The DWP's £10 Christmas "Bonus"

My friend was fitted in during a quiet time, and had the excess skin above her eyes surgically removed, in an nhs hospital!

And she only waited about a week, too.

Would those who object to MPs' 'perks' prefer to see nobody have more than a basic salary? If so, how far would that go?

Should everyone be restricted to the legal minimum of holidays, for instance? Is it fair that not everyone gets the same amount of paid time off? Is it hypocritical of those with lots of holiday to go to (eg) a hairdresser who is paid less and still gets less than half the time off and expect to be served, or should we all have the same number of weeks as holiday?

Or mileage allowances for those who use vehicles as part of their work? Or train/plane fares and hotel bills if people are away from home on business? Is it wrong for those to be paid on top of salary?

Should we all contribute to the heating bills of our workplaces? That would be tricky to work out for people with jobs like mine, which required me to be in different buildings at different times of day, although my office was on a centrally controlled heating system, so was heated all day. Still, I suppose one way of thinking would suggest that I was saving on my bills at home by sitting in my warm office.

What about people who live in homes that are owned by their employers? Right to buy has seen the numbers shrink, but there are still school caretakers, vicars and others who have a 'tied' house. Should that be stopped as there is a housing shortage?

BUPA membership? Discounts for NHS workers? Apple Education discounts? Costco membership😉

Obviously anyone drunk or partying at work would expect to be fired (wouldn't they?), but if someone is caught printing a knitting pattern on the office printer, should they be forced to resign? Or using the internet to post on FB (or GN)? What about charging your phone in the office?

Much of this is accepted by most, as it it recognised that different jobs have different requirements and different benefits. Also, in many cases people use their homes as well as their workplaces for their employers' benefit. I was often up late (using my electricity and heating) on my own laptop, using my internet connection to work, and would print things ready for the next day. Of course I should be able to charge my phone at work and use the internet when I had a break, or come in a bit late if something was happening at home and I had no time-critical commitments at work. If my colleagues and I had stuck rigidly to contract things would have been very different, and would have worked against the employer, which is, no doubt, why they were happy for things to continue as they did.

I was briefly a civil servant in the past. We had a heavily subsidised canteen, which wasn't uncommon. People used to get luncheon vouchers - are they still a thing? My sister currently works for a commercial organisation who offer subsidised food and free parking (via an agreement with the local council). Is that corrupt?

My point is that many people have employee 'perks' which might be given as incentives, might be for operational convenience, or for all sorts of reasons. Why should MPs be any different?

Why not just leave it as it is therefore not fret about all the changes and costs/possible tax thresholds changes if changes.

Maybe you’re right Mollygo, some people are definitely in a loop of not believing anything any government tells them, particularly this one. I’m in favour of all governments simplifying administrative processes where there is no detriment to the people served wherever possible though, because long term it both reduces errors in process, and saves the country resources.

Do you know, my maths was askew yesterday, so you’re right Casdon, it would be less.
You don’t think people would care as they’d still be getting the money.

I think people wouldn’t believe they’re getting the money.

And if the government sent out letters to every pensioner (as with the WFP) telling them that they were withdrawing the £10 Christmas bonus, but the money would be assimilated into their pension rise, the organisation, and postage for that would take care of most of it, and the treasury would need the rest of it to work out how many extra pennies each pensioner should get, see how little it is and probably decide not to bother.
Meanwhile, the cabinet will be sitting in their cosily heated offices,
claiming their desperately necessary expenses,
and eating their delightfully subsidised meals, patting themselves on the back at having taken more money money off pensioners,and not giving a hoot.

Mollygo

It could indeed, but first there’d have to be an announcement, and all the kerfuffle trying to justify it, then the appointment of another group or person to administer it and then . . . it would still only be 50p per week for 50 weeks of the year, unless it was swallowed up in admin.

I don’t know, if they announced they were doing it when the new year’s pension amount was agreed, and assimilated it rather than taking it away, I don’t think people would care, as they would still be getting the money. It’s actually less than 20p per week.

Thank you Jilly, look out for requests for help and advice in the legal or health sections, there are also recurrent discussions on pensions

I'm new here * but run a help group on another social media site. I was reading through this thread gradually despairing of the lack of knowledge ( or could that be ^^acknowledgment ) of the benefits system. Thankfully you commented !

If anyone wants any help ( and it's allowed ) I'll happily point you in our direction ( one of my fellow volunteers works in Pension Credit , I'm retired from Housing and Council Tax Benefit and have provided Welfare Advice for local governments and disability charities )

* Hope it's ok to be here, as I'm neither a gran ( never had the chance ) nor a pensioner though, at 58, I am technically retired. I'm a proud harridan and also run on tea

It could indeed, but first there’d have to be an announcement, and all the kerfuffle trying to justify it, then the appointment of another group or person to administer it and then . . . it would still only be 50p per week for 50 weeks of the year, unless it was swallowed up in admin.

Mollygo

That would be an extra 50p per week for 50 weeks of the year, minus the management fee for setting up and running the system.

It could just be added on to the weekly payment changes made when the pension goes up one April, then it wouldn’t be an extra burden.

I know very well your feelings about means-tested benefits. Putting those aside for a moment, I'm just a bit of a stickler for facts. People claiming Pension Credit don't have to answer 233 questions. The form for Pension Credit is very similar to that for claiming Universal Credit and (I would imagine) every kind of benefit. I find it a little ironic that on GN we're more likely to hear about scroungers when benefits are concerned - but these are people who have also had to complete forms with loads and loads of questions. Why do people think it's an issue for Pension Credit, but not all the other benefits?
I'm not sure why this was addressed to me (I didn't do a massive nested quote, but it was in reply to a post of mine).

I didn't say anyone did have to answer 233 questions - I was responding to a post that sarcastically asked whether MPs would have to do so to get some sort of unspecified benefit for which none of them will qualify. Of course they don't, and they wouldn't even if others did - MPs can't claim Pension Credit, so the idea is barmy.

I don't go on about scroungers, so I'm not sure about that reference either. In fact I have pointed out the dichotomy between posts about claimants, with their flat screen TVs (can you get any other kind these days?), 'latest' phones and gel nails, and those about older people who can afford second homes, foreign holidays and so on 'being robbed of the WFP'.

I don't know what my views on means-testing have to do with any of it, TBH. I don't approve of it (means-testing), but neither do I think that it is an outrage to stop paying people what was always a discretionary payment if they are on a high income. As ever, the problems arise when people have paid into something (in this case a pension) that lifts them out of being able to claim for things they would have got if they hadn't provided for themselves. That is the sort of anomaly that works against encouraging people to improve their lives and keeps them 'in their place' and dependent on benefits that take away control of their lives. That is the main reason (although there are others) why I dislike means-testing.

Rosie51

Doodledog

Mollygo

Even though there has been a recent increase, I (and I would imagine everybody else) am still paying less per unit for fuel than I was this time last year.
I’m happy for you. Unfortunately, that doesn’t apply to me AND the standing charge has increased by a lot.

The standing charge should be abolished, IMO. It's ridiculous that people are charged for fuel they aren't using (eg when they are away) and it denies them the chance to save on bills by staying with relatives or whatever.

My standing charges for electricity and gas come to £250 per year without using one single unit of either fuel. That's nearly £21 a month which is not a negligible cost. Of course the unit price would need a small upward adjustment to compensate for this loss of revenue but would enable savings on fuel bills with judicious use. For some the standing charges in summer could be greater than their usage which is ridiculous.

My standing charges are actually a little higher than that, but the decrease in unit costs still means I'm paying less than last year for more or less the same usage.

Of course, as a low user, I'd love it if the standing charge were abolished because my low usage would mean I'd be paying quite a bit less than I am now.

Doodledog

Freya5

PoliticsNerd

argymargy

Winter fuel allowance has not been axed.

No, it hasn't. It is still being paid to those on Pension Credit.

To balance that those receiving Pension Credit - those rcognised as the poorest retirees - lost around £1,000 Cost of Living payment they had been getting annually for the last couple of years.

It is also still being paid to very well off MPs. Lets not forget that.
Wonder if they have to fill in a 233 page document to claim it.
Of course not, don't be silly!!!

What is being paid to 'very well-off MPs'?

Pension Credit? I doubt it.

WFP? No, unless they are on Pension Credit.

Cost of Living Payment? Not unless they were in receipt of benefits, such as Universal Credit; income-based Jobseeker's Allowance; income-related Employment and Support Allowance; income support; Pension Credit; Working Tax Credit, and Child Tax Credit.

So there will be no form of any length to be filled in by MPs, and nothing claimed by MPs, other than work-related expenses which are available in various forms to many workers who have to spend time away from home.

Maybe the structure of MPs' salaries needs to be looked at, but it is the same now as it was under the last government (under all of the various PMs' jurisdictions) and it is entirely separate from the WFP and the Christmas bonus, so linking them is pointless.

I expect MPs do have to fill in forms to claim their expenses, but of course they employ staff to do it.

I know very well your feelings about means-tested benefits. Putting those aside for a moment, I'm just a bit of a stickler for facts. People claiming Pension Credit don't have to answer 233 questions. The form for Pension Credit is very similar to that for claiming Universal Credit and (I would imagine) every kind of benefit. I find it a little ironic that on GN we're more likely to hear about scroungers when benefits are concerned - but these are people who have also had to complete forms with loads and loads of questions. Why do people think it's an issue for Pension Credit, but not all the other benefits?

Doodledog

Mollygo

Even though there has been a recent increase, I (and I would imagine everybody else) am still paying less per unit for fuel than I was this time last year.
I’m happy for you. Unfortunately, that doesn’t apply to me AND the standing charge has increased by a lot.

The standing charge should be abolished, IMO. It's ridiculous that people are charged for fuel they aren't using (eg when they are away) and it denies them the chance to save on bills by staying with relatives or whatever.

I agree with you about the standing charge. Mine has, of course, increased too. Nevertheless, even accounting for the increase in standing charge, I am still paying less per unit (with the standing charge averaged out) this year than I was last year. I can't really understand why anybody is paying more for their fuel now, unless they had built up a deficit.

Doodledog

Mollygo

Even though there has been a recent increase, I (and I would imagine everybody else) am still paying less per unit for fuel than I was this time last year.
I’m happy for you. Unfortunately, that doesn’t apply to me AND the standing charge has increased by a lot.

The standing charge should be abolished, IMO. It's ridiculous that people are charged for fuel they aren't using (eg when they are away) and it denies them the chance to save on bills by staying with relatives or whatever.

My standing charges for electricity and gas come to £250 per year without using one single unit of either fuel. That's nearly £21 a month which is not a negligible cost. Of course the unit price would need a small upward adjustment to compensate for this loss of revenue but would enable savings on fuel bills with judicious use. For some the standing charges in summer could be greater than their usage which is ridiculous.

Doodledog

Mollygo

Even though there has been a recent increase, I (and I would imagine everybody else) am still paying less per unit for fuel than I was this time last year.
I’m happy for you. Unfortunately, that doesn’t apply to me AND the standing charge has increased by a lot.

The standing charge should be abolished, IMO. It's ridiculous that people are charged for fuel they aren't using (eg when they are away) and it denies them the chance to save on bills by staying with relatives or whatever.

Some providers have no standing charge, but charge more for the fuel, medium to high energy users can end up worse off.
If the standing charge was to be abolished, it would benefit only very low energy users, people away from home for long periods, etc.

The standing charge should be abolished, IMO. It's ridiculous that people are charged for fuel they aren't using (eg when they are away) and it denies them the chance to save on bills by staying with relatives or whatever.
I wish! I wish it even more for those who already can’t afford heating.
But if they abolish the standing charge they would increase the fuel prices even more, to cover the loss of revenue.

Similar to what happened IMO with water. We swapped to a water meter, with lower costs. e.g. from £72 pm to around £10 pm. So did many others. Next news, they increased my water/sewage bill by nearly 3x that amount.

They've probably forgotten about it. After all it's loose change to them.

sandev67

They can keep their £10 as far as I'm concerned.

You can't refuse it, as far as I know, but if you want the government to have it you could donate it to the Labour Party - it's probably easiest to do that locally than centrally for a one-off sum.

Jackiest

Don't worry as they as not raising the tax thresholds we will all soon be paying tax even we only get the standard basic government pension.

No. Nothing will change until 2027

www.lcp.com/en/media-centre/press-releases/new-state-pension-guaranteed-to-exceed-tax-threshold-in-2027-under-triple-lock-policy

and that is for the new higher levels state pension not the old one.

It is to be reviewed in 2027 by which time we may well have a review of thresholds anyway.

Mollygo

^Even though there has been a recent increase, I (and I would imagine everybody else) am still paying less per unit for fuel than I was this time last year.^
I’m happy for you. Unfortunately, that doesn’t apply to me AND the standing charge has increased by a lot.

The standing charge should be abolished, IMO. It's ridiculous that people are charged for fuel they aren't using (eg when they are away) and it denies them the chance to save on bills by staying with relatives or whatever.

They can keep their £10 as far as I'm concerned.

Freya5

PoliticsNerd

argymargy

Winter fuel allowance has not been axed.

No, it hasn't. It is still being paid to those on Pension Credit.

To balance that those receiving Pension Credit - those rcognised as the poorest retirees - lost around £1,000 Cost of Living payment they had been getting annually for the last couple of years.

It is also still being paid to very well off MPs. Lets not forget that.
Wonder if they have to fill in a 233 page document to claim it.
Of course not, don't be silly!!!

What is being paid to 'very well-off MPs'?

Pension Credit? I doubt it.

WFP? No, unless they are on Pension Credit.

Cost of Living Payment? Not unless they were in receipt of benefits, such as Universal Credit; income-based Jobseeker's Allowance; income-related Employment and Support Allowance; income support; Pension Credit; Working Tax Credit, and Child Tax Credit.

So there will be no form of any length to be filled in by MPs, and nothing claimed by MPs, other than work-related expenses which are available in various forms to many workers who have to spend time away from home.

Maybe the structure of MPs' salaries needs to be looked at, but it is the same now as it was under the last government (under all of the various PMs' jurisdictions) and it is entirely separate from the WFP and the Christmas bonus, so linking them is pointless.

Even though there has been a recent increase, I (and I would imagine everybody else) am still paying less per unit for fuel than I was this time last year.
I’m happy for you. Unfortunately, that doesn’t apply to me AND the standing charge has increased by a lot.

Due to the issue of WFA this year far more pensioners are accessing their WFA than before because so many didn't realise they were eligible- that has to be a good thing?

As for the £10 it will buy me a bottle of wine with which I shall toast the government this Christmas.