Up to the 2nd December.

Tillybelle ?

For political reasons the Government had to try a lock down to slow down the spread rate, it will probably help. There are a great many exemptions key workers, schools, child care and many others, so plenty of scope for bending the rules, in the past 3 months there has been plenty of rulebending.

Infection rate will certainly rise again afterwards, the best we can hope for is a vaccine in the new year, otherwise most of us are going to be exposed, if we already haven’t been.

growstuff. apart from the previous year's deaths at that period, presumably.
I put it there to be quick.

However my rather geeky watch over the statistics did find that the flu deaths in UK were higher.

Of course there are many rates of death that are a disgrace imho in the UK such as TB although it is improving. Cancer obviously remains a big priority and the lockdown caused delays and interruptions in diagnosis and treatment for different reasons.

We could discuss it for ever. I simply agree with those who say I am glad I do not have to make the final decision. I do not envy the PM. I think we need to support his decision and do our best.

My 70th on 2nd Dec,....I should think the chances of lockdown ending then is nil ....my son missed his 40th ....my daughter her 45th....my grandson his first teenage birthday. All this year.... so why not make it a full round!!??

My daughter (a first year university student) was told prior to the announcement that all lectures would be online until March, at least. She's in halls with 15 others in her flat. Without fail, every single one of them is staying to the guidelines - no partying (a few drinks once a week - strictly in their bubble, in their flat - she doesn't drink as she has a medical problem that doesn't allow her to). They all desperately want to come home for Christmas so they're doing all they can to ensure it. They are sensible young adults who know they will be blamed for spreading the virus when, in fact, the vast majority are petrified of doing so, so are behaving. We only hear of the covidiots. I know this lockdown will cripple people financially (myself included) but what else can he do? And yes, I think he should have sanctioned a proper lockdown with schools, colleges etc closing as these are places where it is spreading exponentially and, obviously, it spreads outwards from there and affects staff who can't keep a social distance (because, kids!) and aren't allowed masks. Schools etc should be able to take these weeks to create a rota system where some kids are in one week, off the next, etc., and learning is concentrated in the weeks they are in. Fewer children in class, more social distancing enabled, less risk of catching the virus. And yes, I know this would go down like a lead balloon with working parents, but something needs to happen until we can get control. Oh, almost forgot- and close our borders! Why are they still open? (Phew, I think living alone has finally got to me - I needed that little rant - all done now, nothing to see here...)

What guidelines are available for grandparents over 60 childminding in lockdown?
We are 62 and 71 and look after grandson one day a week over the border in Scotland
surely nationwide guidance is necessary?

I agree with you Tillybelle. I'm horrified by anybody talking about people being alive who shouldn't be and describing people as "wimps".

Thank you Tillybelle. And good luck, good health, good wishes, good everything, to you too and to everyone.
Cheers! I'm going to be cheerful if it kills me !

Nannapat1

Let's face it, the virus is passed through human contact and it doesn't care where that contact is, workplace, public transport, private home, pub, hospital etc. We must also accept that we may never find a vaccine, or at least a very effective one. The virus will stay with us, although one might hope that it mutates and weakens as time goes on.
We can't stay realistically in an endless cycle of lockdowns.
The vulnerable can be given advice but surely it is ultimately a personal decision as to how much risk to take.

It depends where people work. Some people have no choice except to work in environments where close contact is unavoidable.

growstuff. Fair point. Thanks.

Americanpie

Yesterday there was a report in the newspaper that three leading research universities had each published their own papers and none of them agreed on anything. There are now doubts that the virus is airborne and one leading scientist believes that it is on phones, door handles, keyboards and on face masks that are worn for long periods and get damp. It all seems to be guess work. What I do believe is that we were safer keeping apart, washing our hands and not wearing masks. I feel really sorry for the hospitality and retail workers who will face 2021 unemployed and without the chance of getting a job.

No, it's not guesswork. Where did you read that?

henetha
I just had to say I agree and identify with every word you wrote! Oh! perhaps except that I have a daughter, not a son!

Good luck! To everybody! Good luck, good health, Happiness and God bless you all!

Tillybelle Those statistics aren't relevant to the UK, where there are relatively few deaths from infectious diseases. They are an issue in less developed countries, but not in most developed countries.

Yesterday there was a report in the newspaper that three leading research universities had each published their own papers and none of them agreed on anything. There are now doubts that the virus is airborne and one leading scientist believes that it is on phones, door handles, keyboards and on face masks that are worn for long periods and get damp. It all seems to be guess work. What I do believe is that we were safer keeping apart, washing our hands and not wearing masks. I feel really sorry for the hospitality and retail workers who will face 2021 unemployed and without the chance of getting a job.

Let's face it, the virus is passed through human contact and it doesn't care where that contact is, workplace, public transport, private home, pub, hospital etc. We must also accept that we may never find a vaccine, or at least a very effective one. The virus will stay with us, although one might hope that it mutates and weakens as time goes on.
We can't stay realistically in an endless cycle of lockdowns.
The vulnerable can be given advice but surely it is ultimately a personal decision as to how much risk to take.

BlueBell
I too live in a very low risk county but wholeheartedly accept the lockdown. It should have been done a month ago. I do agree with schools staying open.

I can't disagree with you more about picking and choosing who locks down .

We didn't do a total lockdown till July! It started to ease on 10th May. Then it was slowly released. It would be foolhardy to stop the lockdown completely after this 28 day lockdown.

There are reports of a wave starting in July (holidays in Spain) that was due to no isolation there and here.

I've read the summary report from our local MP on what's to stop. Overseas travel is one. He also included no one to stop in their holiday / second homes.

Lock down the vulnerable? Most are still in a lockdown situation since the last one. Think of the mental health issues associated with that. This group of people need to feel the country is working together on this. That means we all lock down and work together in supporting each other.

Carry on carrying on. No. Think of others who will suffer as the cases get higher and the hospitals fill up. There are no guarantees in life regarding COVID.

Track and trace is working very well. Husband and I both tested positive on Monday, track and trace straight on to us, texts and phone calls nearly every day

Mooney59

growstuff

BlueBelle

I totally agree with the second set of scientists lock down the vulnerable and carry on carrying on

Between 20 and 30 million people in the UK are considered to be clinically at high risk. Shielding them all would involve locking up between a third and almost half of the population.

The Government and health officials have urged the 1.5 million people in England considered most at risk from coronavirus because of their health conditions to begin “shielding” themselves.
People like you are part of the problem. Stop exaggerating.
Isolate the vulnerable and carry on!
Ps I am one of them but do not want everyone suffering for m6 problem

Oh well! Thank you very much! I happen to be somebody who is at high risk, but not very high risk, so was never shielded. Having said that, I live on my own and have left the house about six times since March, so am hardly contributing to a "problem", despite finding it difficult at times. Those who have been ignoring the guidelines/rules/laws and transmitting the virus are the problem.

It is a fact (whether you like it or not) that there are about 20 to 30 million people in the UK who are over 60 or have a medical condition and/or ethnic background which puts them at high risk. Where would you have the "lockdown" threshold?

Carolpaint. you said:

We have a high death rate because of the NHS being too successful, people are living that should not be

I find that a very distressing judgement which you have made.
You speak as though you may either work in the NHS or have close knowledge of it, by the way you speak of the fitter people doing extra shifts, you say,
because of wimps that have decided their previous illness precludes them coming in duty
Again, another condemning judgement. If NHS workers on duty are this resentful about their colleagues who have been ill, it must be dreadful being in hospital treated by them.

Carolpaint, your attitude fills me with horror. We do not need your personal views in the form of this kind of negative attack on people at this time, calling NHS people who cannot work "the wimps" and saying that the high death rate is due to the NHS keeping people alive "that should not be".

I feel sure the views you express are entirely and only yours and nobody else thinks that way, neither within the NHS nor outside.

The most important factor is an efficient locally based test track and trace., but in order for it to be effective there needs to be proper financial support for those asked to isolate.

Research is showing that 1% of Primary pupils and 2% of Comp pupils are carriers, that is they appear fit and well but are spreading the virus. They can be carriers for months. Many young females between 20 and 30 years old are in hospital with severe covid, many of them teachers.

Some local authorities are running out of supply teachers and morale is very low with the huge stress. The virus does not make children very ill but treachers are getting heavy doses of it from each carrier pupil.

I know several parents are keeping their children from school to continue home schooling after hearing this research. They need to protect their families. Teachers are highly qualified and many will not be returning to the classroom if they have long covid.

The government is getting so much flack but, really, they have a terrible job. There is conflicting 'advice' coming from all sides, the economy is in freefall and the coronavirus is still rampant. Who'd be Boris? On the plus side, my dh tells me, at least there are no bombs falling on us.

I keep saying that I like living alone, and it's true, but you can have too much of a good thing and I'm fed up now! But I can 'bubble' with one of my sons, so that's my lifeline.
However, I think this lockdown is for the best and should have been done sooner, even though levels here in Devon are low, - but rising now.
I'm glad to see a bit of support for Boris here. I wouldn't have his job for all the money in the world. To have to make all these life changing decisions must be so difficult. Any leader would have had huge problems with it.

growstuff

BlueBelle

I totally agree with the second set of scientists lock down the vulnerable and carry on carrying on

Between 20 and 30 million people in the UK are considered to be clinically at high risk. Shielding them all would involve locking up between a third and almost half of the population.

The Government and health officials have urged the 1.5 million people in England considered most at risk from coronavirus because of their health conditions to begin “shielding” themselves.
People like you are part of the problem. Stop exaggerating.
Isolate the vulnerable and carry on!
Ps I am one of them but do not want everyone suffering for m6 problem

The only thing that will ever work is people being sensible. We all saw film of crowds of people ignoring social distancing etc. They are the ones to blame. People are ignoring the track and trace. They are not isolating themselves when contacted. We are the only ones who can stop this virus spreading by obeying the rules. Do as ya damn well told.