Gransnet forums


What Sweden's doing and why

(8 Posts)
Baggs Tue 21-Apr-20 07:26:09

Video of discussion between Freddie Sayers of ^UnHerd^ and Johan Giesecke, one of the world's most senior epidemiologists.
There are useful notes below the video section if you don't want to listen.

Como2020 Tue 21-Apr-20 08:39:09

A refreshing and interesting take.
I appreciated the pragmatic and informative approach, as it helped me to centre my views and perspectives regarding the control of this virus.
No banner headlines, no media/twitter storms, no flame fanning, no outrage nor indulging in the blame game, no Chinese whispers or politicking.
Thanks for this.

Nortsat Tue 21-Apr-20 09:10:48

Thank you Baggs, interesting.
I don’t think our experience of UK Govt policy or the international data bear out these assertions.
It seems that South Korea, with their lock down, vigorous tracking and tracing and significant numbers of tests, have had some of the best outcomes. Their population is c60 million (therefore similar to UK) and their death rates are by far some of the lowest.

Austria has a similar number of CV19 cases as Sweden but the Austrian death rates are 60% lower than those of Sweden.

We have been watching the Swedish actions and results because they seem to be so counter to those of other countries. It also appears that the less strict approach to lockdown has led to Swedish death rates being far higher than those of their Scandinavian neighbours in Norway, Finland or Denmark.

BlueBelle Tue 21-Apr-20 09:14:06

Unfortunately the last figures show they are not doing quite so well in the Corvid battle
I also think there is little value in comparing countries unless it s like for like Sweden is nearly twice as big an areas as Uk and has a population of nearly 10 mill that is 60 million LESS likewise NZ is held up as a shining example of how it should be done but it’s the same size country as U.K. but under 5 million people it’s like comparing teaching a class of 5 with a class of 50
Their house are nearly all detached with gardens even the cities are only the size of our large towns of course it s going to be a dream to organist and look after those countries compare that to inner city London or NY
I m not defending our gov I think it’s a shambles and there needs to be a huge enquiry after this decreases it’s abysmal and heads need to roll just saying it’s easier to control small numbers of people than overcrowded

Sparklefizz Tue 21-Apr-20 10:51:16

If you don't compare like for like, there is no comparison at all.

Sparklefizz Tue 21-Apr-20 10:56:19

You also have to compare population compliance. Countries such as South Korea and China have populations that have vigorous government restrictions and therefore enforced compliance, whereas we don't. Ditto the Middle East.

Our Govt was far too liberal at the start because of "people's rights". There would have been an outcry if all airports had been closed and complete lockdown imposed at the end of February which is what happened where my granddaughter is working in the Middle East.

Farmor15 Tue 21-Apr-20 11:55:08

Unfortunately we're not hearing much of the reality of the Swedish situation. We have a son living there who used to work in daycare centre for disabled adults. He's still in touch with some of former work colleagues and it seems the centre has no policy in place if any of the "clients" get Covid 19 and no protection for staff. When on of the staff members raised the issue with management she was mocked for making a fuss!

I think a lot of people are dying in nursing homes but since there's little testing, it's not being reported.

Luckygirl Tue 21-Apr-20 12:34:37

He has a point - very long-windedly expressed! - that we are just putting off the inevitable and the focus should be on protecting the vulnerable whilst allowing herd immunity to develop. And that lockdown measures cannot be politically acceptable for long in democracies.

But the strategy we currently have was designed to buy time to increase health service capacity, and to look for treatments or vaccines. And the end result of this would be saved lives - which is the ultimate aim. So for me the policy we have makes sense; but it took too long to begin.