Mridul Wadhwa - Male CEO of Edinburgh Rape Crisis

Errrmmm - Transwomen feel that they are women, whatever their genetic makeup, and however much other people may feel that they are not exactly the same as natal women.

If raped women feel threatened by the thought of being treated by a complete male, however benign his intentions and however female he feels, how is their feeling less valid than the feeling of the transwoman? All feelings are subjective.

Germanshepherdsmum

*trisher*, you have referred more than once to a trans woman ‘thinking’ they ‘are’ a woman. Can you explain how such a thought could arise in the mind of someone who has a penis and testicles? I’m talking here about trans women, as were you when you said this, not someone who thinks they ‘should’ change sex as they believe they were mis-gendered at birth.

Look up gender dysphoria.

Excellent trisher! Your next diversion is an obsession with genitalia. I do wonder how you seem to notice posts about body parts rather than answering or commenting on the other parts of a post.
Why does it matter how small the number of rapes by TW is? In your ‘feminist’ brain does that justify allowing situations where it could happen?
The major concern is not whether the rape has been carried out by a TW, but whether the victim of a rape should be confronted with a fully loaded male claiming to be a woman when she needs help.
It’s whether she should be confronted with the male view of how she should feel, how she should ‘reframe her trauma’.
It’s whether she can rely on people being honest enough about themselves at interview to at least let others decide whether an appointment is appropriate.
I think you’re being particularly obtuse if you think any woman who has been raped would choose to be dealt with by a man, whatever he calls himself. But then . . .

The only sort of system I know of that thinks one group of people more worthy of consideration than another is patriachy. Precisely trisher, thank you. That is precisely what we now have a ERCC now that a man is their CEO. Own goal.

Nobody has said that they have the idea that men are waiting to pounce on women - please stop putting words into our mouths.

One of the oft asserted misleading fictions posted is that men will dress as transwomen and use public toilets to attack women. It's just one example of how facts are twisted.
They are apparently all lining up as well to be sent to prison where they will become transwomen and once again attack women.
But of course when you prove it isn't strangers who attack women, but the men they know, nobody said anything.

Diversion 2 ?
Gender dysphoria is a serious problem for those who face that challenge, but it doesn’t provide a reason for the sufferers to decide their needs and rights take precedence over those who don’t suffer from it.

Did anything I posted about the association connected with trauma stroke a chord, trisha?

Chewbacca

^The only sort of system I know of that thinks one group of people more worthy of^ consideration than another is patriachy. Precisely trisher, thank you. That is precisely what we now have a ERCC now that a man is their CEO. Own goal.

Chewbacca Isn't the ERCC seeking to become more inclusive by using funds to support other groups of people who are raped besides women? Isn't that your whole argument? How then can they think one group is more worthy than any other? Providing services for other groups is more not less inclusive.

trisher you have always come across as an intelligent woman.

The fact that you cannot understand why a female rape victim could be petrified, uncomfortable or embarrassed by having to discuss her rape in the presence of a male (and all the TW I have encountered it is blatantly obvious that they are male) quiet frankly I give up…

As you haven't yet proved to me that a single rape victim has been forced to have counselling by a transwomen it's a complete red herring as far as I'm concerned Peasblossom. It goes in the same pile as the inaccuracies posted about MW. It's just another unsubstantiated accusation , which is what transphobes specialise in.

Desperate cry trisher!

trisher

^Nobody has said that they have the idea that men are waiting to pounce on women - please stop putting words into our mouths.^

One of the oft asserted misleading fictions posted is that men will dress as transwomen and use public toilets to attack women. It's just one example of how facts are twisted.
They are apparently all lining up as well to be sent to prison where they will become transwomen and once again attack women.
But of course when you prove it isn't strangers who attack women, but the men they know, nobody said anything.

Who on this thread has 'oft asserted' any such thing?

Or suggested that transwomen are 'lining up' to be sent to prison? Or was it 'natal men' who are lining up to be sent to prison where they can pretend to be transwomen and attack women? It's not clear, but either way, nobody is saying that, except for you. More inferred nonsense and more words put into the mouths of posters.

Sorry to bang on about pronouns, but the ones in your last sentence are obscuring your meaning. They do matter at times.

I'm embarrassed for you trisher.

GrannyGravy13

trisher you have always come across as an intelligent woman.

The fact that you cannot understand why a female rape victim could be petrified, uncomfortable or embarrassed by having to discuss her rape in the presence of a male (and all the TW I have encountered it is blatantly obvious that they are male) quiet frankly I give up…

I understand perfectly GG13 . I simply don't believe what is posted on this thread by biased individuals. Once you prove their statements are unfounded they move onto another accusation.
I have yet to see any evidence of women being forced to accept counselling
I have seen MW misrepresented, falsly accused, misgendered and blamed. It makes me less likely to believe some posters.

Sigh.....

I'm embarrassed that women who profess to be feminists should try to use the trauma of raped women to attack transwomen with absolutely no evidence whatsoever apart from one phone call where someone said they could not guarantee a counsellor would not be trans. As I said no one answering a telephone would have such knowledge or be prepared to give such an assurance. It would require access to personal information which is data protected and which would not be shared with anyone except certain members of staff.
From this you seem to have drawn the conclusion that a rape victim will be forced to have counselling by a transwoman against her will. Or will be traumatised by sharing a space with a transwoman. It's not logical, its not factual. It's pure conjecture.

One last try.

Can you not understand that just the thought that they might have to meet with a man at Rape Centre is enough to prevent a woman who has been raped from going there?

It’s an emotion, a feeling connected to the trauma. Not a rationale based on a statistic.

Actually you’ve said it.

It’s not logical. It’s not factual.

You’re right.

But logic and facts are not what are needed at a Rape Centre.

Once you prove their statements are unfounded they move onto another accusation.

When have you ever proved a statement to be unfounded?

All that you have been accused of, as far as I can see, is ignoring the bits of our posts that you find do difficult to refute (ie most of them), illogical and biased reasoning, and condescension and rudeness towards fellow posters. Otherwise, there are no accusations coming from this 'side' of the argument.

You do seem to live in your head at times.

Chewbacca at times the sheer bigotry and discrimination disguised as concern and feminism appals me. I find it repugnant, illogical, ill informed and condemnatory. It so matches other attempts to denigrate or destroy minority groups I find it hard to believe women could sink to such a level.
So be embarrassed if it makes you feel better.

Doodledog
All of the statements made about MW have proved to be false. Do I really need to list them?

That’s a really desperate cry from you trisher. Sorry pressed send instead of preview.
Has it happened I don’t know. Are you willing to allow that to happen trisher?

If you’re talking bigotry, and you are, let me remind you that you appear to be so bigoted against natal women that you would risk that happening.

And so bigoted that you still say that the number of women who have been traumatised by the TWANW is so small it doesn’t matter.

trisher

I'm embarrassed that women who profess to be feminists should try to use the trauma of raped women to attack transwomen with absolutely no evidence whatsoever apart from one phone call where someone said they could not guarantee a counsellor would not be trans. As I said no one answering a telephone would have such knowledge or be prepared to give such an assurance. It would require access to personal information which is data protected and which would not be shared with anyone except certain members of staff.
From this you seem to have drawn the conclusion that a rape victim will be forced to have counselling by a transwoman against her will. Or will be traumatised by sharing a space with a transwoman. It's not logical, its not factual. It's pure conjecture.

It has taken you a long time to devise this scenario, hasn't it?

How do you know that there was 'one phone call', and how do you know the content of the call? Have you access to the ERC's code of conduct for staff?

I would have thought that in an organisation headed up by a transwomen, particularly one who has made their position on 'bigots' clear - they need to reframe their trauma, in case you have forgotten - it would have been pretty obvious that there was no guarantee that their counsellor would not be trans.

In any case, that is really not the point. There are women who may not be too concerned about having a trans counsellor, I'm sure. The point, for the squillionth time, is that it should not be forced upon those who don't, either by deceit or because their wishes are deemed to be secondary to those of TRAs.

Peasblossom I would imagine there are very few places where anyone could guarantee you wouldn't meet a man. Even nunneries have the occasional visit from a priest.

trisher

Doodledog
All of the statements made about MW have proved to be false. Do I really need to list them?

If you can show the proof that you claim to have shown, that might be interesting. By 'proof', I don't mean an article in a general interest publication, or similarly unverified sources.