AEC thread. Feel free to chat or add helpful resources here.

You must have done Starblaze 2 paragraphs toward the end of HolyHannah's post @ 05.12 beginning with "P.S.--"

Have I missed the mocking Smileless?

I've seen some mocking of abusive parents who happen to call themselves "good" Christians

I wasn't mocking you for your religion HolyHannah I had no idea there was a Jedi religion as I've said on the other thread you started.

As you clearly, and understandably wouldn't want to be mocked for your religion, perhaps you could extend that courtesy to others, or are you because of your personal experience, going to tar all Christians with the same brush?

That's so interesting Ironflower because I've given so much thought to understanding my mum but not my stepdad who would say things like "I don't want to know what your problem with your mum is, I just want YOU to sort it out" or "If you try to talk about it I won't listen". Honestly I think he was a very controlling man and a big part of that was projecting the image that everything was fine and wonderful.

What the neighbours thought was important, what I thought was not.

Ironflower -- That could be/IS the exact wording My enabler 'dad' would SAY. "I am not 'reading' that. I am not willing to do anything..." INCLUDING just reading something... And more so if it is YOU who is asking ME do 'that'.

Here's the full message that my dad sent me after I sent the article. The article was about ways to resolve generational differences on both sides. Ways to talk about issues together. It wasn't on either side.

"I am not reading what you have copied and it only makes me more angry that you are trying to teach us everything about life again.
Your arrogance is showing out again.
I can go and copy a hundred different theories and assumptions that probably total disagree with the one below.
You have a right not to listen to us and not to take any guidance or advice from us but if you think for one minute you are going to teach us all about life you are very mistaken."

Haha I meant to say Absolutely NOT. They have no idea how ridiculous to sounds.

Do our parents understand how ridiculous they sound pretending to be some kind of 'super-adult' that will always be smarter/better/superior to Us?

HolyHannah - Absolutely. My parents said exactly that. Even when I'm 60, they will still be my parents and I should do what they say (of course this rule doesn't apply to them concerning people older than them).

I tried once to send my parents an article that was aimed at helping families resolve differences. It was not biased on either side. My parents REFUSED to even look at it. Here was my dad's response: " if you think for one minute you are going to teach us all about life you are very mistaken."

My parents were complaining about a new traffic sign that they didn't understand. Their interpretation was ludicrous. For context it was the chevrons. I looked it up and I tried to explain that it was silly the way the law read but this is how it goes... He blew up. Any time if I was right about something, it was a personal attack on him. I never say anything for the sake of it. I study, I have so much education. He was mouthing off while I was watching tv that there was no way that they can know how far away a star is, that's stupid. I tried to explain that they actually use trigonometry to do it. He blew up saying that's *********. Anyone knowing anything he doesn't know is a huge attack. (I studied astronomy at uni - at least partly).

My entire life growing up was how he was so much starter than everyone else. Him against the world. It was almost a cult. The problems started when I started questioning things

Matt 5:24 says that we should make peace with our fellow person before we approach God. So no, you can't just pray to God for forgiveness and avoid dealing with the person first under Christianity.

Not a Christian per se, but knew that verse was there, so looked it up. No cop out in the Bible for not asking forgiveness of the person even before we ask God, if we are into that.

Starblaze -- If I am 'lesser' to them, my 'mom'/other EP's? I'm good with that.

I'm getting mocked for my religion. What I believe is what I believe. I certainly don't need helpful hints as to the tenets of my faith from others -- like I don't know my own religion.

I suppose my religion is one more way for 'betters' to see Me as "less". The core principle of the Jedi is to turn away from the Dark Side.

The Force teaches that the "Dark Side" (hate/anger/rage/fear etc.) is powerful and allows you to wield great power and inflict great damage, but it does not lead to peace and harmony.

It also teaches that negative emotions, the "Dark Side" cannot be defeated by more negative/hateful actions and declining the 'fight' is a Jedi's most powerful weapon. To be Jedi is to recognize and control one's emotions... Not let THEM control You.

To be Jedi is quite similar to being Vulcan. Many of the same principles apply. Truth, logic and shunning of the negative.

"Live Long and Prosper" and "May the Force Be with You".

P.S. -- There is no part of being Jedi that says, "Act as crappy as you want. Nobody is perfect and when you are not? All you have to do is pray to 'some guy' in sky and say you're sorry and you are forgiven/absolved!" Jedi don't have someone to forgive them when they 'wrong' -- part of the faith is to own your "wrongs".

For 'good' Christians, I guess if they pray to God for forgiveness they don't actually have to ask forgiveness from the actual living person they "wronged". To have great faith in Christianity must be VERY "comforting" for some.

Cue the list of Biblical obligations of children to their 'parents'... That parent never mentioned a single obligation toward their child... Like how about the most basic one... DO NOT ABUSE Your children!!!

There's been a lot of that going around lately, almost pandemic really

100% to both comments rosecarmel.

"The pattern is so deeply-seated- If I didn't see it, I'd believe them: that I'm less- But .. I'm not-"

My husband (arguably the most "successful" in his 'family') is still viewed as such aka 'less'. And Me in my 'family' as well...

'They' have a different "filter"/view of Us. And regardless of numbers/supporters/enablers, it will never make 'them' right in reality... Perhaps 'right' in their own mind...

Dysfunctional thinkers are NOT "right in their mind"... So that's why I always challenge their YOU are "lesser" mentality.

HolyHannah

I just realized that message was there rosecarmel...

LeeElizabeth -- I agree. I am sorry for your friends loss...

I understand, HolyHannah- I saw it so responded to that first before responding to your post- No intention to cause confusion-

Maturity:

Sibling: There are times when I feel like when Mom dies that I'm not going to tell you or other sibling that she's gone because I am the only one looking after her-

Me: I understand- I wouldn't hold it against you if you chose to do that- Your feelings are valid-

Fast forward:

I appreciate what my sibling did, but I don't owe them because they chose to- The "owe-ing" function is used to once again make me out to look less, to cloak me in goat skin-

Family members who sought therapy became "better yet" --even better than me than before-

The pattern is so deeply-seated- If I didn't see it, I'd believe them: that I'm less- But .. I'm not-

I just realized that message was there rosecarmel...

LeeElizabeth -- I agree. I am sorry for your friends loss...

LeeElizabeth

I'm not a perfect mom. Neither was my mom. We both did the best we could with what we had and what we knew at the time. Children don't come with owners manuals. My roommates mom died during the pandemic. We all only get one mother and her next breath isn't guaranteed. I wish my daughter would come home.

Sorry about your friends mom .. ?

I find it very odd that our 'parents'/and most EP's seem to have similar feelings/ideas about their AC.

I wonder at what point they proclaimed themselves mature adults (and they must consider themselves as such, given their attitude) and yet regardless of how old I got, I never was/am.

"is there ANYONE “sticking up” for you to let the ECs know that this is NOT acceptable, and that , in many cases, they are being childish, self-absorbed, and just plain ridiculous??? Anyone that they CARE for or ADMIRE, or would truly VALUE their opinion just told them flat out, grow up???"

Why does saying 'No' or disagreeing with "their way" = 'immature'? What makes them more "grown up" then Us?

Do our parents understand how ridiculous they sound pretending to be some kind of 'super-adult' that will always be smarter/better/superior to Us? What is wrong with equality? I would say that equality = respect. They demand respect but refuse to give it and yet we are the 'immature' ones...

"So what is your transgression, huh? Too perfect, oh oh, that is really bad because your perfection made them feel really small and less than perfect." Yes... They are perfect so no wonder we'll never be good enough....

I've responded to you on some of the other threads LeeElizabeth, please post again.

I'm not a perfect mom. Neither was my mom. We both did the best we could with what we had and what we knew at the time. Children don't come with owners manuals. My roommates mom died during the pandemic. We all only get one mother and her next breath isn't guaranteed. I wish my daughter would come home.

Good news is that I can have trauma, the odd bit of anxiety and depression, talk about it, support others AND Still be happy. I'm a pretty happy person, especially since estrangement.

Sparkling -- If that is your attitude, then please, would you give the same advice to the next EP who cries about the "living bereavement" that estrangement is to them?

"Why are you 'crying' about your child abandoning You? Them doing that either makes you 'stronger or the opposite'."

Your advice is 'good' but it only works if it is equally applied to both sides. And 'bad things' DO 'happen' but when you are dealing with child abusers? THEY are the ones making the "bad things" happen to their victim(s) and trying to victim blame/shame speaks for itself.

I asked a question, you answered it, you want to keep talking about how bad everything was and that is completely up to you.
Bad things happen, it either makes you stronger or the opposite.

Starblaze -- The answer is we are supposed to be good little victims and not talk about our abuse. We aren't supposed to support each other or help others see what dysfunctional thinking/behavior looks like.

We aren't supposed to have lingering issues due to abuse because now that we are adults we should just "get over it". We shouldn't talk about how common abuse is or why No Contact is often the only way to end the cycle of abuse.

EP's (abusive or not) don't want it known how many abuse victims have gone No Contact because it makes their unicorn stories less and less plausible.

It sounds like you know a lot about this Sparkling.

Can I ask you how exactly people get over trauma and any resulting depression and anxiety?

You haven't clarified a timescale either. How long would you expect it to take?

At which point should we be over it?

Also, having gotten over it, should we then not be supportive of anyone else going through it?

Thanks in advance!

What is it you want? A relationship with the person that abused you? To talk about your bad experiences? For someone to say a way you can block your past out? Are any of these things achievable? An aim would surely be to have a good life, to not let the past be the future too. Constantly picking scabs of wont do that I'm afraid.