Undercover work at a GP surgery.

And, talking of ‘going private’…… I wonder how many Gransnetters will contact this fellow.

I've been able to see a gp throughout the last couple of years (even though I have had better experiences with nurse paractitioners)

My problem has been hitting the wall in terms of being told my blood tests were fine (they weren't) the gp had "no record" of hospital results, prescribed meds, and letters to him from consultants.

I believe we are being weaned off our dependency on our local surgeries and don't think we will ever return to pre-pandemic days.

The eConsult is just part of the process. Whilst I understand it makes sense to use the technology available - clearly this data processing tool is not a one-size-fits-all. If you have complex health problems it is not the best method of communication. It also aids the 'disengagement' between doctor and patient.

... all part of the gradual privatisation of healthcare IMO.

Our previously amazing village surgery is now almost impossible to access a GP, the two doctors work very part time and when my DH phoned for an appointment he was given one in 6 weeks! I can only assume they think you’ll either be better or dead by then ?
For a Practice Nurse appointment I had to drive 5 miles to another surgery in the same practice three times a week for dressings.
It’s really not acceptable to feel as if you’re being a nuisance when you phone either.

lemsip

i was told of a case where a person had a mole on her back and requested a gp appointment, she was told to get someone to take a photo of it then get them to take another photo in a months time and compare the, if it's grown get in touch.

That happened to me. I was on my own, so tried to take a picture of my own back! I then got a very grumpy doctor who tole me the quality wasn't good enough and I ended up having a face-to-face appointment.

Taichinan may well be part of a cunning plan! An easy way to reduce the numbers of pensioners , waiting lists and care home requirements in one fell swoop….

And that's another thing SusieB50 - what about people who are hard of hearing? I wasn't coping with the phone at all with my NHS hearing aids, so my son bought me these wonderful Bluetooth ones and I can hear almost perfectly over the phone now. (I couldn't get them on the NHS as at 80 I don't need them to enable me to work!) Another case of 'go private or do without' I suppose. So now if I need to I'll be able to hear the doctor better over the phone than face to face - in fact, face to face I'd probably have to ask him to phone me so that I could hear him properly! Joking apart though, it is the elderly who are suffering most under this regime of phone calls and photos and it is frightening to think of the number of people who must be ignoring symptoms until it is too late for effective treatment. Unless, of course, that is all part of the dastardly plan?

We have a PA in our surgery who was a healthcare assistant. She’s done a few courses and is now the PA ?‍♀️. Not impressed really with how GP surgeries are going . I managed to speak to a doctor the other day regarding my on going heart investigations and she didn’t or didn’t bother to get access to my records , she knew nothing about my history or the fact I have had recent surgery . She talked so fast and I couldn’t hear what she was saying half the time as the phone speaker was right next to her clacking keyboard! I so agree that this is all to encourage us to pay privately to be able to have a face to face GP appointment. Really sad to see it all go down the pan . A friend’s daughter had recently had a baby - her new birth visit was done over the phone, really helpful !

i was told of a case where a person had a mole on her back and requested a gp appointment, she was told to get someone to take a photo of it then get them to take another photo in a months time and compare the, if it's grown get in touch.

Daddima

Deedaa

Callistemon21 Feel free to use my argument. It makes perfect sense to me - how can you tell how someone really is with a quick phone call?

When DH was on chemotherapy he was seeing his consultant once a month. If he didn't feel like going out he would ask if the consultant could just organise the next lot of meds without us seeing him. The answer was always "No I need to see you in person to see how you really are"

Maybe it’s me, but can you tell me how having met a patient means you can make a better diagnosis? I appreciate that a GP who knows you well will know that either, 1) you wouldn’t be there if it wasn’t serious, or, 2) you do rather ‘enjoy ill health’, but, in many cases, I suspect the GP is following notes from previous appointments, rather than their own memories of the patient.
Mind you, my ( Scottish) surgery provides excellent care, albeit that Covid has curtailed the number of appointments available, so I’m a bit confused by the references to PAs etc, as I don’t think we have them here. We have practice nurses, but I think they mainly take bloods, give injections etc.

I think in this context it’s more about physically examining a patient, rather than knowing them, and I think in some cases going on past history can be misleading.

During the pandemic I developed a hard and painful swelling on my knee. I had telephone consultations with the practice nurse and then various GPs. The consensus was that it was due to long standing osteo-arthritis and my usual medication was prescribed. Over time it became clear to me that something else was going on and after several more useless telephone appointments, I insisted on actually seeing a GP.

I was examined ‘hands on’ and referred to a rheumatologist - it turned out to be Rheumatoid Arthritis, which was a new diagnosis for me and the treatment path is completely different. Thanks to the delay in diagnosis and treatment, the joint is now severely affected and I’m awaiting a knee replacement, for which the waiting list is so long that I would probably have to go private to have any hope of actually getting.

The government is privatising the NHS under our noses and outsourcing GP services to private providers will lead to even worse patient care than we have now. And that’s terrifying.

I agree Pammie, as long as the nurse practitioners know their limitations, and keep to them.

Nannarose

What I find especially upsetting, is that using Physician Associates (along with others such as Nurse Practitioners and some other specialities) is a really good idea.
They don't just save expensive doctors' time - they can take time to explain things better and in a way more suited to the individual they are dealing with.
This story needed to come out because it is poor practice. But now, people are going to be distrustful, thinking they are 'fobbed off' when in fact, well managed, this can be an excellent service.

But if PA’s aren’t allowed to prescribe, what’s the point ? And TBH the fact that they aren’t allowed to prescribe speaks volumes about the wisdom of allowing them to see patients unsupervised.

When our NHS is privatised like in the US it will be down to the consciences of individual medics to provide good care.

This will be despite, not because of , the system.

Operose Health is owned by US company Centene which as been taken to court several times for poor care.

Our NHS is being sold off.

Conservative Party members number only 200,000 and are all over 60, male, and white.

I am very sad and concerned that the government appears to be undermining the importance of general practice in its drive for greater efficiency. Efficiency for whom, I wonder!

The ultimate "drive" is for healthcare to become simply another marketable commodity subject to the laws of supply and demand. This is the current free-market, libertarian, small-state ideology of the present government.

Deedaa

Callistemon21 Feel free to use my argument. It makes perfect sense to me - how can you tell how someone really is with a quick phone call?

When DH was on chemotherapy he was seeing his consultant once a month. If he didn't feel like going out he would ask if the consultant could just organise the next lot of meds without us seeing him. The answer was always "No I need to see you in person to see how you really are"

Maybe it’s me, but can you tell me how having met a patient means you can make a better diagnosis? I appreciate that a GP who knows you well will know that either, 1) you wouldn’t be there if it wasn’t serious, or, 2) you do rather ‘enjoy ill health’, but, in many cases, I suspect the GP is following notes from previous appointments, rather than their own memories of the patient.
Mind you, my ( Scottish) surgery provides excellent care, albeit that Covid has curtailed the number of appointments available, so I’m a bit confused by the references to PAs etc, as I don’t think we have them here. We have practice nurses, but I think they mainly take bloods, give injections etc.

It’s all part of the zero carbon footprint that the NHS are committed to.

www.miphealth.org.uk/home/news-campaigns/Features/feature-a-net-zero-nhs.aspx

Given up with ours. Doctors are an extinct species. Why are they not working like the rest if the population. , it’s bad.

TBH I know of two cases - both close to home - where even a properly qualified and experienced GP has failed to recognise signs of cancer, let alone refer someone for urgent tests, so I don’t quite see how PAs are supposed to be up to it.
They both died within a couple of years.

The fact is, we haven’t been training enough doctors for a long time. As all too often, short-term-ism, and doing things on the cheap. Not to mention poaching medics from poorer countries.

AussieGran59 It’s the same here in France. I have seen my doctor all through lockdown, there is no nurse. She insists I go even though it’s for repeat prescriptions. Agreed I pay for the visit But it is refunded.
People who don’t have any money don’t pay

I saw the BBC tv program which the text was written about. The government are selling pieces to the Americans so much so that it would be hard to get it back.
This is Brexit free trade. For years the US has been wanting to break though into the NHS because it is so lucrative.
The NHS gives the money to these US companies because they have x number of patients on a list, then the companies give the cheapest service they can get away with.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

I actually saw my GP yesterday and as I gathered my things to leave I
spoke briefly about problens I'd had recently with the NHS (just in passing) - she volunteered that over the last 10 years or so the system has been run down. I agreed, she volunteered that she genuinely thought it was to soften it up for private practice/big firms to come in and "Americanise" us and gave examples.

She surprised me with how open she was and how sad and despairing she sounded.
I feel it is true but it was sad to hear it from her (very measured) lips.

This is Tory strategy. Run down the health and dental services so people are forced to go private then let the American insurance companies move in to make vast profits.
The company running the surgeries featured on Panorama is American. They use Assistant Physicians because they cost half as much as a GP.
Many many parts of the NHS have already been privatised.

I have been actively trying to get in touch with my surgery for over a week, with no luck , but glad to hear you were successful. I will keep trying p, but it has been so frustrating.

I posted yesterday about the difficulty I was having accessing an appointment at my local surgery.
Yesterday I had my first appointment since 2020, an actual face to face appointment, with the doctor who replaced my previous (retired) doctor.
Wonderful! ,
The door to the surgery was wide open, I sorted out an online prescription with the receptionist, saw my doctor who was familiar with my medical history, listened to what I said, gave me treatment and advice about a new medical condition, and sent the new prescription directly to the pharmacy so I could collect it on the way home.
Faith in doctors and surgeries restored!