*SUPPORT* for all who are living with estrangement

Sorry, that should read, "I don't think your son intends," not "intended." At one time, he may have thought he would, but not now.

Just catching up w/ this thread. OMG, FlyingSolo, my heart goes out to you! I know it hurts, but I agree that you must keep your son and DIL away from you. Good that you've changed your phone numbers, apparently, and I take it you've blocked them on social media, etc. or aren't visible on any sites they would frequent. Glad you're feeling better now, but sorry about all you've been through.

I'm sorry, but I don't think your son intended to ever give you back that money. I'd let it go (as I think you have) and just make sure not to loan him anymore for any reason (but I think you know that). You need to protect yourself and he and DIL need to work out their own issues together.

I'm glad you keep your door secure, are careful when using social media and you're not using any 'phone numbers they know.

You're doing the right thing FlyingSolo and it does look as if you're better off not having contact with them .

I'm kind of ok now. I was telling you how bad I was last year when they were bullying me. I can manage as long as they don't start bullying me again. Which is why I don't want contact with them.

This is what I mean when I said which of us as cut each other off. He cut me off. As in didn't say he had, just ghosted me when he had received some backpay and I asked for some money back. That was 3 months ago. I tried making contact. On one occassion was told they were splitting up but didn't know how to because of baby. Blanked me for some more. Lastest I got told to f off. That was last year. Reckoned they would have to call police if I knocked at their door. Never been to their door in my life.

However he has said that before and in between these times of saying that they have been here to eat takeaway. I had invited him round to share pizza as too much for me but then I got asked(?) if she was invited too and then told they didn't fancy pizza and I ended up paying out for a totally different takeaway to feed them. How can someone say they would need to call the police if you knocked at their door for the first time ever but still think they are welcome to visit me and be bought their choice of takeaway. They are so full of their so called rights.

But now he wants something here. And has made two attempts to contact me but he hasn't been here. When I say I am hiding I mean I keep my door very secure, I have taken extra precautions on social media to prevent any sign of me on there. I am not using any phone numbers that they know.

He's not listening to anyone. Or to be more precise he isn't having proper conversations with anyone so nobody is able to say anything or have a chance to know what is happening in his life. Fooling the world with the picture they paint on social media though. His world has been reduced to her and hers. Not even "allowed" to walk anywhere because it worries her because he might die!

I know people think you should bite your tongue and keep quiet if necessary to try and ensure a good relationship with DILS and to have a relationship with a grandchild but doing that and just carrying on being nice as almost destroyed me. I think that advice is all well and good but it really depends on the individuals and whether the other persons behaviour is abusive or damaging. God knows what I was thinking.

Flyingsolo you sound to be in a really bad state. Please make an appointment to see your doctor and tell them exactly what you have told us. You are feeling like this because of all the terrible stress you have and are still under. Please do this tomorrow. Take care of yourself now. xx

Have you seen your GP about this FlyingSolo, the amount of stress you're under and the affect your anxiety is having on your life?

Do you have any family that you can confide in who may be prepared to contact your son and tell him to back off?

If he has your telephone number, landline or mobile you should seriously consider blocking him and if he comes to your home, don't hide or open the door but tell him if he comes again you'll report him to the police for harassment.

It's not your job or responsibility to be his rock. He may be young but he's become a father and needs to man up, stand on his own two feet and stop abusing you, his mother.

You're right "emotional abuse is very damaging" so you must do all that you can to protect yourself.

Emotional abuse is very damaging. It destroys you.

It was so bad last year that I panicked everytime he rang or messaged me and cried everytime he left or hung up because they/he/she had upset me with their behaviour or words whether towards me or towards him. But he is very young and I do hope that at least he eventually remembers how to be a decent man. But this cutting contact is very childish as I have things of his here that he is almost certain to need. They haven't got their own home and struck out on their own. He just moved into her childhood bedroom with her. And they insist on continuing to log in from there and use my film streaming service which I have now stopped trying to prevent as all I was achieving was winding myself up and it isn't costing me more. I don't think he thinks the situation is permanent and I think he thinks he can sort it when he chooses. Because you know I will cope because I have always been his rock and always coped. I nearly didn't. I became very unsafe mentally before he stopped contact. I never knew what drama was going to happen next or what was going to be demanded from me. I am an actual person but he's lost sight of that. There's been 2 attempts to contact me this month because he wants something but I can't , I just can't so I have starting hiding. In all seriousness if they push me to that place mentally again I can not guarantee my survival, I am frightened now of ever becoming that ill again. Terrified. It wasn't very long ago so being ill like that is still very clear. Except not clear because I think for a while I lost my mind. Never experienced being so ill before. Never want to again.

"I raised him to be a decent person and he was before her. He was liked by his peers and adults. He had lots of friends but not anymore".

I could have written that FlyingSolo, just replaced the "I" with we, for me and Mr. S. and yes, that's our ES to a 'T'. Same thing with the money, more with my brother than us. My brother's should have been paid back last May.

Apparently the other surgeons' lists are full so he has to wait until he can get another appointment Sparkling; fingers crossed it wont be too long a wait.

Rhinestone, did your psychologist say why you should continue to send cards and notes to your ES? I would like to understand their thought process on this point as I am sure many others will. It is hard when it involves your own family to think clearly.

Smileless, thank you. I raised him though and that makes me feel ashamed even though I raised him to be a decent person and he was before her. He was well liked by his peers and adults. He had lots of friends but not anymore. He is still very young and her even younger. But he has effectively stolen from me as it was a loan, not a gift and he knew I needed it back and when. He will do anything it seems to try and make her happy including steal from me (or con me out of it, depending on how you look at it) to buy her what she wants, not even what she needs but what she wants. They have a baby together so they are stuck with each other now.

What disappointing news Smileless, cancelling an operation two days before. Does that mean only one surgeon at the hospital qualified to do the operation? Just how bad it's becoming. Fingers crossed that next week they will have your husband as a priority. You can understand people using their savings if they have any, and going private.

We're not sick of hearing you talk about this FlyingSolo, that's what this thread is for, to give what support we can so talk to us whenever you feel the need.

Please don't feel ashamed, the shame is theirs not yours. Let's face it, they keep the gifts you send don't they even though they seem to think nothing of emotionally and financially abusing you.

Perhaps if the card and voucher are returned you could think about not sending anything in the future muffin. Only you can make that decision of course but no matter how prepared you think you are, it will still hurt.

for you both and remember, you're not alone.

I know if I send presents they will keep them. They don’t seem to have any problem taking me for everything they can get, both before and after they stopped speaking. I am very angry. I really need to talk but feel that everyone is sick of hearing me go on about it now as really I just keep repeating myself. I am so ashamed. And that we have reached the stage where now I am hiding from him. I too feel there is no way back from what they did to me. Emotional abuse, bullying, left me with no money to eat. She does it to him and in turn they did it to me. But yes of course I still love him because you never stop do you

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Hi Muffin, So sorry about the return of the present when like myself you go to the happiness to buy them something and then it is rejected.
In regard of your daughters birthday that is coming up I would say just do what you feel comfortable doing. If the card and whatever you send is sent back will that make you feel upset?
I did not send Christmas cards for daughter and grand-children for Christmas just gone as the estrangement which daughter instigated was beginning November and it upset me too much with Christmas coming that I did not want to even think about her. I sent two large bags of clothing and two lovely jackets for the girls about three weeks ago which were the things I had for them for Christmas my eldest daughter took them to her as they still have a relationship.
My daughter kept the gifts although I have had no little thank-you card or acknowledgement. That is why I question do I send cards for their birthdays or not as we know children can forget people so quickly and if they are not seeing me then maybe they just accept that as how life is.

Thanks PF how are you and how's your DH getting on?

Putting money away is a good idea 3nanny. We don't but I know a lot of EG's do. Maybe we'd have felt differently if we'd actually got to know them, but we never did.

I wonder if the suggestion about sending card and notes to an EAC is to 'keep the door open' and/or reminding them that you love them.

Did your psychologist say why she recommended this Rhinestone? It's not something we have or would do.

The hospital will 'phone next week; hopefully with a new date. Having to wait until April for your appointment that's already been cancelled twice must be so frustrating.

Good job your GP gave you extra pain killers; I hope they're giving you some rest bite from the pain.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

So sorry to hear that Smileless. ?

Thanks Pantglas it's so frustrating isn't it. He saw someone in addition to his specialist at the end of November and he couldn't believe Mr. S. wasn't already on the list!

Smileless That is such a nuisance to put on you at the last minute. When the hospital cancels ops like that I sometimes feel that surely another surgeon must be available particularly for the ones that have had a long wait and are in need of being seen .
Hope they have given some idea of the future date and it will not be too far off.

I myself was due at my pain management clinic early Jan, they canceled it to later in Jan, then they gave me one for Feb, I had a phone call from them cancelling that one as well
and now the appointment is not until end April. I asked the receptionist Why? she told me, we just cannot get the staff.
HA HA . you just couldn't make that up could you?
I just went to my G.P. and got extra pain killers I will survive it and keep battling on.

Only asking a quick question as I read one of the posts and someone mentioned that her psychologist had told her to keep sending cards and notes. I would like more information on the reason for sending notes.
I am asking because before becoming estranged from my daughter I recall having a conversation with her one day and I told her that I had received a letter from one of my cousins.
My daughter responded by saying Oh nobody sends letters anymore and most people do not even bother with cards, after all there is Facebook , social media , mobile phones and we no longer live in the dark ages when we need to bother with letters. Personally I do not feel the need to send notes to my daughter as she made it clear she no longer wanted contact with me so if I got in touch with her then my notes would only be begging notes asking for contact and I am not doing that.
The birthday cards are more important and my two eldest grand-children both have a birthday next month. I am considering to send them BDcards but the cards will probably arrive when they are at school and they may not even be given to them by my daughter. For me there are so many ifs and buts with estrangement and I know the love comes from us to send cards only those cards could just be deposited into the bin without any thought to the sentiments from the sender. It really is a hard one for me.
Maybe I may just stick to putting some money away for them like I already do.

My heart goes out to you Smileless2012 - my DH had to wait almost three years for his hip op and in the end we agreed to get over the border near Oswestry to be done quicker.

I know you’re a resilient person given everything you’ve been through and hope Mr S is first on the list when surgeon returns to work. Chin up x