“I know of no episode in history, where a government has willingly aided and abetted the spread of a dangerous infectious disease amongst its own population”

The country is now being told to follow a herd immunity strategy.

The government is being advised by Robert Dingwall, a sociologist with no medical qualifications, who is a member of NERVTAG, and the JVCI and was a signatory to the discredited Great Barrington Declaration. For some reason the BBC keeps wheeling him out to justify the government's decisions.

Dingwall does not believe that children should be vaccinated. Against most serious scientific opinion, he believes they should acquire immunity by infection. He denies that long Covid exists other than as a psychosomatic condition (comparing it to ME/CFS).

He recently tweeted "A reminder medicine cannot deliver immortality and it is profoundly damaging to society to imply that it can, if only we try hard enough. We are all going to die one day - the question is when and how not whether".

I hope that nobody is ever being treated by a doctor with that profoundly nihilistic belief. He is one of the current government's chief advisers.

So is this thread about Coronavirus or about how bad the Tory Government are?

I would never tell anyone to "Calm Down" but I might tell someone that a bit of perspective is required.

And maybe point out that hyperbole isn't good thing? During Spanish flu the government had no idea how to manage it and encouraged people to go back to work to keep the economy going. Schools only closed when too many of the teachers were absent for them to open. One of the pieces of advice was to keep dirty hankies away from children.

The "history is being made" comment is just provocative. I'm a subscriber to the New Stateman but I can see that they have an agenda and read the articles with that in mind.

‘I know of no episode in history’
You would if they’d had the Internet back then.

I must admit I’ve stopped taking much notice of the coronavirus briefings.
But I agree entirely that we can’t stay in partial lockdown forever. We have to get back to some sort of normality at some point, so now is as good a time as any.
All adults have been offered the vaccine by now and the majority have had both doses, so why continue to lock us up?
There will always be a minority of people who will never have the vaccine, so what are we waiting for?
It’s the young people who are suffering the most in all this so it’s cruel beyond belief to put their lives on hold for another god knows how long waiting for what?

Gingster

It’s the crowds of people who are being ignorant. Many people take no notice of rules.
We all have to look out for ourselves and do what’s best for us.
I’m not backing the government but they’re dated if they do, damned if they don’t.

This was bound to end up with people blaming each other. That's what happens with weak leadership.

GrannyGravy13

We will never know what a Labour Government would have done in these circumstances, it would have had Mr.Corbyn as PM (if he had won the election there would not have been a leadership contest, so no Mr.Starmer)

I guess we shall be enlightened to how dreadful/awful/immoral/corrupt (choose your own) this Conservative Government is until the next election?

It passes the time whilst GC eats their banana and breakfast.

The OP is about the behaviour of this government, not the opposition. It would be possible for there to be a different Conservative government.

MerylStreep

If there was ever a time to quote David Cameron, it’s now!!!
calm down dear ?

I find it despicable that people are being told to calm down when they are their relatives or friends are ill or dying unnecessarily.

We will never know what a Labour Government would have done in these circumstances, it would have had Mr.Corbyn as PM (if he had won the election there would not have been a leadership contest, so no Mr.Starmer)

I guess we shall be enlightened to how dreadful/awful/immoral/corrupt (choose your own) this Conservative Government is until the next election?

It passes the time whilst GC eats their banana and breakfast.

Damned

It’s the crowds of people who are being ignorant. Many people take no notice of rules.
We all have to look out for ourselves and do what’s best for us.
I’m not backing the government but they’re dated if they do, damned if they don’t.

I can`t get my head around it.
I`m coming to the conclusion it`s all about revenue......
Schools shut for summer holidays,so plenty of spending keeping them occupied.
Ho;iday bookings have gone through the roof,that i know for sure.
When /if pensioners die of covid,no pension payout.sad but true.
The list goes on.
Me personaly ,i`m in my own lockdown with dh until we feel alittle safe at least.
This is one MASSIVE mistake by the government.

Galaxy

To be honest lemongrove I just find all those expressions patronising and odd to be honest. As if we cant express political opinions without being deemed hysterical, it's an odd approach.

I would agree....but think the daily updates on ‘the evil tory government’ do come over as that at times.

I looked at the heading and thought earwigo

Kick the government again.

The fact is that we're all feeling our way through this and there are bound to be differences of opinion.

Yes, the current government has made mistakes; it's far from perfect. However, any other government would have made mistakes too, because no-one has any real previous experience of a situation like this. The mistakes would probably have been different and there may have been more or fewer of them, but they would still have occurred. Then a different group of Gransnetters would have been kicking the government!

Mattsmum2

I think the issue is, no one really knows. We don’t have a crystal ball, we don’t have a time machine that means we can go back and replay the scenarios until we get one that the majority like better. If you get 100 scientists in a room and pose a question, any question, you will get different opinions and answers. How does that leave you and I? It leaves us all responsible for our own actions, good and bad. Life is full of risks, we all have to balance that and be brave.

Very good post.

Well before now, people were choosing to do their own thing,
Some mask wearing and very many not bothering, I don’t think this week makes much difference to that.If we can’t do this now in a hot Summer, then when can we?

Lincslass

I would listen to Dr John Campbell, he has a calmer and shows a less pessimistic view from Professor Neil Ferguson. Shall we wait until winter, when it will be inside meetings for all, as well as the Influenza virus join up. Or wait till next year, vaccinations will still be going on throughout this. Even before this”freedom”, many youngsters and men in their 30s were going maskless in supermarkets, with no one to challenge them.

If you want less pessimism listen to Tim Spector.

If you want balance, listen to all of them.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

To be honest lemongrove I just find all those expressions patronising and odd to be honest. As if we cant express political opinions without being deemed hysterical, it's an odd approach.

Ellianne

Why is nearly everything put under various headings becoming political?

You're right that even GN is becoming an obsessive madhouse. Too much.

Absolutely ????

It’s yet another slag off the government fest?there is one started every morning I think.

Galaxy

Calm down dear is one of the most patronising comments ever used, do people really think it's funny now.

Would ‘take a chill pill’ be better? Certainly better than the words used by MaizieD ( an over reaction if ever there was one.)

But you don’t get a hundred different answers you get mainly the same answer from them all Mattsmum.
This is a dangerous experiment, condemned throughout the world, carried out on our own population.

MaizieD
That’s ok. You have your opinion, I have mine.
If anyone is offended by your post, be assured it’s not me.

Ellianne

Good point Mattsmum2 that in today's world, 21st century, we have an overload of complicated information and opinions. It's excessive and makes things harder to compute. It was far simpler centuries ago with fewer agendas.

That and the media are doom merchants ?

I would listen to Dr John Campbell, he has a calmer and shows a less pessimistic view from Professor Neil Ferguson. Shall we wait until winter, when it will be inside meetings for all, as well as the Influenza virus join up. Or wait till next year, vaccinations will still be going on throughout this. Even before this”freedom”, many youngsters and men in their 30s were going maskless in supermarkets, with no one to challenge them.

Calm down dear is one of the most patronising comments ever used, do people really think it's funny now.