Bus pass and prescriptions?

If pensioners are denied the bus pass (and there is no saying this is even under discussion) what will be gained? They are unlikely to start paying in high numbers, so the buses will either run with fewer passengers or the routes will be cancelled.

Quite apart from the fact that removing the 'silly little things' would be bad for practical reasons, it is not in the interests of any government to make it better for people to be on PC than have an occupational pension. For one thing, PC has to be paid out of the benefits budget, and for another people would just stop paying into the occupational one if they knew that means-testing would take what they had paid for pound for pound. Taking the bus pass and prescriptions from those with occupational pensions to give more to those on PC would be a disastrous move on a number of levels.

Someone said you can use the bus pass in other regions as well - is that right? If so that's great - we could go to the coast :-) I thought it was just in the same council area.

If you’re in England the national pass that people are eligible for at state pension age is valid for all service bus (not coach) travel throughout England from 0930h until 2300h, and at any time over the weekend.

I believe the passes for Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales are even more generous, eg start at 60 and might cover train travel as well?

Excellent post, Doodledog, my husband has just said, what you have posted.

I also can't walk to the bus stop either ha ha (but do have a scooter) - or even get on a bus due to steps, so I might be campaigning for better access on buses, like they have in France - either the entry at kerb level or a lowering ramp where you press a button.

Our local buses have had lowering ramps and no steps for many years. Perhaps this doesn’t apply everywhere?

Maggiemaybe, the passes only allow discounted travel (not free) within a certain radius.
You can use the pass at any time and also on coaches. I have friends who frequently travel with Stagecoach to Edinburgh for free.

We once got caught in a rail strike in Edinburgh and wandered up to the bus station to see if we could catch a bus home to Glasgow.
A Stagecoach driver asked if we were going to Glasgow. Hop on, he said, There are plenty seats.
It cost us £0!

Good to have the coach concession as well, Marydoll. We don’t down here, but we did travel free from Leeds to Whitby on a long distance service bus earlier this year (an interesting 3 and a half hour journey over the moors). And our particular local authority has added on half price local train travel. Every little helps!

Monica, you are advocating helping people on UC, what about the people who do not qualify for it? People who only get the state pension, the wfa, bus pass, and free prescriptions are very much needed, not a luxury. Losing the wfa, will affect a big swathe of pensioners.

Also if you put UC up by £15 a week, only some people will qualify, some pensioners have a small occ pen and pay tax. If they need alot of medication it will be a big chunk out of the money they get.
I honestly think wealthy pensioners should think about people who don't qualify for UC but are only a few pounds over. All they need to do is not tick the box on prescriptions and pay their bus fares, if they feel they do not need it.
I used the wfa for what it is for, it helped me.

Gentleshores. You will be well supported for loss of either.

rafichagran

Monica, you are advocating helping people on UC, what about the people who do not qualify for it? People who only get the state pension, the wfa, bus pass, and free prescriptions are very much needed, not a luxury. Losing the wfa, will affect a big swathe of pensioners.

Also if you put UC up by £15 a week, only some people will qualify, some pensioners have a small occ pen and pay tax. If they need alot of medication it will be a big chunk out of the money they get.
I honestly think wealthy pensioners should think about people who don't qualify for UC but are only a few pounds over. All they need to do is not tick the box on prescriptions and pay their bus fares, if they feel they do not need it.
I used the wfa for what it is for, it helped me.

I am confused. Pensioners do not get UC , they get Pesnion Credit.

Once again you completely misunderstand what I have said. All pensioners on the old variable pension are entitled to PC. How the rules affect those on the new enhanced standard pensions. I do not know, but they are already getting more than most pensioners, who are on the old scheme.

There is a prescription season ticket available for £114.50 a year, which means no one needs to pay more than that no matter how much medication they are on.

If we take everything it amounts to an increase on PC level of £23.58 [£2 (prescriptions) + £15(free bus passes) + £6 (WFA) + 20p (Christnas bonus)]. Most bus companies will then almosy definitely offer their own senior travel cards for reduced prices off peak, just as the railways do.

PC level, this year would go up tfrom £218 to, roughly £242, which would mean that large rise in those claiming it and getting all its contingent benefits as well.

No scheme is ever perfect. Pehaps people could try thinking constructively about other ways of achieving the objective of phasing out WFA for better off pensioners and turning all the bells and whistles into cash in the pocket. In stead of lazily just tipping water over anyone who tries to suggest alternatives.

Well said Marydoll. Some posters are making comments which are offensive to me too.

Monica it has been suggested by me and others that the WFA could count towards taxable income. Wealthier pensioners would lose most of it, middle income pensioners would lose some, the poorest pensioners would lose little to none.

Converting "the bells and whistles" bus pass into possibly one and a bit return bus journeys a week doesn't seem like a caring response. I'm sure most recipients would prefer to keep their bus pass allowing them to make several trips in a week if needed or desired. I really don't think the wealthy claim or use bus passes to any great extent. Would they choose to stand at a bus stop in the cold winter rain when they could easily drive themselves or afford a taxi?

We are not lazily 'tipping water' over suggestions, but seeing the very real inequalities some of these suggestions would bring. Did you read Doodledog's excellent post at 17:19:38?

We know no system is perfect, but we should at least not throw out one that is working after a fashion until we can demonstrate a proven superior one.

Apologies should of typed PC not UC.

I think most of us realised that rafichagran, it was a fairly obvious slip.

Rosie51

I think most of us realised that rafichagran, it was a fairly obvious slip.

Agreed. Has anyone pretended to be confused about 'Pesnion Credit'? I doubt it, as that was just as obviously a typo.

People are disagreeing, M0nica. Not lazily pouring cold water on your suggestions, any more than the people for whom your idea would be detrimental are chronically financially feckless, and would dribble away the WFA. There's no need for terms like that.

MOnica I'm reposting my post from the other thread:

Do you mean that the threshold should rise or the amount which is paid because you haven't been clear?

In any case, it would still mean that there would be a cliff edge.

Additionally, my income does exceed £14,070 but I pay £850 a month rent. With your calculations, I would receive nothing. I already pay income tax (no complaints about that), but if I didn't receive partial housing benefit, my disposable income after housing costs would be less than £100 a week.

Deduct WFA (£6 a week), add £3 for prescriptions and my income would be reduced by almost 10%.

PS. OK! I confess! I haven't paid for prescriptions for over 30 years anyway because I'm diabetic, but I expect somebody would like to criticise that.

PS. It would be appreciated if you retracted the "feckless" accusation.

Am still aghast at the government’s attacks on pensioners. I love my bus pass. If the government take it away, i will be soending a lot more time at home.
If the free prescriptions are also removed, that will cost me a lot. Shall have to go back to buying an annual prepayment certificate.
Government are also going to tax pensioner savings above £16,000 AND there will he a lifetime ISA limit of £100,000.
They are going to charge CGT on main residence (a completely new thing) and retirement lump sums will no longer attract 25% tax free. So they don’t want us to save; buy a home; have a bus pass; have free prescriptions.
None of these measures will affect the 40% tax payers. If they charged 42% instead of 40% income tax they’d have their £20bn quickly
Starmer will receive a tax free pension. Why? Good question!

Chocolatenoodle8

Am still aghast at the government’s attacks on pensioners. I love my bus pass. If the government take it away, i will be soending a lot more time at home.
If the free prescriptions are also removed, that will cost me a lot. Shall have to go back to buying an annual prepayment certificate.
Government are also going to tax pensioner savings above £16,000 AND there will he a lifetime ISA limit of £100,000.
They are going to charge CGT on main residence (a completely new thing) and retirement lump sums will no longer attract 25% tax free. So they don’t want us to save; buy a home; have a bus pass; have free prescriptions.
None of these measures will affect the 40% tax payers. If they charged 42% instead of 40% income tax they’d have their £20bn quickly
Starmer will receive a tax free pension. Why? Good question!

Really? Where did you see all of this? Can you do a link please, or if not, just let us all know where you saw it so we can see for ourselves? I didn't realise that the budget had happened - I was told it would be October.

These claims are unsubstantiated and speculative - yet more scaremongering.

*Bus passes and prescriptions are speculation in right wing MM eg the Express has suggested prescriptions are "in RR In tray" but there are no proposals for this. Any references, please.

*Figures have been plucked out and used wrongly. For example, you cannot (long standing) apply for council tax reduction if you have savings above £16.000,

www.citizensadvice.org.uk/scotland/benefits/help-if-on-a-low-income/help-with-your-council-tax-council-tax-reduction-s/applying-for-council-tax-reduction-s/council-tax-reduction-income-when-the-pension-age-rules-are-used-s/#:~:text=If%20you%20have%20savings%20or,calculate%20income%20from%20your%20capital.

but that is not a tax on pensioner savings above £16,000!

*The ISA question is a different one altogether, if we are looking at problems for those least well off. There is nothing on the table atm however at the moment - have to see what happens in the budget but at the moment we are
"Spending over £2 billion on those with ISA savings of over £100,000, while 750,000 families have no savings at all"
Help to Save for low-income families could be increased.

www.theprivateoffice.com/news/isa-capped-at-100k

*Where is the evidence for charging CGT on main residence?

*The idea that retirement lump sums will no longer attract 25% tax free comes from "this is Money' Which is from the Daily Mail not any reliable source.

I get 25% off my council tax because I live alone. I would hate people who don't get pension credit think those of us who do get hundreds of pounds a week. I get £70.04 per week paid every 4 weeks with my state pension and my PIP as I was born disabled .

Citizens advice is the best place to ask in person if you are entitled to pension credit . I was happily surprised to get any.

Universal credit stops being paid as soon as you reach state pension age.

My PIP was awarded via PIP tribunal last year and because it was I keep it. But after state pension age you can't apply for PIP . You have to apply for Attendance Allowance.

I should save anyone who gets carers allowance that will stop when you reach state pension age. My brother gave up work 5 years to look after my sister in law and only gets a small private pension and carers allowance. He has tried but even though he has very little savings he can't claim anything else. He reaches state pension next year. Because he will get married state pension and a couple of private pensions he will not get pension credit. He's already looked into it.

My sister in law had to stop working at 52 due to MS. She got her private NHS pension plus PIP but when she married my brother 8 years ago . Her NHS pension was taken off her and told she will get it back when she reaches state pension age which will be in 3 years time.

Maggiemaybe

^Someone said you can use the bus pass in other regions as well - is that right? If so that's great - we could go to the coast :-) I thought it was just in the same council area.^

If you’re in England the national pass that people are eligible for at state pension age is valid for all service bus (not coach) travel throughout England from 0930h until 2300h, and at any time over the weekend.

I believe the passes for Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales are even more generous, eg start at 60 and might cover train travel as well?

I live in Wales these days and the bus passes do start here at 60 (well that's when I got mine anyway) - but don't include any rail concessions. I obviously wouldn't like it if they take my free buspass off me - though the thing that would worry me most is that, I think, there are subsidies that might vanish if the buses were used less by other people. That's because I'm in a remote area with an appalling bus service anyway (ie THE main bus we have here is only about once an hour anyway and little/if owt on evenings and Sundays). When I moved here I knew I'd go from having a decent bus service to having an appalling one like this and thought "I wouldn't put it past them to make it even worse" and they duly have because of Lockdown and social life is very spread out in this area and I'd be spending a fortune on taxis whenever there wasn't a bus (ie most of the time then). There would be no option but to take a taxi even for my dentist - as I come from a "questioning/the patient is obviously the decision-maker" area (ie university city) and the two in this town don't allow "questioners/patient making own decisions" and that would mean an extra £60 or so return trip for each visit to the nearby little town (where they are used to city people from southern England) if the bus service collapses.

There is quite a package already of what they are planning to do:
- charge all single people 100% Council Tax, rather than 75% (but those in couples will still pay 50% each). I estimate that will cost me £500 pa more on my CT bill.
- take away my winter fuel allowance (£200 lost to me, £150 each lost to a couple).

So that's about £700 pa worse off to start with before they cut anything else. Yep...I do think they are almost certainly going to go after the senior rail pass too. Then, for many, there's whatever private doctors charge if we need a doctor visit (as older people are more likely to) - as it gets steadily more and more difficult to actually see a doctor if we need to. I know this varies according to where we are in the country - the NHS doctor I'm with would get me in to see them within the week if it was urgent and in about 2 weeks if it isn't urgent (but I also have a private doctor just-in-case and am already having to pay for things I've previously had from the NHS - eg earwax removal, blemish removal).

My cynical take on it is that single people are deliberately going to be charged more (even though, as we know, it's much more expensive to be single anyway) and they hope that we will couple-up and share houses with a partner or friend or something - as there isn't enough housing for everyone's need and some people's (second home) greed. Would be easier for them to get us to "budge up and share" than wondering just where and how 1.5 million extra homes are to be built for us and how to house all the boat people as they are still barely stopped from heading across the Channel.

-

I am getting very tired of all the scaremongering stirred up by who? Where is it saying bus passes and prescriptions are under assault. This is what the thread is about. Now we read on here than CGT will be applied on main residences. Where does it say that? We will be told our pets will be taxed soon. Oh dear given the gutter press an idea. £50.00 pa for a budgie.

Wait until the budget in October FGS. As there's not much we can do about it anyway apart from worry ourselves sick. . Personally I am not spending on large items until I can see the wood for the trees and I know what we will all be facing.
So like we have been advised in heat waves to shut windows and draw the curtains which has been the best advice from the gov for years, just be sensible from now till the budget.

Well said HelterSkelter!

Mt61 I only used my bus pass a couple of times in the year before it expired. I am sure any kind of regular use is ok.
Now I have cataracts I am going to need it more.

4allweknow

Gentleshores. You will be well supported for loss of either.

Thank you.