Gransnet forums

Chat

Dilemma

(75 Posts)
WadesNan Mon 31-Oct-22 13:22:50

A few months ago I had some work done on my house. I was very pleased with the result and the workmanship was excellent. However, the tradesman was an out and out racist. He blames "foreigners" for everything that is wrong with the country - unaware that I was married to a "foreigner" for over 40 years. I told him I disagreed with his views and didn't want to discuss it with him - but that didn't stop him!

I now want to have more work done and have been asking around for recommendations, unfortunately, everyone recommends this man. They all agree with me about his views but mainly deal with it by remaining in a different room.

1. I don't want to have to hide away in my own home and
2. I am reluctant to give work to someone whose views I find so obnoxious

So, should I employ him for the quality of his work and try to ignore his comments or employ someone else and risk having inferior work done

Luckygirl3 Wed 02-Nov-22 13:27:07

Find someone else. If all his clients did this and told him why, then he might get the message and lose custom. His views are obnoxious but he could just keep his mouth shut - there is no need to inflict it on others.

mayisay Wed 02-Nov-22 13:23:48

I'm going to throw a real spanner in the works here!
Maybe the tradesman you employed holds racist views, because for many years now, eastern European tradesmen have been undercutting British tradesmen, taking their livelihoods away. I believe it's been a real struggle for many trying to make an honest living.
However, I wholeheartedly agree that racist views are totally unacceptable in your own home.

Maremia Wed 02-Nov-22 13:16:50

Yes, you know the answer to your question. You asked him to stop spouting his vile views, and so you were not 'collaborating' with them. He didn't stop, and therefore added misogyny to his crimes.
However, if you do employ him again, you will have betrayed the memory of your husband, and yes, that would be compliance/collaboration of the tradesman's racism, and the bullying of yourself. Best of luck finding a substitute.
For those GNs who feel it doesn't matter how a worker feels about racism and other issues, as long as they get on with the job, have a look at today's newspaper reports on the state of play in the Police force, despite the warnings of 'institutional racism' decades ago.

00mam00 Wed 02-Nov-22 13:07:17

If you employ someone else and the bigot hears about it and questions you, you can quite rightly say that now you know his views you felt he wouldn’t be happy working for someone from a mixed race marriage.

JLR1220 Wed 02-Nov-22 12:53:41

Well, you answered your own question. You gave 2 very good reasons for not hiring him. You can find a replacement for him if you try harder or simply stay in sight and watch tv or read if you feel the need to supervise. Best of luck.

sodapop Wed 02-Nov-22 12:49:11

I agree with the views expressed by Nemo'sMum other people may well have beliefs we don't share but that is their right. It is not acceptable however to inflict these beliefs on others, I would have told him I don't share his views and would prefer he didn't talk about them in my house.
I can understand that Wadesnan feels strongly about this for personal reasons and is right not to employ this man again.

Soozikinzi Wed 02-Nov-22 12:39:52

Age concern will recommend trades people I believe ? A friend of mine had a gardening business and only worked through Age concern recommendations.

CrazyGrandma2 Wed 02-Nov-22 12:39:18

WadesNan a few years ago we employed a lovely man to do some work for us in the garden. Lovely personality went on and about what a good christian, family man he was. His work was exemplary. I wrote a recommendation for him and was surprised when someone contacted me and asked if I was aware of his public views. They shared his FB post which was the most awful bigoted, racist, homophobic and any other 'ist' you can think of I'd ever read. A quieter mild mannered man you could not have wished to meet. I was staggered!

I immediately removed my recommendation. Personally, however good the workmanship, I could not offer any sort of support to someone who expressed such - to me - obnoxious views.

Yammy Wed 02-Nov-22 12:30:44

GrammyGrammy

I can't believe the outright cowardice and collaboration at work here. Having just binge watched a series on the French and how they worked with the Nazi's against the Jews, you describe how you did not stand up to him. Why did you not tell him to get out immediately? Why did you pay a man who hates other people based on their ethnicity? You were weak and now you would reward this evil man again? At what point do you stand up against evil? Immediately I say, before it spreads and takes charge.

I think you are being very unkind in your remarks. What if wadesnan was in the house on her own and he turned nasty or aggressive? You are duplicating his behaviour in your attitude to wadesnan because you have assumed she is weak.
Hopefully non of us like racism and if we were strong enough tell them what we think. If they are so confident in expounding their views to a stranger maybe they will be confident in lashing out.
She is asking for points of view, not a lecture on anti-Sematism. I have Jewish friends and would defend them when ever I could but not in a house on my own with a racist Bully.
Good luck in finding another tradesman. Just say you would like to try another ,you do not have to give a reason.

Scottiebear Wed 02-Nov-22 12:24:03

I definitely would not want to employ him. He sounds vile. But I think availability of tradesmen varies from area to area. Where I live it's a nightmare trying to find anyone, let alone someone recommended. Recently had bathroom work done. So Most fitters were saying they couldn't take on any more work at the moment. Some promised to get back to me and never did. It wasn't an urgent job so we eventually got it done with a very long wait. So long as you can wait then hopefully you should find someone.

biglouis Wed 02-Nov-22 12:23:54

I am very much to the right with no apology to anyone.

People are entitled to their own views. What they are not entitled to do is to upset or humiliate others into whose homes they may be invited.

I had two plumbers in my home this morning. I didnt ask them their views on ethnic minorities and they didnt express any. They just got on with the job and then left. If I need more work doing I will call them again without enquiring into their political orientations. Not my circus, not my monkets.

NannaFirework Wed 02-Nov-22 12:16:53

Find someone else please 💔

Tanjamaltija Wed 02-Nov-22 12:13:32

You actually paid him for the time it took him to voimit his spleen. Find someone else. That way, he cannot boast that everyone knows he is racist, but they employ him anyway, because he's the best. I'd feel sick if he crossed my stoop again.

sandelf Wed 02-Nov-22 12:08:19

As you are not happy to have him in your home there is no choice but to find Mr A N Other. Does he have online presence? Perhaps anonymously you could say that despite his good work you felt unable to employ him again as he did not respect your wish to keep off racist talk.

NemosMum Wed 02-Nov-22 12:04:24

Why are you having conversations with your tradesman anyway? He's got a job to do, and if he's wasting it hanging around talking to you, he's not doing it, don't employ him. However, if he does a good job, and it's you who is making conversation, then you know what to do. He may well have views that you don't like, but make yourself 'busy'. There's a lot of virtue-flag waving on this site! If he says anything gratuitously racist to you, just say: "Well, I don't agree with you", but don't continue the discussion. To those who say they wouldn't employ a racist, how do you know? If it was the surgeon doing your life-saving cancer/heart op, would you have sent them a questionnaire first, just to make sure they shared your political outlook? I think not!

GoldenAge Wed 02-Nov-22 12:04:23

WadesNan - how is this a dilemma for you - someone who has been married to a 'foreigner' for many years? If you give this man a platform to air his racist views in your home and don't challenge him you're colluding, you're a collaborator. Not knowing his views is one thing, but knowing he's a racist is quite another. You will find another tradesperson if you look hard enough. I once had a man fitting a cat flap into a door of a house I had recently bought and which had had all its original features stripped away. I had some Polish builders in to renovate and the cat flap man complimented me on the work saying it was rare to see such workmanship these days. Then he started on about the influx of foreign workers and all the usual rubbish and I quickly pointed out that he had not long before commented that my renovation was quite out of the ordinary and then dropped the bombshell that it was the work and design of 'foreigners'. I told him he could leave the cat flap half finished if he couldn't keep his racist views to himself. And that if he did a poor job I would publicise it. He finished the job and on leaving apologise for 'upsetting me'. You have to call out racism however much it may be uncomfortable, otherwise you're acquiescing and by implication, supporting it.

undines Wed 02-Nov-22 11:51:29

No way.
There will be someone else
Toxic views
Very rude to you
How dare he! people like that need to be shown boundaries - and the door! You deserve better and there is sure to be someone out there.

harrysgran Wed 02-Nov-22 11:46:57

I wouldn't feel comfortable with him in my home having such racist views.

madmum38 Wed 02-Nov-22 11:42:39

Have you a local nextdoor group you can join? There will be tradesmen advertising but you could ask a wider range of people for recommendations, ours always have people that have had work done and only to willing to pass on their thoughts.
They are nice groups just for community chit chat as well.
Good luck

Sago Wed 02-Nov-22 11:40:51

GrammyGrammy That’s very harsh!

The OP is asking for advice, once someone is in your home and work has started it’s a difficult situation.

I would ask him to quote but tell him firmly and politely that you share very different views and you felt uncomfortable.

I have had numerous good tradesmen, I have no idea of their political views because I would never allow the conversation to progress to such a point.

GrammyGrammy Wed 02-Nov-22 11:33:33

I can't believe the outright cowardice and collaboration at work here. Having just binge watched a series on the French and how they worked with the Nazi's against the Jews, you describe how you did not stand up to him. Why did you not tell him to get out immediately? Why did you pay a man who hates other people based on their ethnicity? You were weak and now you would reward this evil man again? At what point do you stand up against evil? Immediately I say, before it spreads and takes charge.

Amalegra Wed 02-Nov-22 11:32:28

I call racism out whenever I find it. I would certainly not tolerate someone in my home who was such an ignorant bigot. There are some great ideas here for finding an equally good contractor. If we allow this cancer to be acceptable in our society we will all be infinitely the poorer for it.

DeeDe Wed 02-Nov-22 11:23:04

Mmm well if you do have him again, point out it’s your husband a (((foreigner))) paying him
Personally I wouldn’t use him again, and hand him money surly there must be another reliable workman around.

Spice101 Tue 01-Nov-22 11:10:06

I'd find another tradesman, but how do you know the new one would not have similar or equally unacceptable views?

biglouis Tue 01-Nov-22 10:49:01

Most of the trades I use are local people from various ethnic groups (I live in a very diverse area) and I dont give a damn about their views as long as they do the work to a professional standard. There are "ways of speaking" in a brisk clipped tone which discourage chit chat. Learned from many years of managing customers and client groups.

I leave tradesmen to get on with the work. I have a business to run so I go into my office and leave them to it. I usually direct them to where tea/coffee/cold drinks/the toilet are located and tell them to help themselves if they want a drink. That way they will finish sooner and be gone. I always ask up front how long they expect the job to take which is a pretty broad hint that I want them gone asap. Well regarded self employed trades tend to be backed up with work so dont have time to chat.