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Coronavirus

“I know of no episode in history, where a government has willingly aided and abetted the spread of a dangerous infectious disease amongst its own population”

(248 Posts)
Whitewavemark2 Tue 20-Jul-21 05:26:15

History is being made.

From The New Statesman.

“We are heading into the biggest wave of #Covid infection we have ever seen…it’s likely that we will see in the low tens of thousands of death if cautious…that could move into the mid and high tens of thousands of if we (go)back to normal activity” Prof Hayward SAGE (Sky)

If this government gets voted in once again, then I will truly know that I’m living in a madhouse.

Caleo Thu 22-Jul-21 19:05:48

Pippa wrote:

"I'm afraid those pulling the strings may, in most cases, be both sane and reasonably or very intelligent but they are putting their talents in very undemocratic directions Caleo"

Sometimes it it first aid for the country when the elected government fails dangerously. For instance I kept hoping that Trump was being controlled by sane people behind the scenes.

PippaZ Thu 22-Jul-21 10:49:51

I'm afraid those pulling the strings may, in most cases, be both sane and reasonably or very intelligent but they are putting their talents in very undemocratic directions Caleo

Caleo Thu 22-Jul-21 09:58:58

PippaZ I keep hoping there are sane and intelligent people in the background who can and do pull strings.

PippaZ Thu 22-Jul-21 09:07:43

MerylStreep

Why are people looking for reasons to be frightened?
If you want to be frightened ( and it looks as if some of you do)
Why not come to Southend and have a ride on this beauty.

youtu.be/JvIegPhlQOA

Why do you believe people are looking for reasons to be frightened? Cautious, thoughtful, slightly anxious but such a long way from "frightened" by anything but this government. They terrify me.

nanna8 Thu 22-Jul-21 09:04:40

Just wish Covid was like German measles. Shocking if you were pregnant but otherwise quite mild.

Caleo Thu 22-Jul-21 08:34:06

Well there were German measles parties which was deliberate infection for the purpose of natural active immunity in order to avoid the much more serious adult form of the disease.
They get MMR now instead.

MerylStreep Thu 22-Jul-21 07:56:07

Why are people looking for reasons to be frightened?
If you want to be frightened ( and it looks as if some of you do)
Why not come to Southend and have a ride on this beauty.

youtu.be/JvIegPhlQOA

Lincslass Thu 22-Jul-21 07:34:13

Sorry but ˋfreedom´ day has been practised by many well before the 19th July. Mainly by teenagers, and men in their twenties and thirties, some older some not. Certainly in my home area, anti maskers have to take some of the blame too. This Gov has been stupid in still allowing many from highly infectious countries, to pile in like it was holiday season, but every country in the world has suffered economically through this. Your implication is that we should have carried on as normal to prevent the economic mess.

Whitewavemark2 Thu 22-Jul-21 07:02:52

muffin I do hope you are sufficiently recovered to at least live a normal life.

What ever a normal life is these days!

lemongrove Thu 22-Jul-21 07:02:04

Lincslass

Getting accurate information from FB and the Twitterati, well I’ll read the info from Tim Spector, John Campbell and Gov website for more accuracy. Honestly.

Me too!
The gullibility is astonishing from posters who believe every word from Twitter.....or do they just ‘choose’ to believe it to spread misinformation?

Whitewavemark2 Thu 22-Jul-21 07:01:40

MayBee70

My MP has written to me and said that the government are not aiming for herd immunity and that now is the right time to open up. Phew. And there was me getting worried. First time she’s sent me anything other than a standard letter. Don’t know what to make of that.

Did she say what will happen if the numbers go beyond other waves maybe?

muffinthemoo Thu 22-Jul-21 01:28:16

growstuff

Unfortunately, the situation is more complicated than that. It is probably true of primary school children, but not of secondary age children, for whom the Pfizer vaccine is licensed.

Not only that, but it appears that immunity acquired by infection might not be strong enough to prevent further infection and might lead to autoimmune deficiencies later. There have been reports of children suffering long Covid even after only having mild symptoms or being asymptomatic.

Research is ongoing. At the moment, the disease hasn't been around for long enough to know what the long term effects will be. Many scientists and medics think that we're storing up problems for the future. The UK is falling behind with vaccinating over 12 year olds.

PS. I read Ladhani's tweets.

PPS. It would appear that the country has a supply problem with the Pfizer vaccine. We've used up (or allocated) the 40 million doses we initially ordered. Pfizer has promised more doses in the autumn and it wouldn't surprise me at all if there's a u-turn on vaccinating teenagers, by which time many will already have been infected.

I cannot speak to the wider data on infection and subsequent immunity gathered by governments and scientific bodies.

I can tell you that I had it twice, confirmed by test on both occasions, once in first lockdown, and the second time after first vaccination but before second.

I was notably ill on both occasions, although not hospitalised. I have significant new immune system related diseases diagnosed since my first episode.

My experience may not be the mainstream one, but certainly my personal immune system did not view Covid as a one-and-done deal and I have absolutely no faith that I will not get it a third, fourth or fifth time.

I know I can be a right [expletive] about vaccines etc, but my newly damaged heart and lungs really do not want to get Covid any more times than strictly necessary.

MayBee70 Thu 22-Jul-21 00:55:31

My MP has written to me and said that the government are not aiming for herd immunity and that now is the right time to open up. Phew. And there was me getting worried. First time she’s sent me anything other than a standard letter. Don’t know what to make of that.

Callistemon Wed 21-Jul-21 22:20:03

This study has just been completed by researchers at UCL, University of Bristol, University of York and the University of Liverpool:

www.bristol.ac.uk/news/2021/july/ncmd-covidrisks.html

Whilst no-one wants a child to become seriously ill or at all ill with Covid it does give a sense of perspective.

Children are admitted to ICU for many other reasons, sadly, and there have been no warnings that paediatric ICU beds are full and no other information to be found online about this apart from that tweet.

Perhaps someone could find confirmation?

Lincslass Wed 21-Jul-21 22:18:55

Getting accurate information from FB and the Twitterati, well I’ll read the info from Tim Spector, John Campbell and Gov website for more accuracy. Honestly.

MerylStreep Wed 21-Jul-21 21:24:48

Just been talking to next door neighbour who’s just got home from her shift at Southend hospital.
I asked her what is happening: her response was to laugh and say oh no, not more bullshit

So I’m afraid you’ll have to find something else to worry about.

Callistemon Wed 21-Jul-21 20:36:03

Aveline

I also saw that on Twitter and also the responses to it from paediatric consultants say that it's simply not true and asking where she got her data from. Don't panic everyone!

Perhaps Cambridgeshire only?

GrannyGravy13 Wed 21-Jul-21 20:22:29

Definitely paediatric ITU bed’s available in Essex, have been speaking to one of our AC’s Godparent who works there.

rosie1959 Wed 21-Jul-21 20:17:50

A very scary statement but a few drs and Consultants coming back saying there are beds available

Aveline Wed 21-Jul-21 20:17:27

I also saw that on Twitter and also the responses to it from paediatric consultants say that it's simply not true and asking where she got her data from. Don't panic everyone!

PippaZ Wed 21-Jul-21 20:08:06

MayBee70

Whitewavemark2

Just seen this on twitter

Dr Katie Bramall-Stainer
@doctor_katie
·
1h
No paediatric intensive care beds in the entire country this evening.

I repeat,

No paediatric intensive care beds in the entire country this evening.

I’ve just read this on Facebook sad

I think the scientists told the govenment this would happen. I imagine Johnson and his cronies will once again make it anyone else's fault but theirs.

Kali2 Wed 21-Jul-21 19:51:39

Thank you Ellianne.

Very very few things in life are 'not political'.

MayBee70 Wed 21-Jul-21 19:46:28

Whitewavemark2

Just seen this on twitter

Dr Katie Bramall-Stainer
@doctor_katie
·
1h
No paediatric intensive care beds in the entire country this evening.

I repeat,

No paediatric intensive care beds in the entire country this evening.

I’ve just read this on Facebook sad

PippaZ Wed 21-Jul-21 19:36:08

HolySox: Wed 21-Jul-21 16:28:34
There is so much wrong with this post.

My only criticism of the government's recent handling of the situation is that they didn't require everyone to have been vaccinated before easing things further, including children.
The NHS did not need the government to require everyone. Although the vaccine was plentiful it was still limited and it was far better, logistically, to go through the groups as recommended by the JVCI as fast as the quantity of vaccine allowed. At the time and currently, demand for vaccines barely keeps up with supply or outstrips it so why threaten people to get them vaccinated?

Every adult was offered at least one jab.
This may just be how you have written this but, in the UK every adult will be offered two jabs. If they have so far only received one that is because of timing the distance between the two not because the intention is to only give one.

Unfortunately many young people have chosen not to be jabbed and theiy're probably the ones that will be most at risk (nightclubs).
Young people have only just received the offer of vaccination and this has come at the same time as a slow down in availability. They are being vaccinated. The Government has allowed the nightclubs to be opened. They could have waited until the young people had had time to have two vaccines plus two weeks - but they didn't. Johnson wants you to blame "others" as he is unable to take responsibility, but they are not to blame.

MayBee70 Wed 21-Jul-21 19:28:09

At least, at the start of the pandemic I wasn’t too worried about my grandchildren and I knew DH and I could avoid people. It was when I first read that the South African ( at least, I think it was that one: might have been the South American one) was affecting younger people that I started to get really scared for my family. I know my daughter is being very careful with her two boys.