So masks are to become optional, do you think this is a good idea?

There’s a chap in Bristol has 165,000 signatures so far on a petition for it to be compulsory for face mask wearing in shops and other public places to continue. This is because there is so much of the Delta variant increasing all the time.

I can think of no good reason to abandon mask wearing on public transport and medical settings other than to pander to the selfish. It does not stop the economy opening up.

In Wales our government is more cautious than the UK Government, it’s just been reported on the news that face masks will be retained on public transport and in healthcare settings, and possibly more. I wonder if Scotland and NI will do the same?

Listening to Dr Nigel from Australia today he agrees with Dr John in that fully vaccinated people may ( this is only a ‘may’) develop more immunity if exposed to the Delta variant. However, in Australia, the people in the ICU’s and on ventilators are actually quite young: one is just 18, so to let it rip through younger unvaccinated people is very dangerous. We’re taking part in a very dangerous experiment imo. Especially if this other new variant takes off….continued mask wearing will at least reduce the viral load when younger people are infected. If we looked back into history and saw a government using people as an experiment on a scale like this we would be horrified and ask how the people of that country could possibly allow it to happen,

I suspect that there is an underlying plan to let the virus run through the young to achieve natural immunity.

I can't see any other reason Margiknot but I would add "whatever damage it does" to the end of your sentence. I don't think Johnson cares how many of our young people suffer from Long Covid - something we know even less about than we do the virus.

I rather hope there will be clear guidance about when to wear masks and social distance etc. once it is no longer mandated. Make it clear that rather than being forced to mitigate risk all of the time, it is our social responsibility to decide if and when to mitigate or avoid! For instance it should be made clear to us all that if a competent body ( eg hospital as part of their infection control policy to protect all patients) demands we wear a mask we should ( if we are able to) do so even if the law does not demand it.
I suspect that there is an underlying plan to let the virus run through the young to achieve natural immunity.

M0nica

Lucca, I was referring to the notice you posted. A classic case of emotional blackmail if ever I saw one. I was not referring to you.

People who expect everyone to wear masks because they need protection or are afraid of abandoning them, are in their way being just as selfish as unmaskers who do not comply with Chris Whitty's limitations. My view of my fellow citizens is not as jaundiced as that of other people on this thread, I think most will be casreful of other people.

As I said, many of those who will act selfishly after abandoning masks are probably, not obeying the rules, other than in a token way now.

Wearing a mask in enclosed and busy spaces is just the same as using a handkerchief when you sneeze. If someone doesn't use one, they are either rude, ignorant or selfish or possibly all three. If we are now all to make decisions for ourselves we are, more than ever, responsible for others, so such people may be rude, ignorant, selfish, and irresponsible.

Changed his ideas again….

He said a few weeks ago that it had become endemic but I thought DrJohns comment last night meant that he’d changed his ideas in some recently. I need to listen again.

It's not quite what he said.

He said that the virus will be endemic (not pandemic) for years, but that's what everybody who says "we have to live with the virus" means.

I wonder what the people who say we have to live with the virus think it means.

I think Tim Spector is probably right, but rather than sticking our heads in the sand and pretending it doesn't exist, we need to find strategies of dealing with it. That means continuing to wear masks in crowded spaces, which is the opposite of what some people seem to be saying.

It also means strengthening local authority infection control teams and having robust measures in place when there are outbreaks, which there will be.

I think there really must be investment in school classrooms to make them safer places. I wonder how many people realise that classroom windows often don't open. Classrooms should also be fitted with CO2 monitors.

We also need to think carefully about international travel, which could mean routine PCR testing from certain countries (if they'll have us).

etc etc

I haven’t watched it yet (will do later on ) but on DrJohns blog last night he said Tim Spector reckoned the pandemic was going to last for several more seasons. Felt a bit deflated when I heard that to be honest.

OK! I'll get the sniffer dogs on the case . I can see the difference.

Meanwhile, if anybody's interested in what Tim Spector (from ZOE) thinks about masks:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ne_nmOJ85ec

https://www.gransnet.com/uploads/talk/202107/medium-724126-2c19933c-2f95-48a6-80f8-5c814a2e3a48.jpeg https://www.gransnet.com/uploads/talk/202107/medium-24267-ddedd6a7-98ee-454e-b17a-795a56c71bfe.jpeg

Thanks growstuff but sadly not that one. I still inadvertently had one in my pocket when I finished work, which I kept so I could try to match it, it has a thicker metal wire inside, and the blue strip is like a foam material, so I think that helps it stay put too. I took some photos so you can see.

I’d be delighted if anybody can track them down.

Casdon

When I was working (NHS) they provided surgical masks specifically for staff who wear glasses, they are orange instead of blue. A more flexible nosepiece meant your glasses didn’t steam up, they were great. Unfortunately I haven’t been able to find any to purchase since I retired. The AB masks work for me now better than any others, although they come right up to the bottom of my eyes, so I look like a highwayman out on the rob.

Were they like these ones?

www.amazon.co.uk/MEIbax-Face_Masks-Disposable-Protective-Face_Coverings/dp/B08PVC6Q2F/ref=sr_1_5?dchild=1&keywords=medical+masks+orange&tag=gransnetforum-21&qid=1625827808&sr=8-5

When I was working (NHS) they provided surgical masks specifically for staff who wear glasses, they are orange instead of blue. A more flexible nosepiece meant your glasses didn’t steam up, they were great. Unfortunately I haven’t been able to find any to purchase since I retired. The AB masks work for me now better than any others, although they come right up to the bottom of my eyes, so I look like a highwayman out on the rob.

I think it must depend on the shape (and maybe material) of glasses. I have two pairs of reading glasses. One pair is fine with a mask - the other gets steamed up quite quickly, unless I really pinch the metal over my nose. I also find it easier with a medical mask rather than my pretty (and expensive) fabric ones with a filter.

True specs and masks are incompatible as Monica has stated above. I only put my reading glasses on if I really have to, which I do when doing a supermarket shop, whipping them on and off frequently as I do the rounds.

I will definitely continue wearing masks when I visit shops, maybe not in a shopping mall, unless it was particularly heaving. Similarly I wouldn't wear one in the outside part of garden centres where we go quite frequently or in the street. I would wear one on public transport if I were to use it, I remember how many colds I got when I was a daily commuter, inevitable when I think how tightly packed trains were, although maybe that's not the case these days. I will continue to carry a mask whenever I go out and use my judgement as to whether to wear it or not.

Lovetopaint)37 Not all of us have got used to mask. I do not use public transport, trains when I can, but not often and I will continue to use a mask then.

Shops no. I find masks and specs incompatible, no matter what I do and as I am dyspraxic having to keep putting specs on and then off while the demist and means I drop them frequently. I have mask worn assiduously, as required, but the opportunity now to only wear them in crowded situations and where other people feel unsafe comes as a sweet relief.

Think of the bus drivers.

Surely the majority of people have got used to wearing them on public transport or in shops. Is it such a hard thing to continue with?

PippaZ As far as I am concerned the government regulstions, no matter who has been articulating them have been quite clear, masks are not compulsory from 19th July, which is not saying you should stop wearing masks entirely.

Chris Whitty has since made it abundantly clear how that discretion should be interpreted, which was much the way anyone I know was interpreting it anyway.

I can only speak for myself. I have taken it upon myself to get as much understanding of my condition as possible. (I have a science background.) When I ask my haematologist and immunologist (phone consultations) what my chances of surviving Covid are, they tell me that they really don't know. They hope that patients having similar treatment to me will eventually get some protection from the treatment but it could take quite a while but can't say how long. They also don't know how badly my immune system is damaged (I should have had a another bone marrow biopsy last year but that didn't happen - do I need further treatment? They won't know until I have a biopsy.)

They also don't arrange post vaccination antibody testing - I paid for a private test with negative results. I was told quite a few patients had done that, but of course, there was a possibility that my T-cells could help, but they didn't test them either.

I'll probably be OK as long as I only mix with people who have healthy immune systems and have been double vaccinated!
So please could you all wear a label that says 'Double jabbed and healthy immune system' (if that applies to you of course). I might just remove my FFP3 mask in that case if I can afford it.

There are about 500,000 current blood cancer patients but there are other conditions that also result in damaged immune systems, some are born with Primary Immune Deficiency. There are about 1.5 million (of all ages) at risk of being severely ill with Covid and many with no idea of their vaccination status and no real prospect of any remediation if they find out although I understand that expensive artificial monoclonal antibodies (Mabs) vaccinations are showing promising results for those for whom the anti-Covid vaccine does not work. Only they don't know who they are because they aren't tested. Nice one!

There seems to be a misunderstanding - the fault entirely of the government and mainly Johnson. He communicates to win favour and never mind how many die while he does it.

We were not told we can behave like a child and do whatever we want because someone will pick up the pieces. We are being told the government is passing the responsibility for all of us to each of us but you wouldn't always know would you?

Oldbat1

Callistemon I’ll let my husband’s Oncologist know she is wrong then.

Ps it is the first I have heard of it when I read your post.