Goodbye Duke & Duchess of York.

Everything the Royals do is on their terms alone. Andrew has agreed not use titles such as the Duke of York, but he still technically holds them.
He should be stripped of them, stripped of the title ‘Prince’ and then it would be clear where power lies. In what other job do we get to dictate the terms of our dismissal? He is a proven liar and the .£12 Million paid to his victim to protect him from scrutiny under the law spoke volumes. Royal privilege in the 21 Century makes fools of us all.

Nigeria also has a culture of killing people, mostly children, deemed to be witches and of female genital mutilation. Do you condone those practises, too, Ronib?

No I agree Casdon, obviously.

You do realise that you are thinking in the particular confines of Western culture? Allira Nigeria for example has a very young age of consent as do other countries. However my main point is that prostitution has been around for a very long time and in that sense, Prince Andrew wasn’t unusual in using this service. It was, in my opinion, his choice. It is unfortunate that he has trashed his own reputation and damaged his family but it happened. There’s no undoing the past. He was an idiot and he’s paying the price. Sad for everyone involved too.

This is a shocking scandal involving the rich and powerful abusing the young and vulnerable.

I am shocked that ronib is trying to normalise this.

ronib, where did you get the figure of hundreds of thousands of dollars being paid to Epstein’s sex slaves? What relevance does that have to Andrew and Sarah the Yorks? What relevance to the tragic life of Virginia Giuffre and the other exploited vulnerable girls snd women.,

Maxwells and Epstein targeted the vulnerable, groomed then exploited them. These two and the men they supplied sex slaves to are the guilty here

No it isn’t ok Allira. I don’t know all the in & outs of what Epstein did, but I can’t imagine PA having sex with a 14 yr old. What I do find disgusting is, if he knew that the girls Epstein had sex with, were only that age, especially having your girls himself.

Thanks VV wasn’t too sure.

Mt61

What is the legal age for sex in America. Wasn’t VG 17?

Does that make it ok then?

Some girls on the island were only 14.

I think some posters have lost sight of the facts.

Mt61

What is the legal age for sex in America. Wasn’t VG 17?

It varies in different states.
The issue remains as often repeated. Trafficked individuals are not considered to be able to give consent.

Mt61

What is the legal age for sex in America. Wasn’t VG 17?

I believe it can vary from one state to another between 16 and 18.

What is the legal age for sex in America. Wasn’t VG 17?

he was a fool

I agree but ore than a fool. He is arrogant and thought he was entitled to take whatever he wanted.

Did he never give a thought to his own young daughters? Any decent father would have thought twice about having sex with girls the same age as his own children. Sickening.

eddiecat78

Looking back, hasn't there always been a member of the royal family who behaved badly? Princess Margaret wasn't a paragon of virtue, Edward 8th was a Nazi and Edward 7th had the morals of an alley cat. And so it goes on.

The Duke of Edinburgh had his affairs, did he not? Charles too.

David49

I have no idea whether Andrew had sex with Guifre but he must have known what Epstein was doing, hosts dont entertain friends with young women without knowing what is going to happen, guests know exactly what is going to happen.
Andrew consorted with Epstein for several years, entertaining him in royal properties and accepting hospitality on Epsteins private island, he was a fool and now paying the price.

That’s exactly it.

Oh and strangely enough women/girls who have experienced abuse as children are over represented in prostitution because they are so vulnerable. That poor girl never stood a chance.

If sex work is work then surely jobless women can find themselves employment as sex workers. Seemingly, there are plenty of men who require their needs to be serviced.

I have no idea whether Andrew had sex with Guifre but he must have known what Epstein was doing, hosts dont entertain friends with young women without knowing what is going to happen, guests know exactly what is going to happen.
Andrew consorted with Epstein for several years, entertaining him in royal properties and accepting hospitality on Epsteins private island, he was a fool and now paying the price.

NotSpaghetti

Sorry that was in reply to Casdon re Ronib's comment.

ronib
"The girls were paid hundreds of dollars for their services. Who received this payment?"

casdon
^ronib another irrelevant issue. Money cannot compensate for what happened to those girls. What if it was your own granddaughter? Perhaps you would think it was okay if there was enough money involved^

The money isn’t relevant to the damage caused to the girls though NotSpaghetti, regardless of who receives it, is it? welbeck made the point much better than I did though.

Yes morality, terrible thing.
And actually in terms of prostitution you would be wrong about the 'judgemental British public'. Nowadays, there are very large sections of the public who don't judge those who use prostitutes, you can barely move for their demented chants of 'sex work is work'
Those who oppose it tend to be the old school feminists, generally older women who in my experience are usually at the forefront of safeguarding women and children.

Sorry that was in reply to Casdon re Ronib's comment.

ronib
"The girls were paid hundreds of dollars for their services. Who received this payment?"

casdon
ronib another irrelevant issue. Money cannot compensate for what happened to those girls. What if it was your own granddaughter? Perhaps you would think it was okay if there was enough money involved

And until 1885? I think it was
The age of consent was 12 in Britain and Ireland.
It was raised following a scandal when a newspaper editor proved how easy it was to buy a 12 year old child from her father.
He made clear for what purpose.
When he published it and there was an outcry he was prosecuted for procurement.
Even though everything had been supervised by a chaperone and the child came to no harm.
Probably some on GN think he should have minded his business.
And that if a child is not protected by their parents then they don't much matter.

I took this to mean that her father may have pocketed it...

We know no spectacle so ridiculous as the British public in one of its periodical fits of morality Thomas Babington Macaulay

easybee
Said by someone in the early 19th century when morality and law allowed children to be sent down mines and up chimneys and women to be beaten by their husbands and denied the right to keep their children if divorced. I think Byron and his incestuous and licentious behaviour needed some moral outrage! Like Andrew - he escaped imprisonment because of his privilege and connections.,

ronib

Don’t be ridiculous - we have very few facts to go on Casdon. We simply don’t know who received the money. Were parents pimping their own children? There’s no way my precious granddaughter would ever go near these people. We have responsible parents.

You can come from the most respectable family, with the most responsible parents and still fall victim to grooming. My friend's daughter is a perfect example of that. Those who say 'oh my daughter/granddaughter etc would never do that' are either being extremely judgemental or living in cloud-cuckoo land.