The world isn't flat, it isn't round, it's ever changing- Wider at the equator due to centrifugal force, and it has mountains and deep trenches- It's beautiful-
We've all abused it-
Gransnet forums
Estrangement
The "abuse cycle" and other things/themes that EAC identify with.
(480 Posts)I understand that some EP's are profoundly hurt by their adult child(ren) choice to estrange/go No Contact. How someone reacts to being hurt is very telling in my opinion.
It is one thing for EP's to call estrangement a "living bereavement" but to go so far as to have memorial services and I even read about an EP that held a mock funeral and invited all the rest of the family that was loyal to her to the 'grave-side' ceremony. She wanted to show her young grand-daughter, her daughters child, what happens when you turn your back on 'family' by lowering a box of her Uncles possessions into the ground.
Sadly, abusive parents like that take those actions as a way to make them "feel better"/'take back their control' etc. Do they think of the implications of those actions? What must that poor child have thought? Clearly son/uncle was right to walk away from his FOO and the fact that his sister 'stood' with their mom and exposed her own child to that shows how the cycle of abuse works.
The message that child received was, "If you aren't 'good enough' or behave the 'right way' (their way) then you will be disposed of/'let go' as well." What could be more terrifying to a child? A minor child who has no exit options. Hint -- nothing... The fear of being abandoned/'cast out' was constant in my world because I was taught, "You don't matter and no one cares what happens to you..."
Now if the son finds out about this 'funeral', he'll probably go, "Yeah. Goes to show what she really thinks of Me. She'd rather see me 'dead' then stop abusing Me or even examine the possibility that she might be part of the issue."
I always felt like my 'mom' wanted me to kill myself and when I read EP's talking like that I thought, "Well, the fact that they are willing to do that in effigy says to me, maybe that's really where some abusive parents DO want their goat/lesser child(ren) to be... Dead." When/IF We finally 'wake-up'/come out of the FOG, also known as our breaking point/rock bottom, we refuse to enable the abuse by tolerating/accepting the abuse any further.
I believe this is what abusive EP's mean when they say, "My child needs to own 'their part' in the estrangement." I believe abusers think their victims "part" is that they (the victim) 'allowed'/accepted the abuse for as long as they did. What a beautiful/perfect denial of reality... "My child always 'accepted' how I treated them and even 'praised' Me as a 'mom' with cards and notes and AND AND..."
Of course abused children do 'those things' that abusive parents state. It is a child's attempt to get the love they desperately crave and abusers see that as 'proof' that they were a 'good' parent. Unfortunately, many of us eventually realize they is no love to be had regardless of what we do/have done.
The attitude of "that's just how I am, take it or leave it" is a sign of immaturity. As an adult, it's your responsibility to figure out which of your traits are toxic and are negatively impactful towards other people and the ones you love, and to eventually learn how to fix them. At some point we all have to start making ourselves better individuals. If you truly believe you don't have to change anything about yourself, even at the very least the worst in you and that people will just have to deal with it, then sorry, you are still a child. -- Anonymous
Sorry pressed post to quickly
....HolyHannah I think there is a misunderstanding here. I meant that THAT person will HAVE a need to be believed.
....I didnt mean they necessarily SHOULD be believed , if there is evidence that their "truth" is not the truth!
The only apologies I ever got were 'sorry if that upset you' or 'sorry you feel that way' or 'sorry but you always' or 'sorry I wasn't a perfect parent, no one is'. I thought they were real until I tried to have a conversation about whatever it was and got told it didn't happen, I'd imagined it or I just couldn't take jokes. i wonder if their children ever got a real apology? There's no clues because they don't say what they apologised for so hard to know x
"The person who believes their truth is the truth will also need it to be believed"
HolyHannah I think there is a misunderstanding here. I meant that THAT person will HAVE a need to be believed.
And the 'slap happy' parent I just referenced...
issendai.com/wp/estrangement/the-slow-build-getting-details-one-drip-at-a-time/
Madgran -- I must disagree with, "The person who believes their truth is the truth will also need it to be believed!!" If someone believes 'their truth' that "the Earth is flat" it is not 'help' or support to tell them, "Of course the Earth is flat. I believe you." That is feeding a falsehood/delusion.
When EAC write a No Contact letter of explanation the 'parent' considers it "all lies" just like they were saying, "Ummm sorry... The world is ROUND." to a Flat-Earther. I have never heard a positive outcome story from an EP who got such a letter.
A healthier attitude and true support would be saying, "Whoa... Someone took the time to write you 11 pages of material and there's not ANY TRUTH in there at all? That seems highly unlikely. Perhaps you should have a neutral third party read and discuss the content with you."
Not that it would help an abusive/dysfunctional parent... An EP said, "I told my counselor that I feel I should apologize and everything would be ok…..things would get back to “normal”. My counselor looked me straight in the eye and said “apologize for what”. I just stared blankly back at her. She asked me again and I couldn’t respond. I realized I will not apologize for refusing to be disrespected and being treated like shit, like we are worthless people."
And other EP's will agree with her position and sentiment about apologies... However, this same EP (who does not know why she is estranged) admitted earlier that she had slapped one of her AC "multiple times" in the face. Well, that might be something she should apologize for IMO... And yet she couldn't think of ANYTHING.
So with examples like that, it is easy to see why I just don't blindly believe "the world is flat"/I was a 'good parent' and "I'm estranged for 'no reason'." and, "I have 'nothing' to apologize for" EP's. Clearly EP's believe EAC lie routinely because they believe each other (without knowing "both sides") that those letters are "all lies".
Smileless said, "You make constant references to the things you have read that EP's say, the majority of which cast EP's in a bad light, but without providing the source of your information."
www.rejectedparents.net/forums/topic/can-someone-please-explain-this-to-me/
Smileless not thinking about it is an understandable self protection. Thankyou for sharing your experience so openly despite the pain. 
Yennifer thanks
Smileless2012 
Everyone needs their truth to be believed unless their truth is a LIE.
The person who believes their truth is the truth will also need it to be believed!!
The world not being flat has been proven scientifically which is different to making a judgement about someone else's truth. On this forum, we can only respond to the truth as someone tells it to us as they see it.
I've just read my last 2 posts out to Mr. S., well tried to read them but it was all I could do to get the words out because I was crying.
That happened more than 7 years ago, I've not thought about it for some time now and it's as if I'd forgotten how heart breaking it was. Maybe that's why I don't think about it.
...SOME other mental illnesses are not
C-PTSD is created by abuse. It is not genetic or comes on due to other factors.
Yes. That is a mental illness brought on by abuse. Other mental illnesses are not.
A few days before we went on that holiday was the last time we saw our GC. Our ES left him with us for a couple of hours. There was tension there no doubt, but when he came to collect our GC he wished us a safe journey and a good holiday.
I remember as if it were yesterday, kissing our GC on his little cheek, telling him I loved him and would see him soon. I never saw him again.
At the point we were estranged, no, nothing Yennifer. We knew we'd been estranged after returning from a 3 week holiday. 5 days after our return was our ES's birthday so I did what I'd done every year since he'd left home, I 'phoned his landline to wish him a happy birthday and to say his card and present were at our house.
I was met with a recorded message that 'the person you are calling in not accepting calls from this number'. A few week later the gift of a book bought for our GC's first Christmas was forced through our letter box with a note telling us we were no longer a part of our son's or GC's lives and were to stay away.
Did they not say anything Smileless2012? I think giving a reason is the right thing to do whether it's listened to or not really x
And who is to say another's truth is a lie? We all know the world isn't flat, that's a scientific fact but there are no scientific facts when it come to estrangement. Only we know if what we are saying about our personal estrangement is true.
Everyone needs their truth to be believed unless their truth is a LIE. My 'truth' is that the world is flat. So if you believe my 'truth' that the world IS flat, then you are delusional like me, or you are enabling my delusional behavior. Either way, I am not going to come to the reality/truth that the world is round with people feeding my false belief that the world is flat.
I put the word love " " because I was quoting you Hithere.
Whoops I missed a whole chunk of the conversation x
Smileless, I love issendai, not "love"
Why do you feel the need to rewrite my statements?
I wish I could provide an 11 page letter, or even a 1 page letter from our ES that was "a well thought out and detailed letter of (his) reason for distancing from (us)" and apart from a minimum of contact with his brother, his entire family; but we never received one.
I too am sorry for what you've experienced and the effect that has had HolyHannah.
Whether people can accept the truth is another matter. We all need our truth to be accepted.
I'm willing to try new views and change- Some things prove tried and true, some only work for certain circumstances- Some are a one off-
I realise now that it doesn't matter who mother is to others, family, friends or strangers on the Internet. It matters how she was treating me. She wouldn't stop treating me badly whatever I said or did and no contact is fair and just resulting from her own actions. Now I honestly truly completely know and understand this the weight I was carrying around has just gone. I've visited so many forums and even admin a support group and here is the only place I seemed to learn that x
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