The EU are on a collision course with the UK over vaccines.

I read how ill you were Maddyone and I am truely sorry you had such a dreadful time.
I still think asking someone who is very ill with Covid which vaccine they would take is a very strange and insensitive question.
I think some of the anti AZ feeling here is down to the feeling of being let down by supply of the vaccine, some is related to fear of blood clots. Macron's remarks were quite wrong, but they were not widely reported here at the time. It was the UK media who made such a big thing of it. As I said before Macron has since been very positive about it, the Prime Minister has had it and all the AZ that has been delivered has been taken up. I put my name down for AZ with my doctor some weeks ago, but I had got a Pfizer one more quickly. I do know a couple of people who don't want AZ, but if they all get used by prople who need them, does it really matter?

maddyone I wonder if a little knowledge is a dangerous thing with staff in health and care roles? I know there’s a lot of work going on in the NHS to persuade the doubters to have the vaccine and it’s working by the looks of it, as the percentage vaccinated is now above 90% (Wales, but I would think similar elsewhere), it maybe that it’s harder to influence care home staff because they don’t have the senior clinical input.

My opinion is that we should all avail ourselves of a vaccine when it is offered and it concerns me greatly that people are refusing either any vaccine at all, or one particular vaccine. Having had Covid and knowing how awful a Covid patient feels, and knowing the fear a Covid patient feels, I confess to having no understanding, or indeed patience with refusers, whoever, and wherever, they happen to be.

Urmstongran

I don’t want to let it drop Alegrias as it’s in the news daily still. It’s important. I’m not letting it drop. If I find relevant interesting articles I’m going to post them.

Whether or not you choose to respond to them however is entirely up to you. I dare say if no-one else is interested this topic will wither on the vine. Until then ....

Fair enough.

When does news become propaganda? When does picking up on every little piece of news coming out of France with the word "vaccine" in it stop being relevant? When does the experience of people in the country overcome the daft agendas of the Tory press? When does the actual health of the people of France become more important than point scoring against Macron?

I guess we'll see.

I think perhaps fear travels faster than anything. Maybe fear has even landed in the UK with all the talk in the news about Europe. Even on GN there have been a few posters undecided whether to have the second jab. They are fearful because of what they hear what is happening aborad which is a shame because the UK was dealing with it all so well.
Even younger people may now be more concerned and have alarm bells ringing if on the pill for example. Fear about AZ has been made big and real, by whom?

As you are still here Ug could you answer my question about the source of your information about some areas having "not much vaccine roll-out"? The official départemental figures seem pretty clear to me, but would be interested to know where your data is from. Thanks.

Casdon you may be right about that, I don’t know (fewer senior staff in care homes.) I just know it’s extremely worrying wherever we live, and I’m thankful that a high proportion of people in the UK are now vaccinated, because it makes us all safer. I certainly don’t want Covid again. I want people everywhere to be vaccinated, for themselves, and for us all. I do feel annoyed that either individuals, groups, or many people in a nation refuse vaccination, because their decision affects us all.
I was very happy last weekend because my 42 year old son was vaccinated - AZ vaccine. I’m pleased he was offered a vaccine already, I was expecting it to be longer. I’m just waiting now for my younger son and partner to get theirs. My daughter and husband already had theirs as they’re medics. My whole family have had the AZ vaccine, no ill effects. Only myself and my husband had the Pfizer vaccine.

I agree maddyone, the more people worldwide who are vaccinated as quickly as possible the better. I’ll be glad when everybody I know has had it, including my children. I think Lillie is right, it’s the fear factor that’s affecting some people, but if only they really understood the impact and effects of COVID they would realise their fear is misplaced and be vaccinated.

I do know a couple of people who don't want AZ, but if they all get used by prople who need them, does it really matter?

I think if the EU are trying to pinch our supply of bought and paid for doses of AZ then it does matter! Ursula vdL has stirred up a lot of ill feeling over this hasn’t she?

Mamie thank you, that’s very kind. Be reassured that I’m almost quite well now, and pretty much back to normal. I still have some pain in my lung where the pneumonia was, and I have to have another chest X-ray in April to check if the scarring damage has healed, or how far it has healed. I hope it will heal further, and then I won’t have any pain, but I consider myself very lucky to have had the excellent care I received, and if it doesn’t heal any further, I’m almost back to normal anyway.

Alegrias yes, worried is a good description. But why are they worried? They should worry more about getting Covid and I don’t understand why they don’t.

Mamie I read so many newspaper articles about the rubbish roll out in France & Germany (amongst others) I’m sorry but I cannot remember where I got my quote from. However the UK press has many articles about the very slow roll out of vaccines in Europe. Seems less reported upon in France then? I wonder why this is.

I think Casdon is pretty accurate in her assessment maddyone, that people can't make a good comparison between the risks of COVID and the risks of a vaccine. My mum is in her eighties and has always put off having the flu vaccine because she is a bit afraid of needles. But now, with COVID on the go, she has been just delighted to get both flu and COVID vaccines because she can see how important it is.

Glad to hear your recovery is going in the right direction maddyone

How come it’s okay for Alegrias to say that citizens would be worried, but not me? We said the same thing. I said scared. Mamie disagreed*. Apparently no one is worried. Or scared. How can she speak on behalf of everyone in say, Paris? I’m confused.

France is using 82% of its AZ doses and the rest are stored for second doses. In the last week France has given just short of a total of two million doses. The reason more people have Pfizer is because we have more doses. Pfizer and Moderna are given at vaccine centres, AZ at GPs and pharmacies. The effort and the take-up is huge. Everyone is talking about vaccination and many people who were reluctant have changed their minds.
I recommend The Local and in particular John Lichfield (also on Twitter) as excellent sources of accurate information in English.
Having said all that, I am not sure how helpful it is for those of us who live here to keep providing first-hand information and actual data.
I feel as if I am bashing my head against a brick wall.

It is an indisputable fact that President Macron and Chancellor Merkel have both cast doubts on the efficacy and safety of the Astra Zeneca vaccine in certain age brackets.
These age brackets appear to be a moveable feast from unsafe in over 65s to unsafe in under 60s.

Yes there have been clots in the UK due to Astra Zeneca resulting in I believe 7 deaths out of 20+ millions of the population who have had this vaccine.

There have also been clots associated with the Pfizer vaccine.

These risks have been explained clearly and precisely by Chris Whitby and Jonathan Van Tam in multiple briefings.

There is risk in every thing we do, I for one am happier with the risk of a clot than the risk of contracting Covid, which with my lungs would in all probability be fatal.

Well if what you say is correct Mamie and the British press (not just the Tory newspapers either!) is wrong then I truly apologise.

Do you think then that the whole shenanigans for the last week or so is just complete nonsense?

If so, I’m happy to stop posting on this subject.

Some days I feel I have to explain myself a lot. This is one of them. I'll apologise in advance if I'm going to offend you UG.

You have a history of posts criticising the EU and the various heads of the countries that are part of the EU. I think most of us are aware of your ideas over Brexit. Your posts have been an unwavering criticism of everything about the vaccine rollout in the EU and you belittle people in the countries there who try to say you don't really have the right idea. Just above you suggested that the press in France are concealing the true situation. So when you say that you are sorry for the people there, that people must be worried, then we all see a double standard. Disingenuousness. (is that a word?)

There you go. I expect I might get deleted now.....

I apprecitate Switzerland isn't Europe, but I am getting my vaccination here next week.

Spanish friends in Spain are scared to have Astra Zeneca vaccine and think our English friends are mad if they have it.

English friends and family there just want a vaccine, couldn’t give a tinkers cuss which one it is.

GagaJo

I apprecitate Switzerland isn't Europe, but I am getting my vaccination here next week.

Blimey Gagajo when did Switzerland move?

No, I’m not easily offended Alegrias but thank you for wondering if I might be.

Yes I voted for Brexit.
Yes I think the EU procurement for vaccines was poor.
I think we can all agree on that?
Yes I do think Maxron & Merkel made a bad situation worse.
Yes I disagree with UvdL trying to stop exports from factories.
No I don’t think I’m being disingenuous about European citizens being annoyed/frightened/despairing with vaccine protection being offered.

We all need to be vaccinated to be safe from Covid. I’m just genuinely frustrated with the inept handing of a roll out across Europe. And yes, I do think their politicians have added fuel to the fire.

I think some of the British press and media are wrong and seriously out of date. We have actually given up our subscription to the Guardian after more than 50 years because we have been so appalled by inaccurate reporting.
The data is available. This is the site. Infection rates, vaccination rates, départemental rates.
covidtracker.fr/
Press coverage is huge. Yesterday's television news had a lovely story of the fire brigade visiting extremely remote mountain areas to vaccinate people who cannot travel.
Two million people in a week is not "rubbish". It really isn't.

I’m not going to post on this subject any more. I think I’m annoying people and that’s genuinely not my intention.

Urmstongran please do not be bullied off of the thread, your opinions and interpretation of the subject matter are just as valid as anyone’s.

There will always be people who disagree and even get annoyed Urmstongran but that shouldn't deter you from posting, especially on the thread you started which has produced some very informative and interesting responses.

FWIW If I'd written your post @ 13.52 it would have been identical.