Support for all who are living with estrangement

I think the sunshine out here could warm us a lot, and hopefully chase the germs and hurt away. Too many weeks of changing temperatures has messed with immune systems and old joints. Sort of looking forward to the storm.

@hugshelp - sorry you are not well and hope you feel better soon

@Smileless - thank you for your understanding. Apart from Leonard Cohen I have been playing repeatedly the song 'Grenade' by Bruno Mars which includes the lyrics 'I gave you all I had and you tossed it in the trash, you tossed it in the trash, you did'. I was even tempted to send it to DD but fortunately managed to restrain myself!

How do you get over the hurt and the anger? I know I do have to let go of it and it is very early days, at least since the bombshell of the existence of DGD1. How do you learn to trust again? Can it ever really be better? I know where we are now is better than where we were as there are no more secrets - unless there is another DGC hidden away - and there is regular contact.

DH is convinced that things are moving in the right direction. But how do you reconcile with what has already happened? I always thought that pregnancy and the shared experience of motherhood would make me and my daughters feel closer, but she didn't even bother to tell me. DH is supportive but just says it's not my fault, that there is no point in asking 'why' all the time, as DD1's behaviour has not been rational.

Anyway, on the positive side, DH and I enjoyed a trip to the cinema yesterday, and we are meeting up with DD2 and DD3 for a special lunch next week. Plus the sun is shining and I got to see the Haka - the highlight of any rugby match, in my opinion

Not too well atm and not nearly as good with words as many of you ladies. But heartened to read of the nice things some of you are finding pleasure in and thinking of all those who are suffering. I wish I could do more than be with you in spirit.

I used to find mornings were the worse Dolcelatte.

I remember I'd wake up and initially think it had all been a bad dream and then realize that no, this is real. It's good that you have your DH with you to listen and give his support.

You say you have a lot to be grateful forbut remember that's it's OK to feel the pain that you're feeling, the hurt and confusion along side the positive aspects of your life. Don't be too hard on yourself and feel guilty for the emotions recent events have raised in you.

You can tell us how you feel, your DH and it might be an idea to write it down. I did that a few times in the early days, wrote our ES a letter which of course I never sent. It can be cathartic, getting the pain, fear and anger out of your system for a while at least.

Well Mr. S. dozed off before the film finished so I suppose if it comes on TV again, even he eventually remembers the beginning of it, he won't remember how it ends.

@LostChild - you are very welcome. All of us on here are in some sort of pain but hopefully we can help and support each other towards healing. Have a lovely weekend!

Dolcelatte, thankyou for saying that. It meant a lot.

@Smileless, so pleased you are having a good break. In our household the opposite is true. I used to watch Inspector Morse so many times and either fall asleep or just lose the plot that I could always watch it again

@Starlady - wise words. I am so hurt and there are times when I feel like telling DD how I feel, but I know that it won't do any good, just make matters worse. I had a bit of a melt down this morning with DH but feeling much better now. For some reason the mornings seem to be worse, but I have much to be grateful for and am concentrating on thinking positive thoughts

DH and I agree on most things, but not entirely on films!

@LostChild- that's a lovely analogy and thank you for sharing it. We do need to learn to love ourselves in order to love others and I have no doubt that you are very lovable. Take care of yourself and keep moving forward, even if it's only slowly, and even if sometimes you seem to be sliding backwards a little. Just keep going. The forest will grow, with an abundance of love and good things.

You have my sympathy Pantglas.

News update ...... Mr. S. has just remembered he has seen it before but we're still going to watch it again.

Mine is the opposite Smileless2012 - when I choose a film that he doesn’t fancy (cos it’s soppy/romantic/historical) he always says ‘We’ve seen it’! Even if it was released yesterday! Or that he’s read the book! Or seen a documentary on it! Grrrr!

It must be great being Mr. S. Just started watching a film which I know we've seen before but he can't remember it so, I'm now watching a film I know the ending too and he's really enjoying it because he doesn't remember seeing it before.

I asked my councilor today, how do I learn to love myself?

She said that you can't just plant a forest in a desert. You have to start with one tree, love and nurture it, water it and feed the ground around it. Eventually the ground around it will change and you can plant more trees. They will work together, provide shade for foliage and animals and soon it will be easy to plant more trees around them. Eventually the forest will start growing and spreading itself and all you will need to do is water it when needed.

Hope that helps someone today.

A walk in the park sounds good loveOc.

You do right Dolcelatte a bit of self indulgence does you good. Glad you're doing OK.

Had a good session at the gym this morning; love lifting weights. Hard work but feels great when it's finished.

Welcome, Sombreuil! My heart goes out to you and Dolcecatte both!.

Dolce, I'm another one who thinks your mix feelings ar normal. (t's god you can come here to vent and not at DD or SIL.

All fine thanks Smileless. I have been very self-indulgent -drinking wine, listening to Leonard Cohen, reflecting upon love and loss, and the meaning of life.

I hope you have a lovely break. I believe it's going be another hot weekend, an Indian summer.

Sending hugs and positive thoughts to everyone!

Enjoy Smileless! That is what I could do with, Escape for 10 days, ha ha. Never mind a walk in our local park will have to do. It is a gorgeous day though!.

TGIF everyone. I hope you're all having good Friday evening.

Mr. S. and I arrived at our holiday lodge this afternoon. Only a 45 minute drive from home but a change is as good as a rest so they say so looking forward to a change for the next 10 days.

Hope you're OK Dolcelatte.

A one liner, now that's what I call a short post Dolcelatte.

Thanks Lost and Smileless! I have hay fever but I will take the flowers anyway!!

Thanks for your advice LostChild.

Sombreuil, you are so right that we must not let estrangement damage the relationships with the ones who do love us. I have definitely learnt that lesson. I was so consumed by grief and despair in the first six months when there was NC that I was barely functioning and that's just not fair. I leaned on DD2 too much, I know, and I know DH got sick of my going on and on about it, because there wasn't anything we could do to change things - or so it seemed. I do think that Time changes everything though and that people change and that there is always hope. Don't despair Sombreuil. You are very hurt, understandably so, but don't give up. By that I don't mean necessarily do anything but wait and don't wait in a way that involves putting your life on hold. Sometimes, love is pain, but it is also what makes us human.

Oh that puts such a different spin on things Dolcelatte. I think you are coping really well given the circumstances

OK Dolcelatte I'll keep my post shorter too.

I totally understand the decision to wait until the New Year when your new GD will have arrived. Of course you need to be mindful of your D's condition and not wanting to cause any undue stress and anxiety.

You have over 3 months for conversations with your D, too see more pics of your beautiful GD and I was thinking that this isn't necessarily a bad thing.

You have this time to let things settle in your heart and mind, to begin re building your relationship with your D. I know you were doing this anyway, but understandably finding out you have a 14 month old GD has knocked you back.

One step at at time Dolcelatte. You can do this, I know you can.

Grannieunite and Sombreuil, thank you for your posts and welcome to GN Sombreuil.

I don't think my DD is cold and I believe that she genuinely loves her family, but I do think SIL is controlling and after financial gain. DD is with him 24/7 as neither of them have jobs and don't seem to see other friends - I wouldn't expect DD to have a job now, but I don't see why he is not working as he has just completed a PGCE in a STEM subject, so there must be lost of jobs available (which he did just for the free bursary). Perhaps he wants to be there to support DD when the new baby is born.

This whole estrangement had its origins in finance. I had agreed to their request to help buy them a house when they left university, where they met, but pulled out when I thought he showed signs of controlling behaviour as I didn't want DD to be tied to someone who might turn abusive. I was probably overprotective as she had been involved in a previous such relationship and this seemed to have all of the same hallmarks. I virtually threw him out of my house when DD had been crying for ages and locked herself in the bathroom and he refused to leave. I threatened to get the police and told him that he was controlling, that nobody liked him, and that he wasn't good enough for my DD. So yes, I handled it appallingly and he has never forgiven me, although he pretended to have made up - I went out of my way to say I was sorry and make amends - when he wanted money. He wrote a rude e-mail accusing me of dishonesty in not keeping my promises, insulted DD2, and said I should make amends financially. Shortly afterwards the ghosting began.

We didn't even have DD's new address and I had a conversation with her late last Christmas Day - fortunately I was pleasantly mellow by then, as it wasn't a particularly nice conversation. I had transferred £1,000 to her account for Christmas as I was worried she might not have any money as he is very frugal. She never has new clothes or make up or a hair do, a meal out, or a drink (they don't drink at all). They never go out and he doesn't seem to have any friends, DD has dropped her very good friends from school, who were very upset and contacted DD3 to see if she was ok.

Anyway, she didn't seem particularly pleased with the gift, said that she was very hurt, that I 'had' the family', that they were scrimping and saving and couldn't we give them a 'leg up'. So I said that we would support her to do the PGCE course she was talking of doing, which is to be next year. Then suddenly we were given her address. Now, when we have given the loan they requested, we are told of the existence of DGD1. So yes, I am wary, but I do think that he is directing matters. DD regards him as 'head of the household' and is quite passive. That's why we are keen to support her in this course even though it will involve paying rent in the south east for at least 18 months, as I just want her to have some independence and break out of the bubble and meet other people. However, funnily enough, he has decided that he will get his one year qualifying teaching job when DD does her course and they have decided to put both DGD in the university creche - which I think will cost about £400pw - so I am just wondering if they will expect us to pay for that, as well as the rent on a family house for a family we didn't know about....

However, I've got to say that DD says she is very happy and SIL seems a very devoted DH and father. And that's all I want, for her to be happy, but I am wary. We made the 'loan' with our eyes open and I don't object to helping out financially when we can, but I don't want to be manipulated or used. I am certainly not prepared to 'buy' my DGC, but I am prepared to pay something to keep them in our lives - most especially my DD, in case this relationship eventually turns sour and she needs support.

Sorry, this has turned out to be long again!

I get not wanting medical support I really do. Our bodies are a huge complex series of chemical reactions and things like this can unbalance those chemicals and leave us suffering both mentally and physically. So obviously make the right choice for you, just know there is no shame in asking for a little help if things become unmanageable. I take tablets for anxiety, they aren't daily, just as needed and they don't do anything other than prevent the physical symptoms of anxiety.. Which when I am anxious and I am shaking, sweaty, with my heart racing and feeling sick, just makes the anxiety worse. I just thought I haven't needed one for a few months now, that's a good sign eh