What is a lesbian?

Google "science behind trans" and read for yourself, many articles available

Many articles are available about the science behind 5G, or vaccine conspiracies, too. I'm not sure what that proves.

The equality act protects those beliefs and I respect the equality act

Using those beliefs to do harm or dictate to others however is not protected and may be challenged

Actually, I haven't told a single person what they "should believe" and have only challenged their rights to put their beliefs as more important than the beliefs of others

Why do you assume that when someone is stating a fact that it's being judgemental Fleurpepper?

You're doing it again VS saying that an opinion that differs to yours is "dictating". TBF the desire to dictate what others should believe seems to be coming from those who are accusing others of dictating what can and cannot be believed.

If there were to be a dating event for lesbians and trans women then it would be advertised as such. It would only follow that trans women would be included if they were included in the invitation; they weren't. The subject of this thread is a lesbian speed dating event for lesbians, not for lesbians and trans women.

Fleur I am not sure but I would guess it is some sort of old instinct that kicks in

There are bad things in this world, that's for sure and sometimes we need to examine that bad to keep ourselves safe

But any kind of using that bad to taint a whole demographic is wrong

There is so much beauty in the world and so many good people who deserve to live and love without judgement

VioletSky

Fleur our thoughts went the exact same way then

Emphasis on individual

As said, I don't 'get it'. I am a straight heterosexual woman. It is not up to me so judge, to put people in little boxes with labels. I listen, I try to understand, best I can, and empathise. Why do some people see others being different, in so many individual ways, as such a threat?

Fleur our thoughts went the exact same way then

Emphasis on individual

I believe that there are laws in place to protect women only spaces and if they were necessary they should have been used

Also lesbians attending the events should be treated as the individuals they are. If some of them date trans women then it would follow that trans women can be included with the caveat that they are transparent and everyone knows where they stand

Smileless2012

At the risk of going around in ever decreasing circles Fleurpepper a trans woman cannot be a lesbian because they are male. They cannot change sex and lesbianism is the attraction too, and relationship between women.

this is so genetically- fact. Makes no difference. If someone has made full transition, given up all their male traits and 'attributes' and acquired female ones- then it is not up to you, or up to me, or anyone else, to decide if they can be lesbians or not. And up to individual lesbians to decide if they want to have relationships, sexual or otherwise, casually or in a long-term relationship, to decide.

It is actually quite simple, really.

Many lesbians disagree with you

Their beliefs will not be dictated to them by you and yours and no one gets to tell a lesbian they aren't a lesbian because they are with a trans woman... How can you not see how wrong that is?

Google "science behind trans" and read for yourself, many articles available

VioletSky

They got reported, nothing came of it though

Really?

Do you believe
males should be granted the freedom to attend lesbian meetings where they have specifically not been been invited?
Do you believe all male lies are acceptable or only those perpetrated by TW?

Thank you Doodledog. I wont be silenced by ridiculous accusations which add nothing to the discussion.

Where is the scientific evidence that a man can change sex and become a woman VS? Gender dysphoria is the belief that a person's sex doesn't match their gender and has nothing to do with stating that a trans woman cannot be a lesbian by virtue of being male.

That, is a biological fact.

They got reported, nothing came of it though

VS 🤣🤣
None of my comments have gone from this thread because of one simple truth:

Nobody can be bothered to report them.

Do you believe
males should be granted the freedom to attend lesbian meetings where they have specifically not been been invited?

At the risk of going around in ever decreasing circles Fleurpepper a trans woman cannot be a lesbian because they are male. They cannot change sex and lesbianism is the attraction too, and relationship between women.

VioletSky

Again Smileless that is not for you to say, you cannot speak for all lesbians and given the scientific evidence to the contrary and the existence of gender dysphoria... Your "facts" are just the ones you subscribe too which doesn't make you right on many levels

Smileless is not 'speaking for all lesbians'. She is giving her opinion, which is all any of us can do. Can you show how she is even trying to speak for anyone other than herself, please?

Trying to silence her with these ridiculous accusations could be seen as bullying. Another poster has already left because of that sort of behaviour - are you trying to pick us all off with it?

None of my comments have gone from this thread because of one simple truth:

I say what I say, not what people assign to me or what they try to twist it to mean

I am not going to bother answering attempts to do either, as you can see on this thread

The first sentence of my previous post should read 'One of the things that is taught to people studying RM at a very basic level. . .'

It may not alter the sense too much, but it is annoying me as it is.

Oh come on Glorianny, you actually quote Mollygo's post and then ask "How is deciding to transition untruthful?" when we can all see that she didn't say anything of the kind.

One of the things that is taught at a very basic level to those studying research methods is that self-reporting has to be treated with caution when it comes to surveys.

As an example, Margaret Thatcher (or one of her ministers) commissioned a survey into the sexual behaviour of the British public in the wake of the AIDS epidemic which was of grave concern at the time (in the 80s). The initial results suggested that the average Brit was engaging in very risky activity, and contradicted numerous previously accepted research findings about things like fidelity, the percentage of people in same-sex relationships and the number of partners people had at a given time. Mrs Thatcher cancelled the survey, as she felt that it was 'prurient' and that people were not answering honestly.

This was alarming when it came to future planning for HIV/AIDS, but when the survey was scrutinised it became clear that the respondents had come forward in response to a call for people willing to participate, rather than being a representative sample of the British population, which would skew the results unless a way could be found to allow for the fact that anyone offering to discuss their sex life is perhaps more likely to be more sexually 'adventurous' than people who preferred to keep such information to themselves.

It can, of course, be difficult to find people who are both 'typical' and willing to discuss intimate details of their private lives, so all surveys into areas such as sexuality have to be treated with caution.

Gay men who transitioned are liars. You said that not me.

Only females are lesbians. Are you saying that men become female?

I’m not getting into an argument with you over males lying as you would promptly report me.

If they are not harming females, cheating by claiming to be something they’re not or lying to get themselves in female safe spaces, I have no issue with trans.

As I have asked many times before, do you accept or support all male lies or only when you’re supporting trans?

Smileless2012

No Fleurpepper, they're not.

I am sorry, but I know that some are.

Who are you, or me, or anyone else, to tell them they are dishonest. I know for a fact, that some lesbians are totally happy to have relationships, including sexual, with transwomen who have chosen to be give up their male traits and sexuality, and sexually and emotionally function fully as females.

I don't get it. But who cares that I don't understand it. If they do, and if they are comfortable with it- I won't insist on putting them back in a small little box with a neat label, or judge them

Again Smileless that is not for you to say, you cannot speak for all lesbians and given the scientific evidence to the contrary and the existence of gender dysphoria... Your "facts" are just the ones you subscribe too which doesn't make you right on many levels

I'm aware that there are trans women identifying as lesbians VS but they aren't, and saying so isn't forcing a belief on them, it's a fact regardless of how they feel and/or what they claim.

Of course we are all entitled to be attracted to who ever we choose but that is not what's being discussed here. Lesbians are entitled to attend a speed dating event for lesbians with no trans women in attendance.

As Mollygo's posted, men in relationships with other men are gay, regardless of whether one of or both has trans gendered because they were, are and remain male.

The organiser sadly tried to achieve something using unacceptable methods, which is why she has been called transphobic.
Had she merely asked for ,or arranged an event without transwomen she would have been legally entitled to. However in the course of doing this she used two images which are unacceptable to the transcommunity, one the person in lycra and the other an assault by a transwoman in the loo. (And yes I know they were both real). She used the worse stereotypes to justify her request, so indicating that this is how transwomen generally behave. It was transphobic to do so.
Can you point ut to those images please? The article in the OP tells us that the fact that these things had happened in the past had led her to point out that 'if you are not a woman you are not a lesbian', but I can see no images or references to images in the article - maybe you have read a different one, in which case it would be helpful to point to it, so that any information is available to all on the thread.

Sorry to be picky, but there are repeated cases of what appear to be blatant misinformation, twisting of people's words and false accusations on this thread (I apologise in advance if I am missing something) and it is important that we are talking about things that actually happened, not what you 'consider' to have happened.

Speaking of which - I note that there has been no link to the change in the EA either - was that another example of something that didn't happen? Telling us to Google it (the FOFO method so beloved of those who are talking about things they don't understand) is pointless if it didn't happen. If I asked people to google the Martians that have landed on Hampstead Heath (Analogy Alert - they haven't!!) then of course they wouldn't be able to find anything. That wouldn't mean that they were rubbish at basic research, or that I have a superior knowledge to them - it would mean that nothing is out there for them to find.

www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2010/15/2022-01-27

The above is rather turgid, but I would have thought that if the changes you report had happened they would be referenced here, but I can't find them. That may be my fault - I am still shaking off Covid - but as you are so well-versed in this particular aspect of the EA that you have quoted it many times on here, perhaps you could help me out (and the others who are unable to find it either)?