my book.'
Needless to say, I was very careful after that experience but I still remember how terrified I was, the humiliation and the pain, even after so many years.
I thought things had moved on though in recent times, and that today's teachers were far more sensitive to children's feelings.

When I was at junior school in East London we had a teacher known to the kids, parents and probably the entire neighbourhood, as Mr. Shout and Clout. He never once raised his voice or touched a hair on a child's head, but everyone knew he was capable of doing so, and fell into line. And that's the difference in them old days! Great teacher, kind man.

Forgot to mention what my sons crime was, he talked in class when the class was told not to talk when they’d finished their work. It was backed up by his friends when interviewed by the head.

Ellianne

Lucca
^Off topic a tiny bit. The granddaughter of a friend was in the school playground with her friends practising their cartwheels etc. Aged 5-6. She was told that now she was in year 1 she shouldn’t show her knickers...........
Really shocking attitude.
I’m quoting myself here... just ordered what people thought about this.^
Do you mean wondered Lucca?! I'll offer my thoughts.
It is a sensitive area.
Not that it makes a lot of difference to what was said, but was it a male or female teacher. I could see myself letting such a comment slip in the playground back in the day. Oops!
If the teacher humiliated the little girl in front of her friends, then that is not on at all. If, however, it were a passing off the cuff comment, I wouldn't make a great fuss. As several girls were all doing the same thing I would have expected it to have been a general observation.

Yes . Wondered.
I was horrified. The girls were doing cartwheels etc why on earth shouldn’t their knickers be seen ? They are 5 years old.
It’s 2020.