handwriting

Recently I had to make a legal declaration of death and had to sign using a fountain pen, which was provided. I was surprised that my signature looked so good and I'd forgotten the pleasure of writing with a really good pen.

So I've since bought myself a fountain pen and use it in circumstances where I want something to look 'good'.

An example of this was the Life Book from Age UK which I'm currently filling in.

There was a project, in UK I think, to teach joined writing initially. I don't know where or how it turned out. Goes away to look!

I agree spelling and tables are still necessary. We need to understand and have quick recall of the basics of those. I don't think the same is true of handwriting as long as we can scribble a legible note. If the power goes off permanently we will have plenty of time to practise.

In Finland, according to last weekend paper,they are stopping teaching joined in favour of writing teaching keyboard skills.

They are still teaching handwriting just not the joined style. Apparently they are very innovative in education ideas. I suppose it's watch this space.

In UK there was a wobble when children stopped learning tables. Now all is restored sensibly.

I went on a maths course, in the 70s, where they suggested kids did not need tables as they would have calculators. We questioned the fact that an adult of the future would carry a calculator in one pocket and a number square in the other......scroll forward to the era of the mobile phone!!!!! What did we know?

I would still advocate it's useful to know things by heart such as spelling and tables. But the world is changing so fast.

Valerie how touching
When clearing out DM's things to move her to a care home. I found the card I'd written to her and DF just after I married thanking her and dad for all they'd done through my life and with the wedding.
She'd kept it for 38yrs.

I don't really agree about the importance of handwriting. I think it is useful and necessary to teach the basics, but I would not spend huge amounts of valuable curriculum time on it.
I can't think of many (any?) examples where handwriting is useful to the world of work now and in retirement I hardly use it at all apart from to sign my name.
I have no idea why A level assignments need to be handwritten, I can't imagine not being able to reflect, edit, amend and re-write as many times as I want. Why would you want to stop people improving what they have written?
I spent many hours at school learning to write in beautiful italics on unlined paper and I can honestly say it was of no use whatsoever afterwards.
If people want children to spend hours practising handwriting, what would they leave out of the curriculum to make time for it?

I rarely write letters now which is a pity as I love writing especially with a fountain pen. I can write Italic and Gothic as well. But alas it's mainly texts or emails these days. My best subject at school was spelling and even the computer etc does that should you make a mistake.

I have just been given back the last "letter" my father wrote, shaky writing on a little piece of lined paper, to his sister in law in America on the death of dad's youngest brother. It's absolutely precious because dad rarely put pen to paper, having left that side of things to mum. He was almost 95, was so sad to hear his brother had gone, and died 10 days later himself.
My aunt has saved this piece of paper for 2 years for me, it will be scanned and copies passed to my son, daughter and brother, and treasured I hope by the grandkids who knew him well.
Wonder whether anything I write will ever be kept like that? Doubtful, though I do write a number of cards and letters wet ink, especially thank you notes.

I write in my diary every day! I also write letters to friends, birthday cards, thank you letters, Christmas cards, to do lists, etc.

It is a frightening thought that handwriting could die out and it is vital that it is taught in schools. I learned to do Marion Richardson Handwriting and we had to practice patterns to get the flow going.

Somewhat confusing these days in school as Year 1 are encouraged to do joined up writing before some have really mastered the printed letters. As my granddaughter (nearly 6) says, "why can't I write like it is in the books we read?"

This thread really resonates with me as I recently started an A level French course as a Gran of 64! I am doing AS and A2 in the same year and in a college sixth form not in adult or further education although I am having to pay fees for it. We do everything, homework assignments, essays, vocabulary tests etc in handwriting not a keyboard in sight. As I only retired a few months ago and spent my working life in IT using a keyboard I had completely forgotten how to write. My handwriting was always atrocious I couldn't even read it myself I suspect that I too would nowadays have been diagnosed with a mild form of dyspraxia. However, I have experimented with different styles and thicknesses of pens and I can now write legibly so long as I slow down. It is critical as the exam papers are hand written. What is interesting is the difficulty that the 16 - 18 year olds in my classes have with their handwriting too. A couple of them will be given dispensation to use keyboards in the exam but the majority don't seem to be able to write legibly (we mark each other's vocab and verb tests) or fast enough to take notes in class. As for the differences and similarities between my days in the sixth form in 1967 to 1969 and now in 2015 I could write several essays on that too!!

Nelliemoser I recognise all those problems, it took me a long time to learn to ride a bike and I was never entirely confident doing it. I was really glad when a minor hip problem meant I couldn't cycle any more. My son is similar. It is amazing how his bikes used to get stolen so he could justify not cycling to work.

I come from a family of people with very good fine motor control, which made it only more frustrating. However itn was DS having the same problems getting a diagnosis for him that led to me being assessed as well.

Howver both of us had specialised physiotherapy that helped so even though out writing still looks is if a drunken spider has dropped in an inkwell and then run all over a page, for both of us writing is easier and to a certain extent legibility has improved.

M0nica That really does sound like me. Poor fine motor skills, I can't draw well. I was bad at catching balls, or hitting them with a tennis racket or rounders bat. No one ever wanted a clumsy slow coach like me on their team and I was totally useless at PE etc.
My great niece is similarly affected. My DGS seems to run in a clumsy manner unlike his slightly older cousin who looks like a proper runner.

My writing is neater when I print. I was a total mess with a fountain pen. A really decent biro or a pencil is best for me.

At least these things are hopefully better understood now than they used to be .

I confess; I have always had appalling handwriting. Even in the Sixth Form teachers were making me write in print or with a pencil to try and improve my writing. One of my boyfriends went to Uganda for a year (before Idi Amin). He said he loved getting letters from me; they took weeks to fully decipher and occupied many an empty hour!!

I wasn't careless about writing, I tried really hard to improve it, but to no avail. In my 40s I was diagnosed as dyspraxic, with very poor fine motor skills, which finally explained the problems I had.

Oddly enough I do do quite a lot of writing, of the notes and lists variety, plus at meetings and further education classes, but the notes/minutes will be typed up within two days of the meeting, while I can remember enough of the meeting to decipher my notes.

But from time I was able to purchase the luxury of a manual typewriter I have typewritten anything that was intended to communicate with other people. I will handwrite notelets to thank people for whatever, but for personal letters, I type the body of the text but handwrite the greeting a the top and the sign off at the end.

I remember having a tracing book during early primary school lessons, tracing horizontal patterns which you were supposed to complete without taking your pencil off the paper.

I think it was just prior to our learning 'joined up' handwriting, and I'm sure it helped

Thanks, ninathenana!
Yes, Marion Richardson was suited to its purpose IMHO. I used to snap up tatty old MR books being dumped by schools and still have a couple.
For some reason we were all taught italic in the junior group at teacher training college in the late 1950s. Just a fashion I guess.

Nonnie - never too early to have a go. Most 3 year olds will enjoy making big zigzags etc. whether with fingerpaint, chalk or a stick in sand. Later let them do big writing on plain paper, you can fold it to make lines. The preprinted sheets are ok once they have mastered the loose but rhythmic hand movements and are not pressing their pencil in hard and slowly. Easier to show you at the next meetup! If the school isn't teaching a standard style they don't really have room for conflict!

I never got on with handwriting I started at five with Marion Richardson style and when we moved to Bristol at eight everyone was doing italics.

I think I have general co-ordination problems, perhaps bordering on dyspraxia and with what I now know was dyslexia I had trouble writing without the wrong letter coming off my pen. I can barely write birthday cards without making errors.
I am still very ashamed of my hand writing. I don't do hand written letters I could never complete one without making mistakes and being totally stressed. I could never do colouring in neatly.

There are occasions, when for example, a personal card expressing sympathy needs to be handwritten and of course birthday, Christmas and the occasional thank you card, but perhaps these traditional forms of communication will gradually become obsolete as I don't think they resonate so much with younger people. I think that will be a shame, but we are all of "our time" I guess.

My writing evolved into a cursive slant in my teens and I have written that way ever since. My left handed son, in spite of holding his pen and writing in the awkward way that Obama does, has similar writing to me. When I see the handwriting of some younger people nowadays, it appears very round, hardly joined up, quite babyish in a way.

At least Marion Richardson was easy to read. However, individuality went out the window.
When you had a new class, you could tell which ones had come from the same primary school.

I recently read a complaint from an American father, whose High School graduated son was unable to procure a passport, because having been taught only how to print he could not provide an acceptable signature.

'Copperplate' was a poor method, since it was not intended for use with a pen, but was used by engravers.

What was the 'Civil Service Hand'? Was that cursive?

I'm old-fashioned and no doubt earn the "dinosaur" title. As much as I enjoy Gransnet and being able to google anything that I'm interested in or need to know, I wish the internet had never been invented, ditto mobile phones, Kindles, etc.

Although I e-mail and type letters, I like to send and receive handwritten letters and I like the covers, the look and the feel of paperback books and the memory that each book elicits. In years to come there will be no old handwritten diaries, poems and letters and no original authors' drafts with edits to pore over and analyse, etc. And some people have warned that material of that sort which has been typed or copied into a computer (including photographs) may well become incompatible with new storage systems, equipment and programmes and therefore inaccessible. So there is a risk that all sorts of historical material will be lost.

Elrel what do we do if the school lets them right any old way? Does it help to use the pre-printed sheets with arrows showing how the letters should be formed or is that a conflict with school? At what age should we 'interfere'?

Eirel Go to top of page, click on forums and choose which one you want to post on then on that page click the arrow in the circle on the right for a drop down list. That will give you the option to 'start a new discussion'

Elrel - that is exactly how my DGS's (age 6 & 8) in Spain are taught. They both have beautiful joined up hand writing. Their school is a convent school and so I suspect is very traditional in it's approach. I have 9yr olds either side of me and they go to different schools but both of them have very untidy joined up 'scrawls'. Neither seemed to use the 3 line method, or indeed any lines, when they were learning how to write.

Yes, I remember it with horror. I had been taught a beautiful copperplate then moved schools aged about 8 and was made to abandon all loops an curls for the very dull Marion Richardson hand. My writing has never recovered and I still sometimes find myself using both scripts in the same word.

Does anyone else remember the Marion Richardson method of teaching handwriting? I think it was the basis of good legible writing but it seems to have gone out of fashion. I remember making patterns with the various shapes.