Children not ready to start school aged 4

cc

Sadly home schooling, though great in principle is not always a success for the children in terms of enabling them to join the education system at a later stage. It probably sounds a bit simplistic, but social skills and mixing with others are skills more easily gained when actually with many other children.

There are heaps of other opportunities for socialising and mixing with other children. Home schooling doesn't stop children accessing formal qualifications when they are ready, and for some children schools cause real damage.

All children are unique. There is no way to make child development go faster. Children like everyone have been through a very challenging time during the pandemic. There will always be children who can cope with formal schooling at 4 but a vast number will not. What has changed apart from the sad destruction of Sure Start, is that children do things earlier and earlier. If their experience is restricted then they will need more time to learn through high quality play. Schools need to be ready for children not the reverse. The EYFS covers the Reception year but sadly in many schools this practice has been lost in a push for formal phonics, number etc when children are simply not ready. Remember it’s easier to consider how old children are in months as under fives. A 48 month old has a year less experience than a 5 year old.

cc

Sadly home schooling, though great in principle is not always a success for the children in terms of enabling them to join the education system at a later stage. It probably sounds a bit simplistic, but social skills and mixing with others are skills more easily gained when actually with many other children.

I agree, although it's a possibility if parents really feel strongly about the issue. It was one of the big advantages my own children had when they started school after being in a nursery full-time from the age of six months.

Both patents have to work to pay the bills, well hoe about the government stop hiking up these bills. I'm sorry with the profits the energy companies gained last year I honestly don't think this extortionate increase, one of two, is right. Families are already struggling.

That’s what I said trisher. You don’t seem to know a lot about EYFS. But carry on talking.

Sure Start was one of Mr Blair's achievements in government (alongside some 35 others which Corbyn's hopeless leadership failed to recognise and remind people of) but it was trashed by the Tories.

Sure Start ….MaizieD…. What happened to parents responsibilities where their own children are concerned!!!? Not everything in life can be ‘down to the state’.
When my two went to nurseries more than 40 years ago , the criteria was they had to be able to dress/undress….take theirselves to toilet….. eat with knife and fork…. to take simple instruction. Have numbers up to 10 or 20 if possible and to know what a book was!!! Parents are to blame for lack of simple implementations.

I was born in England in 1941 and went to school at 4. We moved to South Africa when I was 6 and there the children only started at 7. So I had to wait until I was 7 to go to school.
4 is far too young. Have a heart!!!

Mollygo

You don’t really seem to know a lot about EYFS trisher, but carry on talking.

I know that over 80% of schools introduce a literacy hour in the child's third term Mollygo and that parents who choose to keep their August birthday child at home until the September after their 5th birthday may find their child going straight into Year 1.
I also know the difference between an induction period (which is a posh name for a staggered start) and complete flexibility which is child and parent led.
I also know that countries where children are not even introduced to formal education until much later have better achievement levels than this country.

My grandson turned four in July and started reception class in September. He absolutely loves it. Very proud of himself now he’s beginning to learn to read and can do some adding up. He was at nursery before that and very ready to move on. So I do think it depends very much on the child.

Sadly home schooling, though great in principle is not always a success for the children in terms of enabling them to join the education system at a later stage. It probably sounds a bit simplistic, but social skills and mixing with others are skills more easily gained when actually with many other children.

I think this all depends on the child. Some children who start school at nearly 5 are less ready than those who are only just 4. My granddaughter is a late August baby and was 4 last year. She started school in September just 2.5 weeks after her 4th birthday, but she was ready. She loves school and according to her teachers is a delight to have in class. Her friend who was 5 in September hates school and was nowhere ready to start.
They also are given homework which has to be completed by the end of term. This enables her to do it at weekends and spend time on it when not tired. Again she loves to do this as it gives some structure to craft and home time. This is also done with both sets of grandparents (who live an hour away so not around during the week) who enjoy getting involved. Both my daughter and son in law work in hospitality and can work long days but still manage to spend time with their children. My GD also went to nursery from a fairly young age which shows as she has learnt to sit still and listen to grown ups rather than always getting her own way.

... through play

Totally agree that it was an appalling decision to stop SureStart. Here in France children can go into the maternelle part of school when they are out of nappies. Until the age of three they can be educated in different ways, but teaching is obligatory from three years old and what I have seen in maternelle classes is pretty similar to reception.
It is true that people in the UK have been complaining for years about children's readiness for school, but I am totally unsurprised that current cohorts have missed out on socialisation and skills developed throgh play. Life has hardly been normal for the last two years, has it?

Mollygo Your last sentence was interesting (so was the rest). I've noticed that one of the main reasons parents send their children to school "early" is that they want a particular school. If they're happy with the allocated school, there's no problem.

Sadly the situation may not improve if the children start school later. If they're not being prepared for school and taught these skills at home nursery or childminder then they're just not going to learn them. I feel that, though teachers should not have to deal with these problems, the children are better off at school than at home. Extra classroom assistance really is needed.
This is a different problem to summer babies starting school at almost a year younger than the rest of the class. Both my sons were summer babies and did eventually catch up as they got older. However I think that summer babies need extra help at school.

In Germany, children start school at the age of 6, but there is an element of flexibility, so that start can be delayed until a child is "schulreif" (ready for school). When they do start, it's more more formal than the UK, but most children go to a "Vorschule" (pre-school), where they do the kind of activities done in reception. Most schools are mornings only anyway.

Parents of young children in England and Wales could home-school too, if they don't want to send their children to school.

You don’t really seem to know a lot about EYFS trisher, but carry on talking.

We have quite a lot of home schooling here and there are no fines etc for keeping children out of school. Interesting how different things are in different countries.

There is a difference between an induction period- sometimes known as a staggered start- which is mainly based on the age of the child, and complete flexibility. Complete flexibility means the parent decides when the child will attend school. The school doesn't set the dates. So the parent may decide mornings only for so many weeks and extend that if they feel it necessary. Then they might collect after lunch time and finally move to a full day.
This is of course a real problem when both parents are working or don't want to put the time in.
I think reception classes should abandon the Literacy and numeracy hours completely, place the emphasis on play, creative activities, singing and story telling and make the year much more about personal development and nurturing.
But of course some parents (as is vividly illustrated on this thread) only regard reading and writing as important and think the earlier this is done somehow shows particular intelligence.

trisher
I do think some flexibility would be welcome. One of mine is a late August birthday. When he started school things were much more flexible and we were able to build up his day starting with just a morning, it couldn't happen now.

It can and it does! It’s called an induction period, where the children come for half days.
The initial idea was that it would last for the most of the first half term, and that the children would be in full time by just before the half term holiday.
Unfortunately, although it was good for the children, who weren’t so tired and had settled in really well, it didn’t suit the parents, who complained that their children were going from full time nursery/preschool to half a day at school. So now we, along with all the other local primaries still have an induction period, but it’s shorter.
Tell me it doesn’t happen everywhere and I’ll share the fact that we are getting something right with our EYFS staff.
Parents do have the right to keep their children at home until their 5th birthday if they feel they are not ready for school. In my experience it isn’t always the summer-born who aren’t ready, but that’s another matter.
It’s not brave to keep them at home, it’s the parents’ choice. If they live in an area where the local primary isn’t oversubscribed then they stand a fair chance of still getting a place.
If other parents have chosen to send their children from September and the school is full it’s a problem parents would know they will have to deal with.

As far as I am aware, the law states that the latest a child can start school is the term following their fifth birthday. There is no law that says all children must start their schooling together in the September term. Many, many children are not ready to start school at four years old.

It is so easy to blame parents for not preparing their children but schools are partly to blame for children going to school before they are ready.

Head teachers are quick to point out that there may not be a place available for your child if he/she doesn't start in September. They also say your child may find it hard to break into established friendship groups by starting after the others.

It all comes down to money because schools are paid from the term when the child starts school. So, the school receives reduced funding for a January or Easter starter. It takes a brave parent to resist this pressure.

Mollygo

Chestnut

This problem may not be new but I'm sure it's getting worse. Some are only just turned 4yrs which is quite young. So maybe they should start school on their 5th birthday regardless of the time of year. The school should learn to integrate them during the school year as they turn 5yrs old.

Some on here will remember that we used to do that. Three term entries based on birthdate. September, January and Easter.
For a few years as a new teacher, I had a mixed Reception/Y1 class, with Y1 who had been in for 1 or 2 or 3 terms and Reception who started at different times of the year (as above). After Easter I had 38 altogether. Teaching was interesting and TAs hadn’t been invented!
Parents were not happy if their neighbour’s ‘autumn or spring born’ child could start before their own ‘summer born’ and would produce evidence that their little genius deserved to start earlier.
When schools are now paid for bottoms on seats, it’s hard to say, “Yes we'll keep a place till January for little Alex, much less keep a place for little Alexia till April,” especially if you are an over-subscribed school.
So basically, whilst I agree with the point you make Chestnut, I wouldn’t like to go back to how it was.
In addition, there is no guarantee that the children would be any more ready to listen do and learn if the home or pre-school provision wasn’t up to much.

The reason one intake was introduced was because there was considerable evidence that those children who only had one term in a reception class failed to make as much progress as those who had 3 terms.
I do think some flexibility would be welcome. One of mine is a late August birthday. When he started school things were much more flexible and we were able to build up his day starting with just a morning, it couldn't happen now.

Iam64

Thanks growstuff. I found those three posts objectionable.

I would go as far as to say I found them offensive. I doubt the poster will understand why others object though.

So many short sighted adults. No wonder many children are short changed from birth. No, I won't be tuning in again . Instead I will concentrate my efforts into making very young children's lives better. My manager obviously thinks I am a very valuable team member and hence, has given me three more families to work with.