Should lockdown for the over 70s be extended when it’s relaxed for everyone else?

There is nowhere to go anyway. We are all in this together, and must continue to safeguard against putting ourselves, others and the nhs at risk. Got to be done. You could however go for a daily walk which is exceptionally good for body and soul ?

Davinia I think you make an interesting point (although maybe not for the reason you think).

If somebody has high blood pressure, cholesterol or blood sugar, any medic would be negligent not to tell the patient. If losing weight, exercising more, stopping smoking and cutting down on alcohol would help the conditions, the patient should be told and then has the choice to do something about it. I have read numerous posts on GN and elsewhere suggesting that people who choose not to help themselves are perhaps not deserving of NHS treatment if they subsequently become ill.

I see parallels with the Covid-19 situation. People should be told that their age is a risk factor for being affected badly. Obviously, they can't do anything about their age, but they can do something about reducing their risk of catching it. That's not to do with the "government telling them what to do" but looking after themselves. The NHS will try to treat everybody but, sadly, the survival rate for some groups is not good and resources might need to be prioritised.

As others have said, people are not being told to lock down (shield) merely because they are over 70. They are being advised to do the same as almost everybody else, but they are strongly advised ie. don't cut corners, don't make excuses, don't think that just one hug or meeting a friend won't make a difference, make absolutely sure you don't touch your face when out and about. This is the same advice as people under 70 with underlying conditions are receiving.

Again so far nobody is Forbidden in this country!

Message to all those criticising the elderly for wanting to leave lockdown.

Stigmatising us for putting NHS resources at risk during the crisis.

Why don't you pick on those who chose a lifestyle of obesity and stagnation; crisis or not? Selfishness which has caused a massive rise in NHS expenditure on bariatric beds, ambulances with strengthened chasis and an exponential growth in diabetes care costs.

Resources that could be used to save lives.

They have been given medical advice and chosen to ignore it. "You made your bariatric bed - lay in it"

Stigmatise based on selfishness and not on an arbitrary age.

Trully missed the point there Davinia. This was said to be an invisible war from the beginning therefore you have a frontline. And the frontline is trying to do everything to protect everybody else not just those of a certain age. This isn't about picking on anyone more trying to protect as many people as possible.
And this battle is far from other and surely it's better to stay safe.

Over not other

Oopsminty - if they ask people over 50 to keep isolating, things will soon fall apart as plenty of people over 50 are still working. This applies to plenty of us who are over 60 too.

As far as over 70's are concerned, it's hard. I know they are more susceptible but there are other considerations too - mental health for a start. Many 70 year olds are healthier than people decades younger.

There is no use them bringing in a rule that they can't absolutely police. We don't carry ID cards and not everyone has a passport or driving licence. Police etc. would not always be able to tell if a person was over 70.

Sorry AllatSea48 but I think you are being patronising. I already do many of those things, and you can’t tell someone with depression to keep smiling. Maybe you don’t have experience of depression in your life - I hope not. Someone very dear to me, who took his own life a few years ago, couldn’t ‘keep’ smiling because he’d lost the ability to smile at all several years before. These things are hard for people who’ve never experienced them to comprehend, so I don’t blame you for saying this: it’s a natural reaction; but believe me, depression is as much an invisible killer as Covid 19 and when - I fervently hope - we have conquered the virus, it will continue to be a terrible scourge, particularly of the young. If you comb through this thread you will see a few posts from people who say ‘life is not worth living without ...’ They are speaking from the heart. Depression deprives you of hope. We need to be able to look forward to something, however distant. I’m particularly moved by the post from elfie, whose husband feels he’s been deprived of the good life he has left.

The scientific data which is emerging at the moment is that, in addition to Covid-19 being particularly risky for the over 70s, those who are from black and ethnic minorities and also those who are obese are also at very high risk. Can you imagine the outcry if the latter 2 groups were requested to stay at home? Also, men are more likely to succumb to the illness than women, so who is brave enough to suggest that men should be confined to barracks?

Both of our daughters and one son in law work on the front line NHS.
Every extra person admitted to hospital puts their lives at risk and could possibly leave up to 4 small children without a parent. Just do as you’re asked and stop being so selfish.

Sadly, I don't think life is going to be normal for a very long time. I understand how you feel Masquerader or anyone else who may be fed up. However, have you discussed with your families how they will feel if you become seriously ill or worse?Things like restaurants, cinema etc are not going to be open and even Greggs has changed it's mind about opening for now. The only thing I can say is try to take each day as it comes. Distract yourself, if you think about all the things you cannot do and go on about having no life, you will begin to believe this and that would be a tragedy. Every life is precious, every person is precious and we are in lockdown not only for ourselves, but for other people. Im sorry if this is not what people want to hear. I just honestly don't know what to say that could make you and others feel better. Please look after yourselves and each other.

When you say "do as you are asked" what exactly does that mean for over 70's?

Grannyjacq1 made an excellent point that no-one would dare say people who are obese or from a black and ethnic minority should stay on lockdown longer.

It would be considered very very wrong on so many levels.

When you look at it from this point of view, you have to be extremely careful about saying over 70's ought to stay in lockdown longer.

There is support for taking people with BAME backgrounds off the front line when treating Covid-19 patients - for their own safety.

Why is that any different from advising people with additional risk from serious affects from staying at home - for their own safety?

PS. Once again, people over 70 are not being "locked down" if they don't have additional underlying health conditios.

Working in NHS currently redeployed to the bereavement office........Hearing so many people say of their loved one (regardless of age) - they were fit and never ill, we don’t know where this has come from but it was so sudden ........do any of us want any of our family saying similar about us?

Instead of being self-pitying and moaning about age discrimination, how about being thankful that you can stay safely at home? People start becoming more vulnerable over the age of 50, but most people below retirement age are going to have to go out and earn a living when the lockdown lifts. That includes working people with underlying health issues. Aren't they worse off, running the risk of being very ill and dying, than we are at home?

It's not about age discrimination. We're at a higher risk of dying, if we catch the virus, than younger people. That's all there is to it. Doesn't matter if you're as fit as a fiddle, your immune system is as old as you are and it doesn't work so well. It's a scientific fact, just like the fact that men are more vulnerable than women - again for scientific reasons, mainly genetic.

It's your choice. If you don't care about your family being bereaved, what about the doctors, nurses and other health workers? What about the NHS resources you're using up? What about the unfortunate people who have to decide who lives and who dies if the NHS gets overwhelmed?

Yes, it's your choice and no one can stop you, but you won't be the only one affected if you get seriously ill.

Very well said, Bluecat!

no lock down for anyone .unless you have a severe health problem....and you feel you can stay in lock down.

I guess it depends how much you want to stay alive, yes you can go out but you have to accept the responsibility that if you catch the virus you are more likely to die because your immune system isn’t so good.

Allatsea48 good post and some good pointers. It's difficult when the mind is set on negativity and extra hard to stay positive.

I agree with masquereader, it's not a life, and I believe I can practice physical distancing without much difficulty.
I will certainly go crazy if I can't go for a walk soon.

I totally agree with this. I was 70 last year, but go to the gym five days a week (at least I used to) and still teach in an independent school three days a week (currently from my study). I really resent the 'over 70's' being lumped together as a bunch of decrepit, sickly, irresponsible old dodderers who have to be protected for their own good. I find this stance really patronising. It's presumably due to the fact that no one in the Cabinet is past 55!

You are NOT being lumped together as a bunch of decrepit, sickly, irresponsible old dodderers!!!!! Read the official government advice!!!

If you are over 70, you have been advised (along with younger people with certain health conditions) that you are at higher risk and should be especially careful about following the advice to socially distance, wash hands, etc.

You are only being advised to "shield" yourself if you have a defined list of serious conditions, which don't depend on age at all.

The funny thing is I don’t know think anyone gives a stuff about our health. It’s all about protecting someone else. We are bring discriminated against.
Next thing I know someone will be telling not to light a fire in case I burn my house down and am a burden to the fire service who at normal times put their lives at risk attending fires and see dreadful things at road accidents.
It’s that silly.

Is it so wrong of the Chief Medical Officer and his department to make us all aware who is the most vulnerable in this pandemic? Would they not be slated if they failed to provide this information?

But when they do there are those who decry them as discriminating against over 70s and BAME - both groups at greater risk. Sounds like a determination to take offence where none has been given.

The results of being aware of these greater risk mean that some might have to take more precautions - now, I do not like them any more than anyone else - but I have been provided with the knowledge on which to make a decision. As is entirely right and proper.

Of course there is the additional factor that we might not just put ourselves at risk by ignoring the advice, but others too, especially those who might have to care for us and for those who might catch it from us (even though we might be symptom free).

I do not take lightly the effects of the deprivations that now constitute a major part of our lives: I have a history of depression and have recently lost my OH of 50 years - so it is a huge challenge. But it is one that I have no choice but to face with as good a grace as I can muster.

I do find all this nonsensical talk about being discriminated against slightly irritating. You may not realise how lucky you are!