Christmas break?

There’s no need to feel guilty about calling out a truly horrible post wishing people dead. The apology from the poster is fine but the criticisms were completely justified.

janipat
I'm so sorry that I've been a part of this.
It is such a difficult and emotionally fraught debate.
My grandmother is 96 and I haven't seen her since the start of the year. She is in a care home.
I know that I've said stupid things on here - and I've only been here for 3 months!
I hope that you come back very, very soon.

Thank you all for accepting my apologies, and Alegrias2 your kind comment means an awful lot to me. I am ashamed of my behaviour, and will take a little break for now.

janipat I think many of us say things on GN that we regret afterwards. I would like to say that your apology and explanation is one of the most gracious things I have ever read here. I hope you don't mind me saying that.

janipat
Just take a break. Sometimes it's good for your mental health ?

janipat, don't go. You've apologized and I think everyone here will understand how frustration can result in saying things we shouldn't. I've done it oh too many times.

janipat, I understand your frustration, but it doesn’t follow that just because people haven’t responded to your posts and sympathised directly, they don’t care.

Don’t go, there are too many members leaving these days. You’ve explained and apologised. It’s done.

suziewoozie

I don’t call people out for swearing - I couldn’t give a flying fig if people swear. Sorry for insulting you re your politics - I must have got you muddled up with someone else. Sorry again.

There is a poster with a similar username. I've made the same mistake in the past.

janipat My mistake in thinking your friend is in a care home.

None of us knows yet what the "rules" will be on Christmas Day. However, assuming that they don't change, the question will be whether any of them are prepared to break them. Being practical, nobody would be likely to know.

The second question would be whether any of the children (I'm assuming they're not young themselves) would be prepared to break the rules and live with the consequences if she were to become infected. Nobody on GN can answer those questions for any of you. We can't send the virus packing for a day or two. You have to do your own risk assessments.

Is there any way that the younger son has a laptop and could organise a Zoom meeting with the others?

FannyCornforth yes that was disgusting of me to say I wished anyone dead. Of course I don't mean it, it was an abomination born of frustration, and I totally withdraw the comments and apologise for them.
petra thanks for your understanding. I think I'll take a break from GN for a while, let the dust settle.

janipat
I understand your post completely, although I wouldn't have put it quite that way. ?
I have several elderly/ infirm people in my close who me and my other half have been supporting ( other neighbours do, as well) before this horror happened and have continued to do so.
One of them is in the early stages of Alzheimer's. There is no way that you could deal with some of the stuff we have to deal with by standing on the doorstep 2 meters apart.
Another has poor mobility. He often has falls: again, how do you get someone off the floor 2 meters apart.
My dear friend/ neighbour is having a terrible time with a family member: she is distraught. How could I not put my arms round her and cry with her?
I often have 2 lonely neighbours for Sunday roast and good laugh and chat.
Yes, I know I'm breaking the rules but their mental health and well being means more to me.

Woodmouse I decided 3 years to tackle my weight problem. I have lost over 7 stone going from a 32 to 16. And decided to get fitter. Which I have. I will never been thin. Decades of being between 11-19+ stones. Means my skin will never skrink back . I still want to lose another stone but for me . Any lower and I will look haggard and even if I got to 9st my thighs will never shrink back.

Everyone has to make their own choices in life. I don't judge people by what they look like. You don't know what is going on in their lives or what type of person they are.

Janipat there is no need for that language. When you resort to using bad language you loss you argument.

The virus doesn't know it's Christmas!

I don’t call people out for swearing - I couldn’t give a flying fig if people swear. Sorry for insulting you re your politics - I must have got you muddled up with someone else. Sorry again.

janipat
You can swear until the cows come home for all I care.

What about you wishing folk dead, in two separate posts?

I apologise for the unacceptable language I used.
To Growstuff my friend isn't in a care home, she lives in a tiny flat completely alone except for the carers who come to her 3 times a day, and who of course also visit other elderly people. She never goes out. She is not in a care home so no danger to anyone else at all. She'd like to have a visit from her children who aren't in her bubble, only her youngest son is bubbled with her. Compassion says they shouldn't be sanctioned and prevented from seeing her when her time left is so very limited.
suziewoozie how dare you call me a right winger, where is your evidence? My mates? Pray tell, who would they be? If you can refer to any post of mine that is right wing then please do so, otherwise I expect you to recant. As I recall other posters have sworn and you've not called them out, but then again I suppose they were your mates.

Maggiemaybe

janipat

la la la la I'm fucking invisible as is my almost 102 year old friend! So good to know the fabulous folk of `GN actually care about real people as opposed to the imaginary kind. I'll be sure to tell her the pure souls of GN say fuck you just get on with being totally isolated, depressed and sad, you've had your life............. I totally despair. I'm now hoping many of you don't
make it until next Christmas, payback is a bitch!

Wow. This from someone claiming to be a Christian.

And where are the posters calling her out for swearing? Oh wait a minute, she’s a right winger and therefore beyond reproach from her mates.

Whiff, I have obeyed all of the rules and will continue to do so. Like you I have never smoked and in March, realising that I could do with shedding a few pounds in order to optimise my chances of fighting Covid, I went on a diet to lose a stone. I also started running again to improve my lung capacity. What infuriates me is regularly seeing people wandering around who are clearly, significantly overweight and sometimes puffing away on fags!
Suziewoozie, you are completely right. I should have used the correct description.
To the poster who seems to be wishing others dead - REALLY?

janipat

*la la la la * I'm fucking invisible as is my almost 102 year old friend! So good to know the fabulous folk of `GN actually care about real people as opposed to the imaginary kind. I'll be sure to tell her the pure souls of GN say fuck you just get on with being totally isolated, depressed and sad, you've had your life............. I totally despair. I'm now hoping many of you don't
make it until next Christmas, payback is a bitch!

Wow. This from someone claiming to be a Christian.

Spot on, growstuff! We're not babies, are we? We don't need the government giving us a Christmas holiday - with full permission to mingle (get sick and die) do we?

I can't help thinking that there's pressure for the vulnerable and elderly to get out there and catch it!

Woodmouse people or overweight and smoke are selfish. According to you. I have never smoked and a couple of stone above the BMI chart. So an I selfish because I am not the weight I should be? I have obeyed all the rules. I have a bubble with my daughter and family. I number of health problems but look after myself and don't take risks. I am 62 widowed almost 17 years. My late husband was 47 when he died. I have always in quality of life not quantity. If someone has a good quality of life it doesn't matter how old they are . I know quite at few 80+ who lead an active life. And help anyone who needs it.

Are you the perfect weight for your height? Do you drink? Do you help people when you can? I don't mean doing anything outstanding but by simply being nice to someone. I treat people the way I want to be treated. Even when I need to complain about something. I don't shout or swear at them.

The people who are selfish are those who don't follow the rules . I know several people who because of health reasons don't have to wear a mask but do. To protect themselves and others. The selfish people are these who go on marches putting themselves and others at risk. Putting the police force and other emergency services at risk.

Are you so blind that you think only certain types and ages of people have value. And the rest of us can go hang .

I'll be spending Christmas totally on my own and I expect I'll have a little cry at some point. I've spent most of the time since March totally on my own and I've had many little cries, but my solution has been to get my head round it and make the best of it. I despair that people can't give up a few pleasures and have contributed to making lockdowns more severe. I despair even more at the messaging from the government, which can't come up with a consistent strategy. Dangling Christmas in front of people, for whatever reason, is treating people like children.

janipat I read your post about your friend, but I don't know what the answer is. I'm probably a "purist" in your eyes, but the fact is that I don't know the answer. I might be imagining it but I'm sure I read in the original guidelines that there should be special consideration for people in your friend's position. I don't know whether there was any further consideration or whether it was all forgotten.

I haven't forgotten about the elderly and vulnerable - quite the opposite. That's why I've spoken out when people have supported the so-called Barrington approach and have written that it's "only" the elderly and those with pre-existing conditions who are dying. There is no "only" about any life.

I can understand why the care home management would want to be ultra-cautious, given what happened during the first wave. The virus itself isn't going to take a few days off for compassionate visits.

It would be too much to accept on trust that everybody wanting to visit your friend had totally self-isolated for two weeks before the visit, which is the only way that your friend and all the other residents would be safe. That's why some scientists (and others) have been calling for a total lockdown, which would result in almost zero community transmission and dealing with isolated flare-ups (which is what New Zealand has done).

We are where we are. The only way your friend could see a number of people safely would be for the visitors to totally self-isolate for two weeks and then for your friend to totally self-isolate for a further two weeks after the visit. Any essential carers would have to wear full "riot gear" to ensure that if she is infected that nothing is passed on to other residents.

I'm not responsible for deciding any strategy and I dare say nobody else on GN is either, but I don't think wishing people "payback" is very helpful. Maybe lobbying of MPs with a practical solution would be the way to go.

Message deleted by Gransnet. Quotes a deleted post.

Message deleted by Gransnet. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

If only 50% of cases are “real”, isn’t that enough to take precautions? What if that number was 65%? At some point rational thought is required. I’m also perplexed...at what age does a human become disposable? Personally I will use my judgment and stay home.