Lack of transparency within SAGE

I too think 'the science' is just a fudging term to cover all sorts of cock ups and inaccuracies. Honesty and transparency would be much preferred as we are old enough and, hopefully, wise enough to make our own evaluations but then when did honesty and transparency play much of a part in politics?

I'm no fan but according to many news outlets Cummings was asking why we weren't going into lockdown sooner

It hasn't been broadcast yet, but that link tells you about it.

Just posted it Romola.

This is the link to the introductory YouTube broadcast:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNQKdzwu8_M

Has anyone else found the YouTube livestream of the "alternative SAGE" meeting?

suzie Did you see Prof Brian Cox's video about "the science"? As he said, there is no such thing as "the science" - he was fuming about the language currently being used.

It's not just Dominic Cummings who concerns me. His sidekick, Ben Warner, also attended some SAGE meetings. Ben Warner's brother, Marc, won the contract for the NHS tracking app. Allegedly, it wasn't put out to tender and he's been paid £250,000 for it.

That sounds more than a bit dodgy to me and must be a conflict of interest (IMO).

I'm glad another, hopefully truly independent, group has been set up.

The government has lost a lot of credibility. How the government interprets advice is political. The advice is just that, not a set of instructions. How could Sage be advising just about the opposite of what every other country has chosen to do? Even the lockdown is half hearted. The mortality rate speaks for itself. I look forward to seeing what this group comes out with. I wish they had acted sooner.

especially his assertion that the only way the Government could find out what was being said at the meetings was for Cummins to attend and report back to them.

The Scientific Advisory Group is not a new group, it has been in existence for at least a decade.

According to the initial report in the Guardian a search of minutes of previous meetings showed that political advisers have not attended SAGE meetings in the past. Which makes me think that there will be a well established mechanism for reporting SAGE proceedings to the the government which doesn't involve political advisers. It is, after all, an advisory group so there would be absolutely no point in them not reporting to the government.

Sir Jeremy Farrar is a director of the Wellcome Trust and has had a distinguished career.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeremy_Farrar

He really should know better than to make such silly statements.

I would be more inclined to trust that the government if they were more open about what the scientists are actually advising, and that political decisions are not hiding behind the science.

It will be interesting to hear what this new group, who are drawn from a cross section of leading scientists working across public health, computer modelling, behavioural science and intensive care medicine, have to say.

I lost faith when I heard Dominic Cummings attended.

David King is always worth a listen - I’m pleased he’s done this. We need to be disabused of the idea that there is something called ‘the science’ . Hearing a group of scientists discuss issues and the range of (probably) conflicting evidence available might help. I listened to Jeremy Farrar ( SAGE member) being ‘interviewed’ on R4 this morning - some of what he said was shocking ( and completely unchallenged of course) especially his assertion that the only way the Government could find out what was being said at the meetings was for Cummins to attend and report back to them. What? That’s why we need to know exactly what is said.

I think the SAGE group have recently been named by the Guardian but heard today that some members work for the government which if correct is surely the opposite of independent.