Are the corona virus idiots doing us a favour?

Why delay a complete lockdown ? All that's been happening has been like closing the stable door after the horse has bolted.

Some info on how long immunity might last after you’ve been infected.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-52446965

How exactly do you define what you call coronavirus idiots as a matter of interest?

Yes we all know the extreme examples of those who flout every regulation going, but judging from the seemingly endless threads with posters complaining about neighbours comings and goings,one person’s ‘idiot’ is another person who doesn’t want to spend month after month afraid to leave the house.

I haven’t congregated in a big crowd or broken any rules (as far as I know!) but we participated in the eat out scheme in August. We had a couple of short holidays in the summer and have had runs down to the coast for a walk in the sea air.
I did a lot of Christmas shopping online but I also went into shops once they reopened in early December.
All of those were before we were in tier 4 I hasten to add!

So can I be described as an idiot?
Possibly by some.

Anyway back to the question.
I guess herd immunity has been happening right from the start, and who knows whether that may have had a beneficial effect on the population.

As others have pointed out, lots of people have been completely asymptomatic so would have gone about their daily lives unwittingly infecting others thereby contributing to the herd immunity idea.

Last April DD, front line worker, was ill, very tired, fever, sore throat, breathless and a dry cough but there were no covid tests available. Two weeks ago she had her bi weekly test at the hospital which was positive but she was only a little tired, which considering the long shifts and working weekends could have been normal. Since then, in isolation, she has not been ill like she was in April. Covid twice?

I believe that it will be possible to catch this virus more than once. Viruses mutate so that they can become more effective so each time it reinfects it will be a little different.
Look at how long the common cold has been around and nobody has yet become immune, likewise Norovirus which you can catch over and over.
I know we are going to be vaccinated but some of the vaccine is only between 62 and 90% effective.

We will always have idiots, and they are far from doing us favours.
Vaccines are a bit of a waste of time DURING an outbreak.

I don’t think that there is a perfect solution to this problem, if I had one I would be far richer than I am now.

All I know is that I am worried I will catch it and die as I have immune deficiency due to the lack of a right kidney.
I keep away from idiots!!!

The flaws in your argument, as I see it, are:

1)All the experts say that herd immunity is only achieved by vaccination
2) you can be reinfected with covid
3) it means thousands more dying than at present with preventative measures in place (though they are clearly not being carried out by everyone)
4) the NHS would be completely overwhelmed.

I'm sorry, but I think that depending on herd immunity, with all it implies, is heartless and not applicable in this day and age when people have more respect for life. I thought this had been ruled out months ago.

I agree MaizieD Herd immunity was originally about disease in animals and is certainly not relevant in modern society, when there is more compassion, care and respect for human life??

There has been no herd immunity in the UK or anywhere else as far as Covid-19 is concerned. It's not even certain that there will ever be.

Please Google what it actually means. It's being thrown around as a term by people, without being understood.

The coronavirus is unlike the plagues of the past. Not only is coronavirus both dangerous and readily transmissible, modern travelling about is such that people mix much more than they did in the days of the black death and, latterly, tuberculosis.

The above explains why coronavirus is pandemic while TB which was endemic, and black death which was epidemic ,were geographically limited .

Besides the social conditions for its infectivity, the virus itself mutates more than did the causal lorganisms of black death and TB.

Greeneyedgirl

I agree MaizieD Herd immunity was originally about disease in animals and is certainly not relevant in modern society, when there is more compassion, care and respect for human life??

Of course it's relevant today. Measles being a prime example.

93% to 95% of a population must be vaccinated to achieve herd immunity and prevent an outbreak of measles.

www.ovg.ox.ac.uk/news/herd-immunity-how-does-it-work

Unfortunately it is not the idiot superspreaders who will get ill and die, it is more likely to be the poor folk that they infect.

Don't forget there is also Long Covid. Horrible.

Most are not idiots. Just selfish self centred people, who don't give a toss for others.

I think you misunderstand me Lucretzia. I agree large numbers of the community can be protected by vaccination (so called herd immunity, a term which public health workers do not like) as in polio and measles vacc for example.

What I do not agree with is the term applied to letting the virus run wild, and causing illness and death to vast numbers of the population in the hope of achieving community immunity.

I have spent much of my career vaccinating thousands so am aware of what community immunity entails and how to achieve it.

GrannyNanny thank you. I was wondering if you could get it twice so that confirms it. It sounds like they might need to change the vaccine each year like flu xxxx

AGAA4,
"Most are not idiots. Just selfish self centred people, who don't give a toss for others."

Yes, but sometimes self centred behaviour is caused not by greed but by ignorance .

I’m going off,in a bit of a tangent here but have come across some interesting data on an NHS site. Up to the 16 December all deaths related to COVID up to the ages of 59 amount to 3470. Subtract those that had pre-existing conditions and the number becomes 377. Now obviously even that relatively small number is tragic but it does put into perspective the effects on the over 60’s. It certainly makes me wonder if the whole thing had been handled differently from the start and we could have orote

Hadn’t finished! If we could have protected the over 60’s better how the figures could be much lower now.

If the virus had been allowed to be transmitted throughout the general population, it would have mutated faster than it is now. That's why the idea of "protecting" the vulnerable (all 20 million of them) is nonsense. I doubt if all over 60s want to be "protected" for years anyway. Most of them probably want to feel that it's relatively safe (with masking and social distancing) to go out sometimes.

Does “protecting” mean confining?

I don’t know the answer, protecting, assisting, paying., advising. The alternative for many has been death. I just found the figures startling and food for thought.

Previous pandemics were massively disruptive, leading to major social changes. This applies to both the Black Death and the 1918 flu epidemic, where the changes were combined with the effects of WW1.

The Black Death triggered the change from a medieval economy to a modern capitalist economy. The drop in male population in the WW1, combined with the loss of a swathe of working age people in the pandemic did more for the growth of personal and economic freedom for women than all the feminist campaigns out.

Often the case MOnica. events dear boy (girl), events.

My daughter is a front line nurse.
She has had her first vaccination, but has caught Covid19, she thinks, from a patient. Her husband also has it, (he is a teacher). I just hope and pray they will both be OK. Looking at her shift pattern, she is due to work 60 hours a week, and that can't be right.