Summer holidays abroad ‘extremely unlikely’ as third wave hits Europe

Gannygangan I think that there are anti-maskers here in France but we haven't come across any. I live outside a small village and everybody we know has been very strict about self isolating.

In England we're so used to having vaccines and the flu jab that for most people it's not a problem to have the anti covid jabs. What I don't understand is why so many of the Europeans are reluctant. Did they not have vaccinations when they were young? They must have because you don't hear about people people with tb or polio.

Last autumn was the first I think when there was a run on flu jabs. The take up here was much higher than in previous years. I think it's because the flu vaccine was believed to have some protection against covid.

maddyone

Keeper I’m the one that’s speaking of civil liberties. I’ve already been seriously ill with Covid, as I described up thread. Civil liberties mean you should, now the numbers are dropping, but more so because 50% of the adult population have had their first vaccination, you should be able to see your family, and go on holiday from the designated date, which is May 17th. There should be no more talk of extending the lockdown. If you want to lock yourself down Keeper, no one is stopping you. You can stay locked down for the rest of your life if you want to, and so can all the rest of those who want to curtail everyone else’s activities. But please leave me alone to go on holiday if I want to. I’ve had the virus, I was extremely ill, I got it from my mother who got it in hospital after a fall. I was in a support bubble with her so simply followed the rules, but I still got bad Covid. Now I’ve done everything I was told to do for a year, I want to go on holiday. I don’t live in a dictatorship, and therefore the right to free travel is important to me and to many others.
For everyone who doesn’t want to travel, or who wants to remain locked down, no one is stopping you. Please respect my choice to travel if I want to.

????????????Well said Maddyone

We have decided to swap houses for a couple of weeks with my sister & brother-in-law who live in Surrey, we are in a seaside resort in Devon. Our grandchildren live in Surrey so ideal.

Callistemon I don't know anybody who wants to travel from France to anywhere else at the moment. The majority of English here are retired with families in the UK and other countries. One friend, who is American, married to an Englishman but they lived in Australia for many years now divide their time between France and Thailand. She has a sister living in Rome and a daughter in Poland who has covid. Another friend has a son living in Mexico City. No one is expecting to go to the UK or elsewhere anytime soon.

Gosh, I've not seen anyone maskless in my area for a very long time.

Friend of mine got thrown out of the Post Office. She'd parked the car , dashed into the shop and was almost kicked out again. She'd forgotten her mask.

But I think those stories of staff in shops not telling me to wear a mask are from months ago. Not many stories along those lines now.

Most are responsible.

Of course we do have anti mask/lock down protesters but I believe they exist in France and most parts of the EU

I have no desire to go to England at the moment with the covid situation
I hope others think like you, Dinahmo; it's very worrying to see the situation in France with cases on the rise again and the new variant found there too, just when we may have signs of improvement here.

Goodness knows before we will be able to travel freely again. Holidays are one thing but so many of us are missing our families.

Well I have to admit that I’ve not seen anyone not wearing a mask at the supermarket, but having said that, I don’t go very often as we started doing Click and Collect right back at the start of the first lockdown. We do pop in sometimes for a few items, but not often.
We saw a man in the bank a few weeks ago, wearing his mask under his chin, and my husband told him that’s not how it should be worn, and the man pulled it up.

Charleygirl
I think you must have read someone else's post. I have not said I dislike anything at all. I did say say that holidaying in Northumberland was a bit of a disappointment because the food in the shops was pretty much the same as in other shops throughout the country. I also said that whenever we go back to England the first meal that we have is fish and chips and a pint of beer, both of which we miss.

I suppose the supermarkets are not so crowded at the moment because of on line shopping so people don't need to go. I honestly cannot say when I last witnessed people not wearing masks. Since I don't live in the UK it's unlikely that I have witnessed that. However, friends have told me about it. One friend was barracked by a group of men outside a super market in Sudbury for wearing a mask which he'd put on before entering the shop. I have also read and seen on the television that checkout staff won't tell a person to put a mask on because they're too scared and that there aren't security guards at all the large supermarkets to stop people from going in without a mask. And this is English media not French.

I have no desire to go to England at the moment with the covid situation. I am fully aware of how much it costs from when Johnson introduced isolation for people entering the UK.

Finally, perhaps you might like to tell me what it is I don't like about the UK.

The thing to remember is that the PM is determined that this should be the last lockdown.
Remember him saying the releasing of restrictions would be irreversible?

He also spoke today of the increase in cases in Europe so that’s the strongest hint yet that holidays abroad won’t be on the cards this year.

I do see both points of view expressed on here though.
I fully understand why some of you are desperate to get on with your lives, including foreign travel but on balance I think a little bit more patience will pay off in the long run.

After all even in lockdown we have a hell of a lot more freedom than many other countries.

Despite what a few on here have claimed, our current situation is most definitely NOT worse than being in prison.

Masks are worn in supermarkets as well as in small shops. As somebody stated earlier, the supermarkets are not overcrowded- the numbers entering are well policed. Have you witnessed this recently? I saw today France may be going on the "red" list so if you do come over here you will at your expense have to isolate in a hotel costing around £1750 for the 10 days.

Still, there is so much you do not like why travel over here?

JaneJudge

You can get nice food in England. I noticed when we went to Bourton on the water the co-op was FULL of local food. I am extremely lucky where I live that we have farm shops selling local meat and produce. We have locally produced beer and wine too. The pubs are actually the nicest, least boasted about too. But would anyone come here for a holiday?

We have family in Wales and we are able to get local produce too and have nice meals out

I'm not talking about whether the food is good quality. Where I lived in Suffolk there was a local butcher who used to sell game and a wide variety of freshly made sausages for example. There were a couple of wild deer herds locally, hence the game. Plus the shoots of course. It's just that the variety of fruit and veg in some of the markets is astonishing. Not all of them course.

JaneJudge

Dinahmo, why do you think our supermarkets are crowded? or we aren't wearing masks

(this isn't 'an attack or being defensive' btw I am genuinely interested)

When I lived in England, or when I visit and go to a supermarket there are always many people. The only time there weren't any was in the early hours of the morning when occasionally we stopped on the way back from visiting friends or any other reason. I'm afraid I'm one of those people who used to get angry at the numbers of people getting in my way. Thinking about it, you don't see that many people with children in the supermarkets here.

As regards the masks, I have often read on GN and elsewhere people complaining about the lack of masks in supermarkets in England. Here you get glared at if you've forgotten your mask when entering a shop.I've no idea what it's like in Paris but the French do tend to follow the rules, unless they decide to demonstrate - as per the gilet jaune demos. Then they are much more extreme. They will close roads at roundabouts and prevent people from driving down some of the exits. I don't know if you remember in the sixties, when they rioted in Paris the students tore up paving stones to make barricades. I don't remember that happening in London.

I thought we'd had a third wave. Otherwise why 3 lockdown?

I think so too. I know it is sad, but our lifestyle (and I include myself in this, for obvious reasons) of jetting off regularly, is not sustainable. Maybe this is the wake up call we need. Bad for the environment. Bad for humans too now. Not being able to fly when I want to has certainly made me rethink my priorities.

Ah well, Boris says a third wave is coming. I bet no flights will be allowed abroad this summer after all. There’s always something. Good news for a while then we get pulled back. This may be the situation for the foreseeable I fear.

We are booked to go to Cornwall in June, but out of term time so hopefully it won't be overcrowded. We have self-catering so we will keep out distrance and eat at home. I think England has some lovely coastline and having travelled extensively, I perfer the UK. We are walkers so a bit of rain doesn't bother us. I will not be booking a holiday abroad this year.

Urmstongran

GagaJo

What really annoys me is those who are vaccinated and who are now wanting to travel. Just because you are vaccinated, doesn't mean you can't get covid. Just because you had covid once, doesn't mean you can't get it again. (My sister in law has had it twice.)

If you get covid and have had it or been vaccinated, maybe you don't get too ill. But you can still infect others. We ALL need to stay at home to protect others, not just ourselves.

I think if Europeans are deemed ‘at risk’ from any holiday makers surely their governments will protect them - either by banning flights from the UK or demanding a quarantine upon arrival?

Not just them Urmstongran. Brits contracting it overseas and bringing it back with them. On the plane, travelling in the UK.

If we were only supporting countries that had managed the pandemic well, I would certainly not be holidaying in Britain. Luckily I dont base my travel decisions on such odd criteria.

And, as an aside, for those mentioning air travel:

“Air is dispersed at the top of the cabin and on side walls. This is most prominent when the air is cold but the outside is warm and it appears fog is drifting in from the top of the cabin. The air is then pulled out of the cabin through grilles at the bottom.

“This design feature makes the direction of airflow in the cabin basically vertical, and the airflow in the horizontal direction of the fuselage is very small,” the Civil Aviation Administration said in February. “Under normal circumstances, diseases will not pass through the aircraft air conditioning system.”

When you think about it, it must be as safe as other public transport otherwise cabin crew wouldn’t want to work if their colleagues were dropping like nine pins!

and the supermarkets are no where near as crowded as those in England.

They are not crowded here as people are only let in, wearing masks, one or two at a time. They stand outside in spaced queues.

maddyone

Have I misunderstood? The developers of the AZ vaccine have already told us that the vaccine prevents catching Covid at between 80% to 90%. I have never seen the figure 79% anywhere. In any case, do you not think that 100% chance of not having severe illness, like I had, is a good thing? I do. I can’t believe the negativity on this thread. It’s no wonder the Victor Meldrew character, based on miserable old people, was developed.

People happily go along for their flu vaccination each year, in the belief it will protect them.
In fact, generally it is far less effective than the current Covid vaccines, about 50% - 60%, and, as you point out, maddyone, thousands die from flu or its complications every year.

We are going to have to learn to live with this additional virus as we do with all new viruses and trust that the vaccines will give us a degree of protection, if not complete protection.

But poor Parisians eh Dinahmo? No wonder they fled to the ‘burbs. Macron? Pfft.

Dinahmo, why do you think our supermarkets are crowded? or we aren't wearing masks

(this isn't 'an attack or being defensive' btw I am genuinely interested)

GagaJo

What really annoys me is those who are vaccinated and who are now wanting to travel. Just because you are vaccinated, doesn't mean you can't get covid. Just because you had covid once, doesn't mean you can't get it again. (My sister in law has had it twice.)

If you get covid and have had it or been vaccinated, maybe you don't get too ill. But you can still infect others. We ALL need to stay at home to protect others, not just ourselves.

I think if Europeans are deemed ‘at risk’ from any holiday makers surely their governments will protect them - either by banning flights from the UK or demanding a quarantine upon arrival?

maddyone

Dinahmo if you live in France, you have more reason to be afraid than I have. France is going into it’s third wave. If I was French, or living in France, I would be very cross with Mr Macron, because of his false scaremongering, people in France will die. I hope you are able to access a vaccine very soon.

I am a little cross with Macron and it has been difficult to access the vaccine - we haven't had it yet. However, we rarely see people - two couples with who we have lunch occasionally ( at our homes). The supermarkets are very strict on the wearing of masks as are all the other businesses - vet, doctors and so on and the supermarkets are no where near as crowded as those in England. I also live in a art where the covid cases are low so, provided we carry on as we have done, I'm happy to wait.