Integrating a baby into family life

So it’s easy to judge, but every child is different and just because the first one was wasy, doesn’t mean the next one will be.

And the converse can be true too, Robin202!!
The first one nearly put me off having another (delightful though she turned out to be 🙂) but Number 2 was so easy. Thank goodness.

RosiesMawagain

Doodledog

RosiesMawagain

I have known 'babywearers', and far from doing it to get the cuddles in before 'leaving their children with someone else' (🙄), they have all been the type to breastfeed toddlers and stay at home making vegetarian meals

OMG - judgemental or what?
Shock horror - breastfeeding toddlers?
Even worse making vegetarian meals
I won’t bore you all by recounting examples of child- rearing eg by my Chinese sister in law who is much younger than any of us , or my own daughters, but FFS could we please park our prejudices in the century we brought up our babies in?

I’m not the one doing the judging (my children were brought up vegetarian). I am refuting the idea that babywearers are doing so out of guilt at being willing to hand over their babies to someone else, and getting the cuddles while they can. I have found the reverse to be true.

Still find the correlation of “toddler breastfeeding/vegetarian meal prep/babywearing (or carrying your baby in a sling) “ massively prejudiced and crass.
Ooh bad mothers on all counts it seems.

If you say so. I don't see any of those things as crass, but you are as entitled to your opinion as I am.

I think you may be misunderstanding my post though 😕. I also read the Guardian and voted Remain. I am not remotely prejudiced against anyone who does any of the things I mentioned. Have you read what I actually said?

Again, I was responding to the post that suggested babywearers were doing so because they were returning to work and going to be leaving their children with others, and saying that in my experience that was not the case at all. Far from being hard-hearted 'career women' they were more likely to be hippy types (hence the reference to vegetarianism and home cooking). I didn't wear my babies, but the joke was as much on me as anyone else, but think what you like.

They probably read The Guardian and voted Remain, too.

Doodledog

RosiesMawagain

I have known 'babywearers', and far from doing it to get the cuddles in before 'leaving their children with someone else' (🙄), they have all been the type to breastfeed toddlers and stay at home making vegetarian meals

OMG - judgemental or what?
Shock horror - breastfeeding toddlers?
Even worse making vegetarian meals
I won’t bore you all by recounting examples of child- rearing eg by my Chinese sister in law who is much younger than any of us , or my own daughters, but FFS could we please park our prejudices in the century we brought up our babies in?

I’m not the one doing the judging (my children were brought up vegetarian). I am refuting the idea that babywearers are doing so out of guilt at being willing to hand over their babies to someone else, and getting the cuddles while they can. I have found the reverse to be true.

Still find the correlation of “toddler breastfeeding/vegetarian meal prep/babywearing (or carrying your baby in a sling) “ massively prejudiced and crass.
Ooh bad mothers on all counts it seems.

My daughter’s first born was an easy baby, breastfed and bottle fed through pumping for a year, slept well in a cot and would accept a soother (dummy) to get him off to sleep.

Baby no.2 now 6 months, has been completely different. Breast fed, will not accept a soother nor sleep without contact from her, despite doing all the things she did with her first born. So they had to start co-sleeping which is the only thing that has worked and believe me she’s tried everything.
So it’s easy to judge, but every child is different and just because the first one was wasy, doesn’t mean the next one will be.

And refitted the kitchen, did all the DIY too.

Norah

Luckygirl3 What did others do?

My husband was gone from our home over half the day. I nursed and cared our babies alone whilst he worked (we did need him to work

When he was at home and not sleeping, he helped with our babies, shopping, gardening, cooking, cleaning. Perfectly normal, I believe.

Luckygirl3 What did others do?

And mine was gone for months at a time!

When he came home he got to know his children, caught up with gardening, cooked sometimes as well as going to work each day.

Luckygirl3 What did others do?

My husband was gone from our home over half the day. I nursed and cared our babies alone whilst he worked (we did need him to work

When he was at home and not sleeping, he helped with our babies, shopping, gardening, cooking, cleaning. Perfectly normal, I believe.

RosiesMawagain

^I have known 'babywearers', and far from doing it to get the cuddles in before 'leaving their children with someone else' (🙄), they have all been the type to breastfeed toddlers and stay at home making vegetarian meals^

OMG - judgemental or what?
Shock horror - breastfeeding toddlers?
Even worse making vegetarian meals
I won’t bore you all by recounting examples of child- rearing eg by my Chinese sister in law who is much younger than any of us , or my own daughters, but FFS could we please park our prejudices in the century we brought up our babies in?

I’m not the one doing the judging (my children were brought up vegetarian). I am refuting the idea that babywearers are doing so out of guilt at being willing to hand over their babies to someone else, and getting the cuddles while they can. I have found the reverse to be true.

Ours went in their own room quite early on and slept well too - luckily.
I breastfed too but they weren’t a million miles away, we don’t live in Downton Abbey!
I can’t imagine sleeping with a baby and never have …..cuddling for 23 hours?? I went back to work at 12 weeks.
Hopefully her husband won’t go off with Deirdre in accounts who is not sleeping/holding a baby for 23 hours a day.

My DiL is about to give birth to my 3rd grandchild - caesarian booked for next Tuesday. She breastfed both the existing two until each was close to 2 years old and consequently spent a fair bit of time holding them, but I agree with the OP that 23 hours a day is excessive. They slept in a cot in the parents' room for many months but didn't co-sleep apart from occasionally. As has been said it isn't recommended.

My son does a lot around the house, including much of the cooking when at home, but he works away part of most weeks so DiL has to manage alone much of the time. My son does far nmore than my ex did when my children were small, but my DiL could not practically spend 23 hours holding a baby - even when it was her first one.

When my DD was born she was slow to gain weight and I was encouraged to feed her for longer to increase my milk supply and top up with a bottle - which she mostly refused. I was also told to wake her in the night for a feed. I did this only twice. Both times I took her into bed with me and we both promptly fell asleep and hardly any feed was consumed! Result - an exhausted mum and a grumpy dad who had also been disturbed, so I declined that advice ongoing. i was worried about the co-sleeping aspect too, so another reason to give up waking her for a feed!

I'm not surprised this partner has got pretty fed up with the situation if he is expected to do everything while this mum simply spends time with the baby.

Smileless2012

If the mother is attached to the baby 23 hours a day, I doubt the father has the opportunity to hold his own child, never mind change a nappy.

Yes. It’s completely believable that the mother is both complaining about the father doing nothing, and fighting him when he goes to change the baby or interact with his child. I can imagine the conversation. “Hi love, let me grab the kiddo and clean him.” Wife angrily goes “no you cannot change your own child’s diaper or bond with him!!” She then turns around and complains that the dad does nothing.

Does that seem realistic? That makes sense? Of course not.

A parent who wants to parent will parent. A lazy parent will not. He doesn’t need permission to care for his own child, only a desire to do so. Babies would quite literally die by the millions if we made the same ridiculous excuses for women who refused to care for their children the way low functioning males do.

FYI two of mine were clingy. To the horror of so many here, I proudly breastfed the two of them past one year. Somehow my husband, with his stressful career, managed to be an involved father and partner. I am grateful for the example he set for my son who is now a hands-on dad himself.

My DIL did this with her second child , a son. Her other child , a daughter, was virtually ignored and her husband was left to do everything. Several years later she accused him of never bonding with his son. He never had a chance, she was holding him all the time!

If the mother is attached to the baby 23 hours a day, I doubt the father has the opportunity to hold his own child, never mind change a nappy.

It really doesn’t matter what one family did vs the next. People do what works for them. Those who think they did it the “right” compared to others’ way are a red flag for me. Loving parents both do their best and make mistakes. Modern parents work with the information they have today. So did we. If things didn’t change people would still be smacking children and smoking around them as the norm.

I’m failing to see what mum holding baby has to do with a father not pulling his weight. Chores still need to be done. A job doesn’t prevent or excuse parenting and household duties just because you have a penis. Presumably the useless dad understood this before becoming a parent. If women work and can still take care of children and home, so can men. It’s good women today aren’t putting up with this infantilising of men. It doesn’t take a genius to change the diaper of a clingy baby, nor does it take a genius to tidy up afterwork. Weaponized incompetence should grate on everyone.

Utter madness.

I think she’s making a big mistake. The poor baby and husband. Let the baby have its own time now and again and share, it’s his baby too. This should be a partnership. She must be exhausted. I’ve never heard anything like this before. What a shame for them all

ViceVersa

I dread to think what they'd make of my parenting skills on Mumsnet. My two went straight into cots in their own room from the day we brought them home from the hospital. If I had things to be getting on with, into the cot they went. I went back to work full time when they were three months old and they went to nursery or to their grandparents.

Mine too, straight into their own rooms, lights off. Naps for the first few months in a carrycot or the pram, sometimes I would turn the vacuum cleaner on near the carry cot and that always settled them.

Yes exactly Doodledog I wonder how often the baby is put on the floor for what is now called tummy time?

Anyway as has been pointed out, the purpose of the Mumsnet thread was to complain about the husband, a complaint which may well be justified, but without hearing his side of the story it’s impossible to say.

There’s enough material there though to discuss the mother’s 23 hour attachment to the baby!

Poor Luckygirl was most certainly flamed for her opinion and in fact she was sworn at by one poster!
It just reminded me why I quickly gave up on Mumsnet years ago, long before I knew of Gransnet’s existence.

I had one very clingy baby who, when he was awake wanted to be held all the time. But slept in his cot during sleeping periods and slept through the night at six weeks.

I would have liked to have seen anyone try to hold and co-sleep with my second one for 23 hours. From day 1, all she wanted to do was lie unwrapped in her cot kicking her legs, at 6 weeks she was rolling front to back and back to front and at 4 months pulling herself across the floor.

Actually I am amazed that any baby is happy being held and coslept with at 4.5 months, I would expect them to be wanting to wriggle, stetch their legs and arms and be really active, even though they cannot sit up.

I have known 'babywearers', and far from doing it to get the cuddles in before 'leaving their children with someone else' (🙄), they have all been the type to breastfeed toddlers and stay at home making vegetarian meals

OMG - judgemental or what?
Shock horror - breastfeeding toddlers?
Even worse making vegetarian meals
I won’t bore you all by recounting examples of child- rearing eg by my Chinese sister in law who is much younger than any of us , or my own daughters, but FFS could we please park our prejudices in the century we brought up our babies in?

Ridiculous but why are you involving yourself in this?

... maybe the father would like a turn at sleeping with or cuddling up to the baby for a couple of those hours - it would help him to bond, and his wife could exercise her legs a bit...

4allweknow

My goodness I am now feeling I totally neglected by children. How can anyone, at least in the modern world, be attached to a baby for 23 hours. How would the mother in question manage with twins, lugging them around, one maybe asleep, one wide awake. The man involved has some sense at least, just hope the mother develops some too and soon.

Yeah! Wot cruel mums we were 🤣🤣🤣🤣

Also, back in the day, we didn’t have the options of months and months off with paid mat leave.

Although mine were born 1985, 1997, 2000 & 2002 respectively, I took a maximum of four months off (with one it just 6 weeks).

How does a baby learn to crawl and walk if s/he is strapped to the mum all the time?

I have known 'babywearers', and far from doing it to get the cuddles in before 'leaving their children with someone else' (🙄), they have all been the type to breastfeed toddlers and stay at home making vegetarian meals. I don't think any of them wore their babies for much beyond four months or so though. They get very heavy and wriggly at that age.

I haven't read the MN thread, so don't know the context of the question, but I do think that on one hand if people ask for the opinions of others they should expect to get them, and on the other things like child-rearing are individual matters, and (as we see so often on here) what works for one mum won't for another, so there is no need to criticise others' ways unless you want to be hurtful.