Neopronouns

Maybe stop speaking for her now, you don't seem to know each other all that well and you don't seem in a position to alleviate any of her stress or worry

No but a gender critical belief is. MN delete anything discriminatory if reported same as GN.

It wouldnt help her they have told her. That's what she was talking about.

Discrimination is not protected under the equality act

MN will be fine. Gender critical belief is protected under law so there are legal protections available in terms of their ability to discuss the subject.

Galaxy

The people responsible for helping her to understand. What on earth are you talking about. Shes an adult woman, with a career etc she doesnt need anyone to help her understand.

The first answer was in reply to the discussion about neurodivergent children. The second was a direct reply to you.
Nothing about anyone helping her.

But the question remains if you really want to help your friend why wouldn't you say 'Just ask" if she is worried about using the wrong pronoun?

Galaxy

I have no idea if she is gender critical or not. We dont discuss that issue. Its possible to be uncomfortable with pronouns without being gender critical. Remembering that someone always should be referred to as they is stressful for her. I listen to her, she can manage her own decisions on this she doesn't need me to tell her how to behave.

Sorry but you have reasoned yourself into a dead end at this point and it's all a bit contradictory

glorianny yes it's only a small drop in a complicated language

Gagajo a lot of mainstream platforms have removed groups and forums where people were actively discriminating, mumsnet has much fewer community guidelines but that's probably subject to change at some point

I have no idea if she is gender critical or not. We dont discuss that issue. Its possible to be uncomfortable with pronouns without being gender critical. Remembering that someone always should be referred to as they is stressful for her. I listen to her, she can manage her own decisions on this she doesn't need me to tell her how to behave.

galaxy

So your friend who is part of the LGBTQ community and is happy to share her beliefs on sex and gender with you:

Has stress and anxiety about referring to members of her own community

Does not have any idea you share beliefs in common

Cannot alleviate any stress or anxiety by simply using gender neutral pronouns which are in common use

Cannot get any real empathy or understanding from you despite your shared beliefs and friendship

I'm struggling to understand your reasoning here

VioletSky

No idea

My autistic daughter has no such issues

What are the beliefs of those discussing it on mumsnet? Could be a factor

I know you don't want to discuss trans issues, but given that pronoun use and trans / non binary issues can be linked and that Mumsnet is well known for it's hostility to trans issues, it seems fairly obvious why they'd have very firm opinions on the matter.

(Apologies for the poor sentence construction there!)

The people responsible for helping her to understand. What on earth are you talking about. Shes an adult woman, with a career etc she doesnt need anyone to help her understand.

Galaxy

So if its he for a woman for example my friend knows that's not true. The other pronouns it's a constant monitoring of your own speech which can be uncomfortable.

But it is always "she" for a woman. No matter how masculine you may imagine she looks.
And actually all your friend needs to do is ask politely "which pronoun do you prefer?" Then she knows and doesn't have to worry.

My son is severely dyslexic. He has no problems with using preferred pronouns. Probably because having grown up with a hidden disability he is always conscious that you need to be respectful to the person, and never pre-judge ,or decide on abilities, or any other factor, until you really know and understand the person.

I think attributing misunderstandings to anyone who is neurodivergent indicates an inability to recognise that people who come under this umbrella are as different from each other as any other group of people, and using their disability as a way of trying to project your own prejudices onto a subject is about as low as you can go.

If they have problems with pronouns perhaps it is because the people responsible for helping them to understand are failing to do so. I wonder why?

So if its he for a woman for example my friend knows that's not true. The other pronouns it's a constant monitoring of your own speech which can be uncomfortable.

Knowing what's not true?

Let her sounds weird. She doesnt need my permission

Knowing it's not true I think. I just let her talk about it.

What is she specifically finding stressful then?

She doesnt need that kind of explanation, she is part of the LGBTQ community.

Sorry your friend, my head immediately went to child

I wouldn't want a friend to be stressed or anxious if I could help them

Lucca

Yes they do. I would listen to a valid argumeng but you basically just said "you are wrong"

galaxy

Blimey

Because I can teach 4 year olds all their sounds and all about digraphs and split digraphs and trigraphs while simultaneously teaching them all the ways phonics is absolutely illogical nonsense

There is a whole long list of words that cannot be sounded out at all and must be learned by sight.

Then there are sounds that sound completely different to each other. Examples:

th. Thistle and Then
oo. Look and food

There are many more, the entirety of which is completely illogical and ridiculous but that's literally the first step before we get anywhere near adverbials and extended noun phrases and they all get it, autistic children included unless they are non verbal.

Pronouns in gender neutral form or in the singular or plural do not seem to compare.

I'd explain to that child that, they are like names and nicknames which are also individual, some people prefer different pronouns and it might be difficult to remember or we might make mistakes but that's OK. Which is absolutely nothing to do with teaching anything about LGBTQ people

My close friend has autism, she was talking the other day about the stress/anxiety she feels around the use of pronouns, she has no idea of my views on the subject.

VioletSky

Sorry Lucca

There is no explanation for your disagreement so I'm not changing my mind on this one

Especially as a lot of my family are fluent in French

And do they have to teach French ? Or German ? Or Italian!

Thanks for not listening or even considering another POV

I've never had any issue either and I'm not neurotypical

I'm surprised it would be a struggle as they aren't mangled as many have explained and have long been in use.

As I've told you many times my personal opinions and my job are seperate and that is the case for everyone jn education that I personally know

We only indoctrinate children with the curriculum in as holistic a way as possible

My older children have been taught nothing about pronouns or LGTBQ in 2 secondary schools

Lot of fuss about nothing I expect