Children/Grandchildr en

Tiley

I know there are people on here who never had children, me included through choice and have never regretted this decision. What fascinates me is the amount of grandparents that are run ragged looking after their grandkids. I was chatting to a lady up the road the other day and she said how exhausted she was caring for 2 of them, one she has to take to and from school whilst having the young one all day 5 days a week. Their parents are in really good jobs but won't employ a nanny and seems like they expect Mum to do it as a duty. Has anyone else felt like this.

I suppose people do as they wish. Some are exhausted and run ragged by GC, but that is by choice. "No thank you" and "I'm sure you can figure this out without me" are really nice ways to remove oneself.

I don't/won't watch GC/GGC on a regular basis. Ask me politely for one-off childcare. If not, I'd be annoyed, our daughters entitled. No thank you.

We raised our children, our children are raising theirs. I'm happy.

I became a Granny just as I was about to retire at 66. Unfortunately I don't live close by, though I hope eventually to move nearer, but I said that even if I did live nearer I wouldn't do regular childcare but would help with emergencies. This year I had my first experience of looking after my grandson alone, who was 3 and a half at the time. His nursery was closing for the week before Easter so they needed childcare for 3 days while both parents were still working. Fortunately his baby sister was still going to her childminder so I was able to take my GS out for age appropriate activities. We had a bus trip to the park as I knew he probably wouldn't manage to walk there and back and I'm certainly not up to carrying him. Then the next day we caught a bus to a nearby town to go to the cinema. I hope to have similar opportunities again but as I'm nearly 70 now I know my limitations. I feel like I've missed out on having a close relationship with him as he was a lockdown baby and lived abroad for the 1st 2 years. He can be challenging to do things with if his mum is around so she went out to work while I had him, although she could have worked at home, otherwise he'd have interupted her for everything rather than let me do things with him and for him. I'm hoping to have a closer relationship with his sister as she is less demanding of her mum's attention.
On my most recent visit for my GD's birthday celebration, when both Grannys were present, to distinguish between us my GS started to call me 'Bekah Granny'. Bekah is his Auntie, who he adores, so I feel that by associating me with her (my DD) he is feeling more of a relationship with me. I do slightly envy the GPs who live close by and see their GC regularly, but I know I couldn't cope with full time childcare even if I lived next door!

In Scotland we have a thing called kinship caring, and in my work in Early Years I came across grandparents who took their grandchildren in because the alternative was them going into local authority care. Invariably the grandparents were struggling as full time carers, and sadly there was little support from Social Services. I know I would definitely struggle with more than occasional childcare.

In a previous genration when mothers didn't work, then yes, parents, or rather mothers, were expected to care for the children, but once both parents work - often have to work, then the dynamic changes.

I went back to work when my younger child was 4 1/2. Since both sets of parents lived 60 miles away, I didn't have parents to help out, nor was there any kind of paid care, nurseries, after schoolclubs etc etc. But I managed.

My children were brought up by DH and me. They stayed with grandparents for the love of it. Not because we were working. And my son had carried on that way.
. We often had our GDs for a weekend, or a week, as we live by the seaside. We had lovely ,memorable times. It was not a duty, and never expected.

I think it partly depends on the age of the GC and the age of the grandparents. In my 50s I started helping with my baby GS who is now a teenager. Hand on heart, those were some of the best days of my life. We are still close although of course I don't have to look after him any more. I would love go back and do it all again. Grandparents can bring a different perspective to children's lives. As a parent I was busy with work as well as looking after the children. As a grandmother I have more patience and obviously more time.

GraceOMalley I think most of us would hope to do as you have done. 'needs must' is very different to many grandparents faced with children's expectations that grandparents will provide chid care.

We have lived to far from our grandchildren to provide care (200 miles), but when DGC were both under 5 our DDiL was provisionally diagnosed with a progressive illness and DH and I agreed that if the worst happened we would sell up and move from the area we had live in for nearly 50years to provide the care and back up the family needed. Thankfully the diagnosis was changed and she had remained in good health since. I will be honest it was a real relief when we realised we could stay where we are still.

In many ways I think 'needs must' caring is the most demanding and difficult and the grandparents who take this on, as you have, are unsung heroes. Often, like you, you have responsibility for GC for the whole of their childhood and often have to take all the grandchildren into your care.

Just read your post Metra that is so hard for you. What if you rang them and told them how sad you are ? They might still be funny towards you but at least you would know you tried your best. Perhaps you have already done this, that’s the trouble with forums online, you don’t really get the full picture. 💐

One thing that interests me - why do people have children and then expect their own parents to look after them?

Grannie314

Just curious, if you never had children or grandchildren, why are you on this list-serve?

As a non parent/grandparent it's interesting to read other views. All of our friends have children with whom we have got on well, perhaps because we have not treated them as children. Furthermore friends have welcomed our opinions when things have gone wrong. Sometimes parents/GPs are a bit obsessive.

Tiley I do wonder why people have children and grandparents end up doing a lot of the parenting. I had 3 children (including twins) and never have thought either GPs could be carers other than occasional babysitting. I had hoped to have two children, thought I could manage two, physically and financially. Having 3 did stretch everything but we managed. No way were GPs included in the equation. Children were my and DHs responsibility. If I couldn't afford them, I wouldn't have had them, just the same as a high end car or house.

metra - that is so sad

I'd love it. If I had the chance.

I wish! 😞

grandtanteJE65 How is childcare in Denmark funded. I did a bit of googling and found this on one site

Nurseries and kindergartens in Denmark are subject to user payment. Prices and discounts are stated by the municipality's placement service. Prices may vary, but parents pay no more than 25% of the costs of the nursery or kindergarten care.

If this was the case in the UK, I am sure that far fewer grandparents would be providing childcare. Average weekly costs for child care vary from £260-£430 a week. Broadly north of the Watford Gap the charge will be up to £300. South of that and it will be well over £300 a week. These fees have to be paid in full by parents and for those on median and lower incomes, especially if you have more than one child can be unaffordable. This is why sp many grandparents do so much child care.

We had care of our only grandson for two days a week from him being around six months old until he left junior school. It was a joy and a great privilege to have played a part in his formative years. Was it hard work? Often. Was it fun? Always! If I was fit enough, would I do it again? In a heartbeat.

This seems to be a very British thing - in Denmark most people send their pre-school children first to a creche or day-care and then to kindergarten, as grandparents are usually either still working, as you cannot retire before 67 and most people now are working until they are 69, or live too far away to be able to look after their grandchildren.

Do nannies still exist in the UK - they were only for the super-rich in my Scottish childhood in the 1950s and here you would need to be in the absolute highest income bracket to afford one - if indeed you could find a nanny.

I would be happy to help out with child-care, but not to look after my own or others' grandchildren five days a week. I retired in able to take the remainder of my life easier, not to take on a full-time job of any kind.

I don’t have grandchildren yet but when my DC were born and I wanted to return to work 2 days a week , my mother said she was happy to babysit and help out in emergencies but she didn’t want to do regular childcare as she and my DF had just retired and wanted to travel and do their own thing and See their friends. Which I respected and I’m so glad they had that time together because my DF died aged 70. And my DM has lovely memories and has close friends .
My DP did do childcare during the school holidays and my now AC have wonderful memories of days out or just chilling at home with my parents. My AC are also very close to my DM and visit and call regularly .
Like many things it’s a balance between having time for yourself, holidays and a social life and helping your children and grandchildren and having wonderful memories of those times .

Ah Metra, that is so sad for you and your grandchild to being prevented from having a relationship.
I’m fortunate my 2GC live near me so I see them often. I pick up my GS from school one day and have my GD two days a week until she starts school in September. I know I am very lucky and wouldn’t want to miss this opportunity for the world, in fact they are my world. I do have time for my hobbies too as I am retired now.
Sending you a 🤗 and x

I'll be 75 next month. I have 14 grandchildren & 5 great grandchildren. 2 of my grandchildren, now aged 31 & 26, have lived with me under a court order for 16 years. I am battling to get residence of their 13 & 11 year old (half) siblings now as their father neglects them & their mother (my daughter) has severe mental health problems. Yes, it is extremely hard work , particularly as I have COPD & Osteoarthritis. But I would do the same in a heartbeat for any of my D GC or DGGC.

I looked after my first grandson as my daughter decided to go to university and train as a midwife. I loved caring for him he was a lovely boy. We do a bit of child care for two other grandchildren, but only now and then.

I was lucky enough to I have wonderful grandparents, I cherish the memories I have of them.💜
I am lucky enough to have three wonderful grandchildren.
We have enjoyed every minute of being grandparents, ( I can speak for my DH)
💜
I was lucky enough to be with my daughter when she gave birth to our first grandchild.

I was born maternal.

I have several family members throughout several generations, who have not for whatever reason had any children of their own.
Each one of them has lived or are leading very full lives.

We all ride the storms and navigate our lives differently.

I had no family close when my daughter was born. My MIL came for a two month visit from S Africa, staying with us and said she would be delighted to take care of her 6 month old only grandchild. I asked her are you absolutely sure about this. Oh yes, I can't wait. I took a three week position 10-6 Monday to Friday. By the Wednesday of the first week she was tired of the baby and wanted to go shopping and see friends (she was 60) saying 'You don't expect me to do this do you'. I had signed up and couldn't alter or cancel my work commitment. I had to bundle up my daughter and drive 200 miles to leave her with my parents as no other child care was available. A fortnight later I did the journey again to collect my girl. S Africa Grandma wanted to come along as she was bored with London as everyone was too busy to see her. I am grateful to my parents for helping out. I could still quite happily strangle S Africa Grandma but she's dead.

My DD lived with us while studying for a degree along with DGS. I often felt that I was a live in nanny as her social life continued alongside her studies. So evenings we babysat as 'we were home anyway' as well as in the daytime. When DGS was 2 I decided I'd had enough so she enrolled DGS in a nursery but I still had to take and collect most days. Also, he attended a Childminder 2 afternoons again with me doing most of the drop offs and collecting. When the child was 4 we retired and moved 100 miles away to the coast. DD had saved enough for her own house deposit so childcare finally ended. But not completely as she still has the occasional holiday, hen do, weekends away with friends when we are expected to travel and look after the DGS. It's not too bad now as she's found a family member to babysit at a price for her occasional nights out.
If I had my time over again I definitely wouldn't have offered daytime childcare at all as our original agreement for 2 days a week was almost always 5 days and often weekends too.
To anyone else I would say make an agreement on days/times and stick firmly to it unless it's an emergency.

My thoughts too Tiley…..we have five grandchildren, three live less than 10 minutes away and we’ve never been their carers ….we’re their grandparents and not their surrogate parents - and I would also say that the expectation to take on this daytime role from their parents was never considered by us or by their parents. But an old friend of mine who - like us - is in her 80’s now, spent years and years during her 60’s caring for her 3 grandchildren as babies, toddlers, and after school care whilst the parents worked full time. Spending those so called “precious years” literally raising her grandkids left her no time or energy for hobbies, or for the pleasures of socializing with old friends or making new friends, or taking care of her health and - least of all - enjoying life at an easier pace! And now the grandkids are in their 20’s and living their own lives, and her ‘mid life’ children are still working and enjoying weekends breaks and holidays abroad, none of her family seem to be “stepping up to the plate” to offer extra care or company to a very elderly parent and grandparent with health issues, few friends, and long lonely days!