"Read the Room" and stick to the subject

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Chocolatelovinggran

I found the little shoes in Budapest very moving, too, Norah.

Shoes in the US Holocaust Memorial Museum - the odour is overwhelming. Heartbreaking.

All those individuals with dreams of their own and a life ahead of them.

Me too, it brought tears to my eyes. A very apt sculpture. It makes you realise just how widespread the persecution was. I feel sick when I hear about anti Semitism on the rise again today.

I found the little shoes in Budapest very moving, too, Norah.

maddyone

If you want to visit some of these sites Smileless, I would recommend either Berlin or Krakow for a city break. They are both really interesting cities, with so much history and historical sites to visit. Krakow is a beautiful city; the only major Polish city that wasn’t destroyed by the Germans as they left because they didn’t have time to do it before they pulled out. You can see remnants of the ghetto wall there, visit Auschwitz and the Schindler museum, and the site of Plaszow where the Jews Schindler saved were incarcerated, but Krakow has many other attractions too, including a beautiful castle, and the old Jewish area with many lovely restaurants.

Another interesting city is Warsaw. There are too many interesting sites and museums to mention; so much history from WW2. There’s part of the ghetto wall there too. As we stood in front of it, my husband just said ‘Weren’t they bas……ds.’ He never normally swears.

Budapest: "Shoes on the Danube Bank" very moving site, we've been twice.

Prague: Spanish Synagogue - wonderful concerts. Also a nice museum.

Thanks maddy .

If you want to visit some of these sites Smileless, I would recommend either Berlin or Krakow for a city break. They are both really interesting cities, with so much history and historical sites to visit. Krakow is a beautiful city; the only major Polish city that wasn’t destroyed by the Germans as they left because they didn’t have time to do it before they pulled out. You can see remnants of the ghetto wall there, visit Auschwitz and the Schindler museum, and the site of Plaszow where the Jews Schindler saved were incarcerated, but Krakow has many other attractions too, including a beautiful castle, and the old Jewish area with many lovely restaurants.

Another interesting city is Warsaw. There are too many interesting sites and museums to mention; so much history from WW2. There’s part of the ghetto wall there too. As we stood in front of it, my husband just said ‘Weren’t they bas……ds.’ He never normally swears.

I looked up the name of the other camp I went to, it was called Stuttof, and was near Gdańsk. I went on a city break to Gdańsk with my sister (when she was well enough, she no longer is.)

Some good recommendations here.
I'd like to visit one or two of the concentration camps mentioned, maybe in winter because one of the things survivors always mention is the bitter cold temperatures.

I studied Bertolt Brecht, Max Fisher and Friedrich Dürrenmatt for my Gernan degree, so this thread is bringing back buried memories I acquired when much younger about the Nazi period.

It's so important that everyone knows this history yes it is maddy. I've not yet visited Auschwitz or any of the others but that is something I hope to be able to do.

I've read many books on the Holocaust; Simon Wiesenthal and Primo Levi to name just two of too many to remember them all.

The most stark reminders are if you are able to visit Auschwitz, and/or other concentration camps. I saw Dachau as well as Auschwitz, and also Theresienstadt. I went to see another one in Poland with my sister but I can’t remember its name. It was much smaller than Auschwitz or Dachau.

Also museums are useful for learning about what happened. I never studied this subject at school but have learned a lot from visiting sites and museums. The memorial in Berlin is very thought provoking, and it has a museum underneath it. Also Warsaw is an interesting city with a lot of information/sites about Jewish history in WW2 alongside much other historical information about what happened in Warsaw to the none Jewish population in WW2, including a museum about the resistance and uprising in Warsaw.

I recently visited the Museum of Resistance in Amsterdam, having seen the Anne Frank House on a previous visit. The museum wasn’t specifically about the Jews in Amsterdam, it was about the organised resistance in Holland during the war, but it did cover Jewish resistance and people who sheltered Jewish people.

It’s so important that everyone knows this history.

I'm comfortable with Holocaust Memorial Day commemorating the Jews and everyone else murdered by the Nazis. Overwhemingly it was Jewish people that were murdered ( I think a figure of 6 million Jews is given ) although as well other minority groups that the Nazis didn't like were swept up and also murdered .
I've no axe to grind as I'm a British lapsed Catholic. Those statistics seem to be reliable facts.
If amyone doubts what was done try watching Claude Lanzaman's "Shoah". He recorded visually and verbally a lot of mundane detail , interviewing also at least one ex prison guard( I think) so that he could say what he had done and why.

That's exactly it Smileless2012. No one group should have the terrors of their experiences in Holocaust diminished in the interests of solidarity.
However, Hitler's goal was to kill every last Jew - man, woman, and child. It is the scope of intent that needs to be remembered. The totality of annihilating the entire Jewish race.

I did know about how Romanies were treated pascal but it was still horrifying to be reminded.

Maddy causes me to weep, one can imagine their joy, safety
after centuries of being outcasts , not because of any wrong doing but being born a Jew, they can return home , yes home

Quite right Annie. That is exactly why the state of Israel was established.

49% of holocaust survivors live I Israel, they surely felt they would be safe there

ferry23

Yes, I apologise it is about remembering other groups who were victims and other genocides. But my thoughts remain the same.

I was absolutely horrified when watching the film The last Musician of Auschwitz that at that time Romanies were hunted for sport and it was completely legal.. I absolutely agree that we should remember all the other groups as well as those poor Jewish people.. it was absolutely horrifying..

Yes, one and a half children sent to gas chambers, medical experiments, starvation

Whilst I had no problem with Angela Rayner’s tweet, I think Holocaust Memorial Day should be to remember the victims of the Nazis, which is exemplified by the services held at Auschwitz, because that was the largest and most industrialised killing camp, and we must remember that the vast majority of those killed there, and in other concentration camps, were Jewish. Six million Jewish people were murdered by the Nazis, which far outnumbered any other group, and this number included one and a half million children.

I fear the long history of the persecution of Jews is being washed away.

There is Martin Luther King Day, Nelson Mandela Day

As an aside comment, I received my newsletter yesterday from the Anne Frank House I subscribe to.
Apparently they have just opened a complete replica exhibition in New York. The primary aim is, of course, to preserve the memory of Anne Frank, and is also in recognition of Otto Frank’s commitment to opposing anti-Semitism. And indeed, any form of discrimination. Jews were by far the largest group targeted in the Holocaust, and I think that memory should be preserved on one particular day. The exhibition was purposely launched on 27th January.

Thank you Allira who else was involved and are now involved

Nine staff members at the UN agency for Palestinian refugees, UNRWA, may have been involved in the 7 October Hamas-led attack on Israel, the United Nations says.
All nine would have their employment terminated, said UN deputy spokesperson Farhan Haq.
BBC August 2024

Those are just the ones involved in the terrorist attack.

They got rid of a few UN workers who they found to be actively involved in hamas and the deadly incursion into Israel.
Tip of the iceberg in my view.