Mental health specialist in every school....

I agree that mobile phones can be handed in and safely stored, to be collected at the end of the school day. It's more work for staff of course but must make managing classes (and bullying) easier.

Yes, Iam64 collecting them in prevents bullying, exam cheating, theft etc. They shouldn't be allowed in school, and that rule should apply to teachers too.

I think the difference with testing children now to when we were in school is that the tests now are designed to rank schools, not children. Formerly they were a useful tool for the teacher to know who was struggling and who needed more challenge; a means of encouraging pupils to do better.

Now there are detailed narrow targets that the government requires children to meet ("age-related expectations", as if they are a bunch of widgets)and if the data show that some children are not up to that expectation, the school risks downgrading in their OfSted. And then there are SATs...say no more.

I am a school governor and I watch the sort of stress that this puts teachers under - constant assessments, gathering of data etc., and I do not think that the stress experienced by children in school is unrelated to this. If your class has a number of children not meeting these expectations, then you are constantly striving to achieve these, even though the child may be better served by moving more at their own pace. Trying to balance the real needs of the child against government edicts is very hard indeed. Even though there is a line in the data for individual progress, this cuts no ice with OfSted, who can grade a school downwards on the basis of the raw data, even if the class has a high preponderance of special needs. And we all know, as I have said before, that children who have an of day (the dog died or whatever) and anxious children perform below their abilities - and yet the whole future of the school hangs on this.

No wonder the teachers are stressed - maybe the in-school mental health specialist should be for them.

off

On the subject of phones. Lots of downsides to them of course, but they are a useful safety item for children, especially in rural areas with hopeless transport - they can contact their parents when in trouble, and their parents can contact them.

No need to ban phones the school just needs a strict policy on not using them and a follow through if anyone does. Once their phone has been taken from them for a whole day and they have had to wait to get it back they will soon stop using it. They then have it to contact parents/carers outside the school gate.

I think the difference with testing children now to when we were in school is that the tests now are designed to rank schools, not children. Formerly they were a useful tool for the teacher to know who was struggling and who needed more challenge; a means of encouraging pupils to do better

Exactly Luckygirl and in many ways these tests and league tables, are part of the reason why some children cannot get into a school on their doorstep, when children living miles away can just because the parents manipulated the system very early on to ensure their child gets in to the best school years later. Before league tables children tended to go to the school closest to home and that was that.

Lillie I know policies aren't enough, which is why they have to be put into practice. Ofsted does actually evaluate the effectiveness and asks pupils what they know about online safety and how they found out. I was working in a school, which was downgraded from "Outstanding" because Ofsted judged that it wasn't doing enough to protect pupils from online bullying. Inspectors had picked up on it from talking to pupils and then asked SLT to justify that they were doing enough.

If parents have concerns, they can contact Ofsted, who will do a focused inspection.

I agree with you gillybob. It was all part of the "competition is best" mantra in the 1990s.

gillybob Are your DGD's current friends going to the school the LA has allocated?

I don't hold out much hope for your appeal either. All you can do is be positive and not pass your anxiety on to the child.

As I keep telling you, the LA is responsible for transport. If the school is three miles away and is the nearest with places, the LA has to provide transport, even if it's a taxi for one. That's why you won't win an appeal based on transport issues.

I agree with you thatbags. I don't know if there has been a rise in mental health issues.

I certainly remember two girls in my year group (of about 90 girls) who had mental health issues. One was anorexic (although I don't think I'd ever heard the word) and the other had a lot of time off and eventually just left. With hindsight, she was probably very depressed or had other issues she didn't talk about. It was a highly pressurised school. Most of us went to university and I knew of a number of girls who didn't complete their first year and/or had a number of issues, but we just didn't talk about them.

gillybob Please try not to feel so bitter about LA staff. They have no control over the situation.

You'd be better off trying to get them on your side. They won't be happy to have to pay for school transport and might try and put pressure on the school to take your DGD.

That's what happened with my own son. The LA was paying £100pw for a taxi to get him to school, because the school I could see from my bedroom window was full. After a term, the school miraculously "found" a place for him. The school had pressure from the LA and Local Government Ombudsman.

No daphnedill she will not know anyone at all going to the school the LEA have allocated to her. She will be travelling alone too.

I have tried going down the "transport" route for the 3 children but always managed to get fobbed off. First they said that they would need to be special needs to qualify then, when I presented them with evidence to the contrary, they said that they needed to check the distances as per their own GIS system and they would get back to us (they didn't trust my source of information).They didn't. Then when I proved that they did qualify on distance,they knew nothing about it, then they said the best they could do was to provide free bus passes (we refused) now we are back to the beginning and eldest DGD being sent to a school in the opposite direction to her younger siblings primary.

I can't help but feel bitter towards the LEA staff because they know the situation. They know how difficult it is for the children, they know they are sometimes late for school as the buses don't always turn up, they know that the attendance officer has become involved (because they were late 3 times in one month) They are nasty and patronising on the phone, I am now on first name terms with them) and they have refused a face to face meeting. When I ask their advice (or what they would do) they say that its not their problem they have fulfilled their duty by providing a school place. Quite frankly they don't give a damn.

I have tried unsuccessfully to get them onside daphne. They now pass me to one particular person when I telephone (she knows the case inside out and was even at the primary school appeal we lost) She is a real nasty piece of work. Nothing else I can say really.

Mobile phones - I have a friend who is Headteacher at a big secondary school. Pupils' phones are confiscated if they are used in school. One day he was doing assembly - 1200 kids and staff - when HIS OWN mobile rang in his pocket, (daughter calling!). He had to think swiftly on his feet, held up the phone and said very calmly, "Remind me next time I confiscate a phone to switch it off first." Everyone nodded! [grin}

Aaaaaah one rule for one eh Lillie?

It would have been fantastic if the ring tone had been particularly funny or naff!

Apologies for "going off on one" there. Just ignore me

Didn't mean to try and hijack the thread for my own issues.

Why are you doing the fighting over your grand-daughter's school placement, gillybob? Rather than her parents, I mean.

Just because I am thatbags really to be honest.

Sorry, didn't mean that to come across rude (as it might have) thatbags My DDiL works full time shift work. My DS is hopeless at this sort of thing. That's it really.

We had the 11 + but I don't remember any pressure to pass it. As it happens my younger sister and I both did, but my older sister did not. She was taught to type and ended up as a legal secretary earning as much, or more than my younger sister and I.

I think our society has got a lot wrong - pressure to buy a house, which in turn means mothers need to work, emphasis on consumerism - all encouraged by government. I hope when robots take over we might go back to stay at home parents or at least one, if not two, part time ones, and more family joint activities that do not cost the earth, walking, or even helping in the community with something. We can no longer rely on the government to provide everything for everyone. But we would have to solve the housing problem first - maybe look at some of the innovative cheap options around. Life will be hard for the next generation, the answers are out there but it will not be an easy path.

I've been reading up on the proposals. The idea is to "support" schools with training for existing staff (ie a couple of short courses). There is no extra funding for real psychiatric help, so waiting lists for CAMHS will remain.

This is unacceptable and won't make much difference, because some big schools already employ counsellors, but it will tick boxes.

gillybob It is the LAW that the LA must pay for school transport. You need to work at accepting the decision, because it's unlikely to change. If this is a popular school, you will be one of many and inconvenience of school transport has never been a criteria for a successful appeal.

The admissions criteria have been applied correctly and you don't have a strong case.

All you can do is state your intention to remain on the waiting list and hope that somebody leaves. You would then stand a good chance, because you live so close to the school.

Contact the Local Government Ombudsman about transport! It's the law that the LA must provide transport, if the school is more than three miles away and is the nearest with places. The LA has no case to answer.

Why didn't you apply to a school where your DGD would know children from primary school?