Welsh 20mph outcome is actually quite impressive

icanhandthemback

Grandmabatty

Orly, I'm not sure what point you are making? Ambulances can blue light people if they need to, so wouldn't be going 20mph

Ambulances and Fire Engines are actually legally supposed to obey the speed limit even with their blue lights going. If they have an accident and have not obeyed the laws of the road (like speed, red lights, etc) they can be prosecuted. I only know this because my DH was a firefighter and 2 of my sons drive Fire Engines for the Fire Service now.

Under the provisions of section 87 of the Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984, emergency service vehicles in the UK can exceed speed limits when responding to an emergency, provided it is safe to do so and their driving does not constitute dangerous or careless driving.

They can only do so when responding to an emergency call, pursuing a suspect, or transporting someone in urgent need of care.

Typically, they must display flashing lights, and/or use a siren so that other road users know to yield.

Emergency Service drivers still have a legal duty to drive safely, they must not endanger others.

Quite frankly, if drivers are finding it difficult to keep to 20mph but weirdly not 30mph, then they need to question their driving ability.

It isn’t about drivers - it is about saving lives and children’s in particular.

You all need to get over yourselves!

Councils round the country have wasted mega-millions (as ever!) by splashing 20mph signs, with some road painting, in places that are quite pointless.

As for the claimed results, well, I'd have major doubts, I recall a news item that the Oxford Council claimed to have had a successful 'consultation', with majority approval for a Low Traffic Area concept -- which sounds good, but actually means that other nearby areas become Extra High Traffic!

This consultation was later shown to have been nonsense, the Council had apparently ignored the actual result, and just did what they wanted to. On the TV news recently, I saw that the same Council has repeated this jolly wheeze, a 'consultation' sent a resounding NO for their plan to introduce traffic charges (like the London central area ones), but they'll implement it anyway!! Doubtless if they'd had the result they really liked that would have well publicised, but why should the public there be paying for a 'consultation' that was completely ignored?? Can Councils be impeached?!

Update in a local newspaper today:

Speed restrictions have been reviewed in Monmouthshire after public consultation. Some lower speed limits are being introduced, some of which are 30mph on A roads, yet some 20mph limits through at least one village are being revoked.

That's despicable.

Grandmabatty

I didn't know that icanhandthemback. I can't imagine anyone who would complain if a life was at stake

You'd be amazed. Firefighters get stuff thrown at them quite regularly whilst working. Some idiots even lie down in the road to stop them making progress and, yes, drivers have been prosecuted. Unfortunately, not everybody admires their work.

Historical accident data was used by the councils as part of the process to decide on the speed limits, which might explain some of the apparent anomalies. I assume they will use that going forward, and continue to change inappropriate limits. My guess is that some councils will have done a better job of deciding the limits than others. If people are unhappy about specific roads, then contact your local council.

I live in a 20mph zone, one of 2 in my town. Happy with mine, but the main road to the next town??. The whole of that town is 20mph, including a main commuter route - nonsense. Pedestrians and cyclists who used to use the minor roads are now wandering about into the main road.

OldFrill

Is there the same amount of traffic on the roads. There were articles saying tourism would plummet. If there're fewer vehicles there should be fewer accidents.

The volume of traffic has gone up and is predicted to increase.
Tourism has increased top.

Some roads have been changed back to 30mph from 20mph
www.walesonline.co.uk/news/uk-news/welsh-council-changes-52-20mph-32472498

An A road I use was changed to 30mph for a substantial length with 20mph through villages, but has now reverted to 40 mph, still 20mph through the villages.

An alternative route, on a B road, has a 50mph limit but this is being reviewed.

There’s been a decline in tourism since Covid throughout the UK OldFrill, but I doubt in the context of this scheme it is significant. The contribution to achieving the strategy for reducing motor vehicles is in the Transport for Wales document I attached.

Is there the same amount of traffic on the roads. There were articles saying tourism would plummet. If there're fewer vehicles there should be fewer accidents.

I live in Wales and some of the 20 mile an hour areas are ridiculous, I agree by schools but we have a sections near us that to from 30-20-40 the 20 part is on a slight downward slope which goes into an incline which makes maintaining 20 very difficult there are about 5 houses near by but all have a front gate and pavement. Further along the same rd you go back to 20 , but no houses face the Road and a pavement both sides, there are so many places that are like this I feel the local councils just made these places to be able to say they have so many roads that comply to Welsh Government regulations, tick box exercise.

I didn't know that icanhandthemback. I can't imagine anyone who would complain if a life was at stake

Grandmabatty

Orly, I'm not sure what point you are making? Ambulances can blue light people if they need to, so wouldn't be going 20mph

Ambulances and Fire Engines are actually legally supposed to obey the speed limit even with their blue lights going. If they have an accident and have not obeyed the laws of the road (like speed, red lights, etc) they can be prosecuted. I only know this because my DH was a firefighter and 2 of my sons drive Fire Engines for the Fire Service now.

If my speed limiter or cruise control would assist me with staying at 20mph, I would welcome it. Until then, I feel I am more dangerous because maintaining a steady speed is very difficult at 20mph which is less of a problem at 30mph. Consequently I spend more time checking my speed rather than watching out for pedestrians!

Orly, I'm not sure what point you are making? Ambulances can blue light people if they need to, so wouldn't be going 20mph

That is good news.

But it can be a mixed blessing. On one street entering town there are cars parked all down one side and getting past them before the next oncoming car whilst remaining under 20mph is very challenging!

Drives me mad - Flintshire is one of the only counties not to change some of the blanket 20s back to 30. Have no objection to built up areas housing estates - schools - hospital - care homes etc - but everywhere else - No. they did change one early on in the process - busses and wagons honestly struggled with the gradient…

Grandmabatty

There are many areas in Scotland who have this too. It appears to have cut road deaths but I can't find the evidence at the moment

More people are dying in the back of ambulances on the way to hospital though.

We live in Wales and are now used to the 20mins . We have long slow tails of traffic through the village. Bit like a funeral procession. But as soon as some drivers clear the 20 mph area and spy a 30 or 40, they are off as if shot from a cannon

I live in Canada, and in my area some cities have now decreased their speed limits from 50 km/h to 40 km/h. I have not seen the statistics myself, but I believe there is evidence that this decreases the risks. (I also believe that this was an initiative by Vision Zero. It's an organization whose vision is for zero accidents involving death or serious injury on the roads.)

It might be easier if it was consistent.
It’s 30mph going up the hill near where I live, but 20mph going down. The limit recently changed from 30 to 20 mph along one road by open field , except for a short stretch including 3 road junctions, where the limit is signed 30mph.
It’s our job to observe limits, but you do wonder why some have changed.

Some cities and even rural areas already have these in England and have done for years.

I don't really know what the fuss is about really, especially if it makes things safer and healthier for others and themselves.

My street has speed bumps to keep kids safe, but even then some drives go over them at speed, which only harms the suspension on their cars. Why can't we all just slow down a little?

They're very unpopular round here. There are a number of petitions on the go to get them removed.

Hmm well I wish it was more widespread. I wish we had it in our area on the south coast.