Staying on topic- threads in general

Brilliant post @ 23.09 Rosie51

So the use of words, and their meanings and how they're used, is important afterall trisher? I wish you'd make your mind up.

Doodledog

trisher

What about men whose wives become transmen are they Transwidowers?

If they choose then why not? Using your own logic they wouldn’t be excluding anyone, or taking anything away.

No but they would be using a word which has another meaning. Their marriage hasn't ended through death. They would have to divorce. Women and men who divorce are divorcees.

If a man identifies as a woman or vice versa, it's acceptance without exception, no debate. If a woman whose husband decides he really has been a woman all his life identifies as a transwidow suddenly she's evil incarnate, appropriating a 'real' widow's grief.
The Tra's want to remove the spousal exit clause from the GRA which allows a woman to be divorced from her husband before he can gain a GRC. Once again the transwoman's wants are paramount and the reluctant spouse would be forced to divorce from a same sex marriage they never willingly or knowingly entered. Biological women count for less than the dogsh*t on your shoe.

VioletSky you might continue to love the person and some wives do that, possibly even reclassifying themselves as lesbian.
However not all are able to do that and it may not even be wanted by the man.

** "What Is A Trans Widow?

A trans widow is a woman (usually heterosexual) whose male partner or husband believes that they have a gender identity other than “man” or who cross dresses. Often women also report having experienced that their husband or partner has autogynephilia (AGP).

​Women in this situation report feeling like their male partner has died. This is particularly the case if their partner or husband came out as trans' and decided to transition. The transformation is usually so complete that their partner is unrecognisable as the man they married, both in looks and in personality. The woman will be forbidden from calling her husband by his previous “dead name”."

www.transwidowsvoices.org/

trisher

What about men whose wives become transmen are they Transwidowers?

If they choose then why not? Using your own logic they wouldn’t be excluding anyone, or taking anything away.

I dont know there are so few of them. Transitioning amongst middle aged women is very very rare. It is young women who transition. Whereas men transitioning in middle aged and therefore often when married is something which seems to happen quite a bit.

I wonder do these women fill in forms as widows?

They probably scour the forms, looking for the bit that says "trans widow", get offended that there's no allocation for their minority demographic, then lobby parliament to demand that the forms are torn up and redone to remove other demographics and have them in the forefront. What could possibly be wrong with that?

trisher

Doodledog

I find it incredible that someone who refuses to understand how women feel when they are told that they are no longer mothers, no longer women, can not breastfeed their babies and so on can insist that women whose husbands have stopped being the men they married may not choose a name for themselves because suddenly language matters!

It is notable that the people suffering in both scenarios are women, not transwomen, isn’t it?

There's the twisting once again no one has said women can't be called breast feeders (I did it. I actually liked it but no way would I be called that!). Just that those who don't want to be can be called chest feeders (which to me is equally as odd).

If your husband leaves you for another woman and you divorce him you are a divorcee and have to fill in all the forms as such. I wonder do these women fill in forms as widows?

As you know, I’m not suggesting that women think breastfeeding is their primary role.. I am talking about the way in which it is ok for transpeople to change the language to include their circumstances, but when women want to do the same it is ‘a bit much’.

What about men whose wives become transmen are they Transwidowers?

I doubt it because there's no provision to do so but maybe that provision should be made available for those who want it.

It is notable that the people suffering in both scenarios are women, not transwomen, isn’t it?

Ah! That's what makes all the difference Doodledog. Natal women don't have the same feelings of grief, sadness and despair as trans women.

Doodledog

I find it incredible that someone who refuses to understand how women feel when they are told that they are no longer mothers, no longer women, can not breastfeed their babies and so on can insist that women whose husbands have stopped being the men they married may not choose a name for themselves because suddenly language matters!

It is notable that the people suffering in both scenarios are women, not transwomen, isn’t it?

There's the twisting once again no one has said women can't be called breast feeders (I did it. I actually liked it but no way would I be called that!). Just that those who don't want to be can be called chest feeders (which to me is equally as odd).

If your husband leaves you for another woman and you divorce him you are a divorcee and have to fill in all the forms as such. I wonder do these women fill in forms as widows?

I'm going for funny Chewbacca it's too late to deal with offensive.

The only consistency is the misogyny.

I know, Chewbacca. It’s surreal.

I'm finding it hilarious that, on the one a hand, we're being told that sex/gender i.d. is only a social construct and we should be able to identify any way that we feel comfortable with and without any societal judgement. But at the same time, women who's husbands/partners announce that they're now changing their gender, thus ending the original relationship platform, they have no such right to identify themselves as they wish and in a way that makes them comfortable. If they identify themselves as "transwidows" they're being judged as too much and underestimating the distress felt by real widows.

The double standards and lack of awareness would be offensive if it wasn't so funny.

trisher now you are appealing to my love of logic

Argh

Cannot balance logic and feelings

I find it incredible that someone who refuses to understand how women feel when they are told that they are no longer mothers, no longer women, can not breastfeed their babies and so on can insist that women whose husbands have stopped being the men they married may not choose a name for themselves because suddenly language matters!

It is notable that the people suffering in both scenarios are women, not transwomen, isn’t it?

It doesn't mean that these women don't have the right to use this term either trisherand if women whose husbands have left them for someone else choose to regard themselves as "some sort of widow" why shouldn't they?

Genuinely not enough to have a solid opinion on that term.

I am always open to the fact that people feel how they feel whether or not we agree that they should and those feelings matter

The partner/husband is not dead they have changed gender. (And according to some they still remain the same sex so haven't even really changed). If they claim the person they were is dead you are still able to communicate with the person they have become. Now I know some widows have claimed to communicate with their dead husbands but most of them will never again be able to. The two situations are not even comparable. The pain may be similar but that doesn't give women the right to use the term. As I asked should women who are left for another woman be called some sort of widow?

I can't begin to imagine what it must be like; can any of us?

I think unless you have read the stories you cant understand. They talk of years of deceit, lots of complex sexual behaviour, the patterns of behaviour seem to follow a script in the way those who are having affairs often follow a script.

None of us know how we'd react or what we'd feel in that situation. It's wrong to invalidate what someone feels especially when it's done by picking them up for the word or words they use to try and make sense of what's happened to them and how they feel about it.