Do you bother to check out Links?

I don’t understand why people care if YouTube or other sites make money from our clicks - they wouldn’t exist otherwise.

Either we accept that our data is used to sell us things or we go back to getting information from out of date books and heavily edited sources such as newspapers. When I say ‘our data is used’ that doesn’t mean that an evil genius is rubbing his hands whilst forming a picture of our personal lives to use against us in some way. Yes, Google knows that I wear certain brands, I enjoy cooking and knitting and probably my political affiliations. But they don’t have a picture of ‘me’ - just that they know which IP address (my online identifier) to use to target ads for those things, which I can ignore if I’m not interested. You can switch off trackers on Amazon and Facebook etc, but you still get ads - they are just for things you don’t want . Try it - it’s amusing for a day or so, but you get sick of ads for gym equipment and smelly candles when you might prefer Masai dresses and knitting needles.

Why would people provide search engines like Google or entertainment/information sources like YouTube free? They cost ££££ to run and keep up to date, and are businesses not charities. The price we pay for being connected to the world online is that we are targeted as consumers.

I don’t see that as sinister, and would rather have information sources monitored by commercial enterprises than by government, as they are in places like China.

Oh, and newspapers made money from ads too - it’s nothing new.

One of the reasons I like Gransnet is because other people know about lots of things I don’t, and I want to broaden my horizons so I do use the links provided they look legitimate, from news sites etc. I’d be upset if links weren’t posted, it would mean Gransnet becomes just a chat site, which isn’t for me. To manage my iPad (Apple have good security anyway), I just go into my settings and delete the cookies.

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk guidelines.

I haven't noticed anything being "pushed in my face".
If you have issues with what's being posted, speak to GNHQ about it.
If you hope that just being "spiky" will get others to do as you want, you are being silly.

I know the guidelines firebird, if you have concerns that they are being broken then you should report.
I am guessing this is 'not in the spirit of GN' as its discussing a specific poster.

Who is promoting their own threads? Or 'cross-promoting threads'?

I thought that this was a serious discussion, but it's starting to look like paranoia.

Yes, people make money out of 'the way our data is shared', but you seem to be suggesting that this is more sinister than it is, and linking it to 'hacking' and virus-spreading. It isn't.

A question - who do you suggest should pay for our internet access? do you think that the millions of people employed in servicing websites should work for no pay, and if not, where is the money to pay them going to come from? Or should we be charged to access places like Gransnet (or YouTube, or Google or anywhere)?

I'd be interested to hear how you think our freedom to surf for fun, for information, for shopping, banking, staying in contact with others - all the things we use it for - should be funded.

I haven't even noticed repeated links to one site.
I'd like to ask for an example but obviously that would be silly! ?

I don’t think I have seen you on here before Firebird978. Are you new to Gransnet? I haven’t noticed any of the threads you describe. I don’t post a lot of links and when I do I generally use tinyurl to avoid long strings of numbers. I also state clearly the nature of the link.

Galaxy

I know the guidelines firebird, if you have concerns that they are being broken then you should report.
I am guessing this is 'not in the spirit of GN' as its discussing a specific poster.

Ah. It is becoming clear.

Is there a specific poster who posts a lot of links? If so, has that poster been targeted by spiteful posts before, and could this be an attempt to spoil a thread that the poster is enjoying?

Right.

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I started a thread with a you tube link. It was to Joni Mitchell at the Newport Folk Festival. It was something which I enjoyed and I thought others might have missed.
Of course your internet history is used to try and decide what sort of a person you are and what can be sold to you. So arguably by clicking on few links, only using a few sites and limiting your net use you are playing right into their hands. They have you classified as X who likes Y1 and Y2. Whereas if you click quite randomly and look at lots of different things it's harder to pigeon hole you.
I suppose you all know that if 2 people type in a question the sites which come up as answers will probably differ completely and be in a different order for each of them.

Sometimes and sometimes not. If I know there will be lots of links I don’t want to follow, I just pass by. I appreciate the copied and pasted text when an article is behind a paywall. It makes me laugh when something I’ve clicked on leads to a flood of adverts for the same thing even though I’ve tried selecting the ‘no tracking’ method. A search for bush trimmers for my gardening friend brought some unexpected results.

Firebird978

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Hmm.

I repeat then - who would pay for our web use if we didn't get targeted by ads.

As Glorianna says, algorithms can be used to very precisely target people by spending trends, political interests, membership of groups and all sorts of things. It is extremely sophisticated but it is not used to target 'Doodledog of Hometown, who votes Raving Loony, eats caviar and drives a red VW campervan to potholing holidays in Borneo'. Someone wanting to sell me potholing gear might pay to get access so that they can stick relevant ads on my news feeds, but nobody is going to knock on my door trying to sell a bag full of crampons. I am no more likely to get hacked (whatever you mean by that) than anyone else, or get a virus.

I agree that what you believe to be 'over-linking' is a separate issue, so why link that to the suggestion that links are dangerous? Unless you are targeting a particular poster, that is? That would be a flagrant abuse of talk guidelines, wouldn't it?

If you have reported the things you have seen Firebird that's surely enough?

Blossoming - I deliberately ^don't* use tinyurl so that people have an idea where they are linked to.

The thing about adverts is interesting isnt it. It's actually the use of adverts which enables websites/podcasts with different/alternative views to survive. I may vehemently disagree with some of the views on the podcasts but I think there is a case for saying that advertising enables more freedom of speech.

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NotSpaghetti, I always tell people where the link is going. I’m not daft

Firebird978

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Well all you need to do is to say it.

There's no need to dress it up with faux concern about people's online security, is there?

That's not all you are saying - you are saying it's so wrong that it should be stopped.

I don't care how many links anyone posts, provided they do it in good faith to give information or enjoyment.
It's up to me and everyone else whether we look at them or not.

Galaxy

The thing about adverts is interesting isnt it. It's actually the use of adverts which enables websites/podcasts with different/alternative views to survive. I may vehemently disagree with some of the views on the podcasts but I think there is a case for saying that advertising enables more freedom of speech.

Absolutely. That's what I was getting at before I realised the real purpose of this thread.

People get scared at the idea that their data is being collected, and put like that, with no context it sounds scary. But when you realise that huge amounts of data is collected about huge amounts of people and that the purpose is to send ads for paint to those who are searching for decorators or wallpaper and so on, not to round up everyone who has ever posted that Boris Johnson tells lies, it is put into perspective. And when you ask yourself if you'd rather pay per search (or for login onto sites) or just scroll past ads it can put a different perspective again.

Firebird978 the GN guidelines you quoted refer to frequent links to a poster's own site.
I haven't seen that happening.
If you have seen it happening, report it.

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Doodledog

Firebird978

Quotes deleted post

Well all you need to do is to say it.

There's no need to dress it up with faux concern about people's online security, is there?

Sorry - I was multi-tasking and skim read your post.

It's not for me (or you) to say what is excessive. I open links all the time, and surf happily all over the net. I may be tempting fate to say this, but I her never had my data security breached in any way serious enough for me to be aware of it.

If you don't like a thread, or a poster, just ignore it/them. Setting out to spoil their enjoyment of a thread is just nasty. There is no need for it, and assuming that we are all too dim to notice what you are doing is offensive to the rest of us, too.

MN is well known for refusing to deal with certain companies. And some companies refuse to deal with MN which always makes me smile.