Is she right or is she wrong

Poppy Baynham said the controversy was improving her profile as an artist

I cannot buy into the opinion that anything goes when it comes to art. There was a great hoohah about those knitted nudies in the shop window so why not about a painting of a female inviting people to peer up her fandango. A great example to set the grandchildren.
Anyone thinking of buying the painting to hang in the dining room?

Yuk 🤮

NotSpaghetti

It's on Instagram in a little video if anyone wants to actually see it.

I don't see what the fuss is about.
Artists have done this for years - L'origine du monde by Courbet, church carvings like the one in Kendal (Sheel -ne gig?).. There was an artist in Sweden who painted/drew (?) God giving Birth.

All sorts.
And certainly let's of textile art too

This picture reminds me greatly of work coming out by women artists from the 1970's onwards who were reclaiming a reality away from a long history of male nude idealised portrayal by choosing to portray themselves from their own perspective. Warts and all, etc.

Really this artist is just repeating this work in her own way, my body, my choice.

Certainly not porn, its a sort of humour with the knitted bit, I don't rate it much, rather a second rate copy of the sort of work I've mentioned some of which is done with great skill.

But this argument is a old as the hills.

As far as I can judge, whether a work of art is just that or pornography depends on how good the artist who drew, sculpted, painted the subject was. Or for that matter wrote the book or poem.

AND on whether the main purpose of the work has been judged to be only to arouse or satisfy lust in the viewer (reader) or serves some other more aestetic purpose.

If the purpose was to shock, and only to shock then painting a woman with her legs open, displaying her genitalia, or with menstrual blood dripping down her legs seems very Old Hat to me - yes, it caused a sensation in the 1970s, as did pictures of naked men with erections, but honestly, can anyone be shocked today?

Disgusted, perhaps, or soberly feel that the work demeans both the model and all others of the same sex. But again this must depend on the quality and purpose of the work.

In a textbook for medical students, student nurses or midwives or teenage schoolchildren, it might well be acceptable, but not if hanging on the wall of a tea-room.

It's boring and rather ugly and depicts a woman with huge breasts and a tiny waist which reminds me of comic book women.
I just think it's all a bit sad.

It's not my cuppa, but it's not pornography, although the fact that the woman's head is missing is, IMO, dodgy - objectifying body parts is one of the red flags, I think.

I also think that the fact she has asterisked the word 'p**nography' is telling. Many websites or social media pages won't allow certain words, so people 'bleep' them - fine, but this is a printed notice . She seems a bit confused, unless she's showing it off all over the place and can't be bothered to edit her messaging to suit the media channel.

The question then is, is she objectifying women, or is she pointing out that women are objectified, only seen in certain ways?

But she doesn't do it well, either way! Jenny Saville is probably skills wise one of the most prominent artists in the genre

www.google.com/search?client=safari&sca_esv=06c568487881745e&sca_upv=1&rls=en&sxsrf=ADLYWILIiDX7h6T20m3KVCHeQU7UGgjafw:1726840862381&q=jenny+saville&udm=2&fbs=AEQNm0Aa4sjWe7Rqy32pFwRj0UkWd8nbOJfsBGGB5IQQO6L3J5MIFhvnvU242yFxzEEp3BeeRDeomFf8DkO7myIzvXpiBdfFz5h2ZV6WyoEoFhsRKWC0YT2o6yqVxHd61A8_1N098RlRDpMO5EZzCP0tBSyHH9FLkWPP8nkOK4XpicPt6rQZqfVIamI-H-qcjl9VxJ3X7AvL&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjH273B19GIAxVw8bsIHXk1Jz8QtKgLegQIERAB&biw=1116&bih=653&dpr=2

Exactly Wyllow3 - and you will notice it's in the window but displayed behind the signage for the gallery and behind the info re complaints/thoughts.

NotSpaghetti

It's on Instagram in a little video if anyone wants to actually see it.

I don't see what the fuss is about.
Artists have done this for years - L'origine du monde by Courbet, church carvings like the one in Kendal (Sheel -ne gig?).. There was an artist in Sweden who painted/drew (?) God giving Birth.

All sorts.
And certainly let's of textile art too

The Courbet is a fantastic painting and a homage to women.
This is just a crap painting.

Gransnetters have mentioned life models and having seen it all before. In all my years of attending life classes, no model has ever taken up this position.

Poor woman, it must be sad thinking you are an artist, when everyone else thinks you couldn't draw a crooked line.

I suggest she beocmes a performance artist and strips off and lies in the window of the gallery, legs spread wide, at least she would then be described as 'brave'.

I love Jenny Saville's work. It really speaks to me and I would have no problem discussing her art with my granddaughter's ( that's my yardstick for criticising Baynham's legs akimbo). Picasso did some sketches of female genitalia in his later years and I thought that they looked angry and cruel when I saw them in an exhibition.

I realise that I haven't answered the OP' s question. She is right to paint what she likes and if her motivation was publicity then she was right to put it in the window. I just find everything wrong with how she chooses to portray the female form.

Wouldn’t have it on my wall, but not offended or unduly bothered by it.

Parsley3

^Poppy Baynham said the controversy was improving her profile as an artist^

I cannot buy into the opinion that anything goes when it comes to art. There was a great hoohah about those knitted nudies in the shop window so why not about a painting of a female inviting people to peer up her fandango. A great example to set the grandchildren.
Anyone thinking of buying the painting to hang in the dining room?

I don’t think any of us can afford her art. Her painting “Propped 1992” sold for well over £9.5000,000. The most expensive artwork by a female artist in auction history.

I paint pretty pictures which a lot of the time don’t sell. Would I hang Jenny Saville’s art work over my mantelpiece the answer is no, I would not.

Of course it wasn't the artist that put it in the window anyway.
It was the gallery owner/curator

Gustav Corbet painting of a vulva is considered great art. No different.

Mollygo

So that’s a picture of a woman in a shop window, in a particular pose meant to shock, not to praise the female form, not of great artistic value IMO.
How will all posters on here feel when a would-be Banksy decides that’s the next great idea for the side of a building.
I’m curious, foxie48
Do they run the life classes outside in public places?
Do all sorts of positions include the display of female genitalia here with or without the fabric covering on this painting?
Would you volunteer to display yourself in that position for a life drawing class?
I did life drawing as part of a Uni course many years ago and my artistic talents are about on a par with that artist, but the nudes, whatever age, were always tasteful.

What I have said in my post, Mollygo is that the picture "doesn't bother me in the slightest" and it doesn't. The issue of where life classes are held, whether positions show genitalia and whether I would volunteer as a model in any position was not the question that was asked by the OP. I am very used to seeing naked people, I'm perfectly aware that they have genitalia and that women menstruate so I just don't find anything in the picture "bothers" me. That is my answer.

I have been to many, many life drawing classes. Models both male and female, In the 60s a male model wore a posing pouch, not so these days. But I have never seen a model in such a blatant pose. ….but I would draw it if needs be.

Parsley3

^Poppy Baynham said the controversy was improving her profile as an artist^

I cannot buy into the opinion that anything goes when it comes to art. There was a great hoohah about those knitted nudies in the shop window so why not about a painting of a female inviting people to peer up her fandango. A great example to set the grandchildren.
Anyone thinking of buying the painting to hang in the dining room?

Fandango! 😁

As someone said: "it's not very Hay-on-Wye".

In fact, it's just not very good but perhaps this artist would never get noticed without being controversial.

Nightsky2

Parsley3

Poppy Baynham said the controversy was improving her profile as an artist

I cannot buy into the opinion that anything goes when it comes to art. There was a great hoohah about those knitted nudies in the shop window so why not about a painting of a female inviting people to peer up her fandango. A great example to set the grandchildren.
Anyone thinking of buying the painting to hang in the dining room?

I don’t think any of us can afford her art. Her painting “Propped 1992” sold for well over £9.5000,000. The most expensive artwork by a female artist in auction history.

I paint pretty pictures which a lot of the time don’t sell. Would I hang Jenny Saville’s art work over my mantelpiece the answer is no, I would not.

I don’t think much of Poppy Baynham’s work either and won’t be bidding for it.😣. Definitely not one for over the mantelpiece.

There's art to make you think, often uncomfortable, which I like or admire but no, not for the living room.

There’s art to make you think. I find Joan Miro like that. Then there’s art that shows off how poor your ability is, and relies on shock to get any attention all.

MissAdventure

I think I saw this painter and some of her work on TV, a couple of months ago.

She also paints menstruating images, such as a woman with blood running down her legs, and so on, as well as women who have cellulite, blotches, ugly veins,bulbous breaststroke, and all the other things we all have, to some extent.

I don't mind nude paintings, but I find the woman painted with her legs open crude. I just do not like it.
I would not complain about it though as it is only personal opinion.

The artwork features a naked woman wearing cowboy boots with her legs spread, revealing a black triangle with pink wool on top, rather than genitals

Not really porn as the genitalia are covered, but lots of publicity