The most vulnerable group in society

I don't believe groups of people can be vulnerable but that there are some in every group who will be vulnerable.
I have known severely disabled people who have been loved and looked after very well but they would be classed as vulnerable.

Whitewavemark2

Ilovecheese

I consider small children to be the most vulnerable in society, with absolute conviction.
They have no voice and no power of any kind.

Yes definitely.

I was listening this morning to a podcast, which was explaining that something seems to have gone seriously wrong since covid, because the instance of SEND children has gone through the roof, and schools simply do not have the ability to cope with the numbers.

I wonder what has gone wrong?

Because millions were locked up at the most brain forming times of their lives 🤬
What did the so called experts think was going to happen.

Agree that 'vulnerable' is often misused for 'disadvantaged'.

But what does 'in society' or 'in our society' mean? Nothing, except 'in this country' when needed for clarity. It actually weakens the word 'vulnerable'.

Vulberable, as defined by a Poster upthread, from a dictionary definition, is for me a child, any child, no matter where in the world they are trying to survive.

I think it is very easy to get hung up on the definition of the word vulnerable. Isn't it possible to be vulnerable in some ways but not in others? I don't think vulnerable works as a blanket term or an absolute.

Sick and disabled children, particularly those who need hospice care along with their parents - and siblings.

Although the Government announced some extra support for hospices, they still struggle with funding as the majority of their money (over 90% in most cases) comes from charity donations.

What kind of society are we that the most vulnerable have to rely on charity? As one man in charge of two hospices said on the local news recently, if the hospices weren't providing this dedicated care and support, the NHS would have to take over.

So they need much more Government funding, not a drop on the ocean.

I’d agree regarding children.
I think the other very vulnerable group is anybody without mental capacity, regardless of age. Older people are more vulnerable due to physical frailty, but if they have mental capacity they are much less vulnerable to abuse than those without, for example those in the final stages of Alzheimer’s disease.

Lathyrus3

I think “vulnerable” has been confused with ”disadvantaged”.

Groups of people can be shown to be disadvantaged when they are not able to access what others can.

But “vulnerable” is those who are powerless to to protest, seek justice and direct their own lives.

So I agree that small children and babies are the most vulnerable. And also the severely disabled and the very elderly who have lost capacity.

I don’t consider “vulnerable “ any group that has demonstrated its ability and right to protest, demand or present their particular cause or need.

In being able to do so they are no more vulnerable than anyone else.

This

I'n not sure I agree. Someone like Stephen Hawking was undoubtedly vulnerable, as he was so profoundly disabled, but he was capable of advocating for himself until as near the end as we know about.

I agree with Casdon about mental capacity, and that we need a lot more support for hospices. The dying are very clearly vulnerable and need to be looked after as well as possible.

I’m not saying that someone like Stephen Hawkins wasn’t vulnerable but rather that n being able to very clearly express his needs and having the means to direct his own life he was for the greater part of his life not particularly mire vulnerable than the majority.

In that we all have areas our lives where we are n need of extra support.

If we can express our need and access the support we need we cease to be vulnerable, I think. But I need to ponder.

Lathyrus3

I think “vulnerable” has been confused with ”disadvantaged”.

Groups of people can be shown to be disadvantaged when they are not able to access what others can.

But “vulnerable” is those who are powerless to to protest, seek justice and direct their own lives.

So I agree that small children and babies are the most vulnerable. And also the severely disabled and the very elderly who have lost capacity.

I don’t consider “vulnerable “ any group that has demonstrated its ability and right to protest, demand or present their particular cause or need.

In being able to do so they are no more vulnerable than anyone else.

Nice point.

To Doloki - is the 'g' on your keyboard broken?

Obviously children are vulnerable by virtue of their powerlessness, but the vast majority of them have powerful protectors and advocates in the form of their parents, wider family and even society in general. In my opinion, the most vulnerable in society are adults who, by virtue of physical or mental disability, whether associated with age or not, are just "hanging on" with little or no support. The person who falls in their home and is unable to call for help. The mentally ill person who starves to death because their benefits are cut off. People without a family network as a safety net. As welfare services are cut to the bone this group is getting larger.

I’ve been thinking on this, to me the most vulnerable are the unseen, they only come to light during or after a tragedy.

Most children have loving parents, but a lot of elderly don’t have anyone, so I would say elderly are vulnerable to neglect, abuse, scammers, etc.

I agree with GrannyGravy13 when she says 'I think vulnerable is a word bandied around so much nowadays that it’s becoming meaningless'.

Its use became prolific during covid. I could not believe the number of previously fit people who declared themselves to be vulnerable. Because of reasons such as their age, the fact they'd broken their wrist, or even because they had to catch a bus or train. People seemed to compete over who was most vulnerable.

It is the word of the decade. Followed closely by unprecedented. I'm amazed by all these unique events we are experiencing.

The favourite phrase by politicians seems to be Let me be clear. When I hear that, I feel the last thing I am going to get is clarity.

Not that I'm cynical. I am veering off topic, though, so will shut up.

Ilovecheese

I consider small children to be the most vulnerable in society, with absolute conviction.
They have no voice and no power of any kind.

Absolutely right!

Cabowich
Good post.

You won't get any argument from me about the way language is being used to obfuscate and remove nuance. I think it's very dangerous.

As I said in the OP I think that when we accept a concept such as that a group is 'the most vulnerable in society' it becomes impossible (or difficult) to criticise them, or to suggest that some may be capitalising on that definition without being assumed to be uncaring. We saw that writ large on trans threads on here.

I think vulnerability was fairly tightly defined during Covid. Only certain conditions qualified. I agree that self-interest showed through though. I well remember a spat on my local FB page between a young mum and an older woman. The young mum had very small children and no car, and was used to getting regular grocery deliveries, which continued during the pandemic. The older one was affronted by this as (despite having shopped for her own until lockdown) expected to bump a regular customer off the list to be given a slot. She kept saying she was vulnerable, and accusing the young woman of not caring about vulnerable people, but because she was in her 60s with no qualifying medical conditions she wasn't deemed to be vulnerable and didn't get one, which I think was fair (assuming what was said on FB was true).

Jockytaff

To Doloki - is the 'g' on your keyboard broken?

I was wonderin’ about that 😁

AnotherBirdLady

Obviously children are vulnerable by virtue of their powerlessness, but the vast majority of them have powerful protectors and advocates in the form of their parents, wider family and even society in general. In my opinion, the most vulnerable in society are adults who, by virtue of physical or mental disability, whether associated with age or not, are just "hanging on" with little or no support. The person who falls in their home and is unable to call for help. The mentally ill person who starves to death because their benefits are cut off. People without a family network as a safety net. As welfare services are cut to the bone this group is getting larger.

You make an excellent point there.👏🏻👏🏻

I am wondering whether there is some confusion here between vulnerable and protected groups. When we talk safeguarding we having several protected groups included the ones mentioned in the OP and yes they are all considered vulnerable. Carers is another group.

Where is the confusion? I guess protection isn't offered to groups who are not threatened, but it has been spelt out that some members of those groups are not vulnerable at all.

In a Venn Diagram of someone's life they might be in a group marked vulnerable in some intersections, but not in others, if that makes sense. So the person isn't vulnerable per se, but in certain circumstances they may be.

The phrase 'vulnerable' is a trigger phrase used by special interest groups to emotional blackmail other people to prioritise them over everybody else.

It is a word that has lost all meaning, like a blown egg.

During the pandemic I was still below retirement age. My job was as a Learning Support Assistant in a secondary school. We were all working from home, but contacting some of our special needs students by email weekly to check on their wellbeing. There were rotas for working in school in person, supervising the children of key workers and some of our special needs students got doorstep visits by staff who voluteered. I was not put on the rotas for the key worker children, and despite volunteering, was told I coudn't do doorstep visits either as I was classed as vulnerable. This was because I was over 60 and diabetic. However I was doing doorstep visit to friends and going for walks with friends in the open air at various times, always within government guidelines. I didn't consider myself vulnerable! I was doing my own supermarket shopping, joining the socially distanced queues every few days.

I complained, and was eventually added to the rota for one single session! I was due to retire in the summer of 2020 but decided to delay until the October half term as I wanted to see my colleagues again and have some sort of send off into retirement. No-one suggested I shoudn't return to school that September despite the fact that we were dealing with crowded corridors of students who wouldn't wear their masks properly - far more risky than anything I'd been 'protected from' during spring and summer.

The problem was lumping everyone over 60 with any sort of condition into the 'vulnerable' category. Yes the term 'vulnerable' is overused!