Domestic Violence from kids to parents

The OP doesn't clarify the age of the lads using violence towards their mothers. Lots of discussion here about the age at which children can be said to be using domestic violence against parents.
Toddlers often lash out, surprisingly toddlers who have never been in an environment where adults smack our yell, will smack and yell themselves. It's a perfectly normal developmental stage. By 3 or 4 years, tantrums like you see in 18 month olds are largely gone because parents manage them well.
The family Chewbacca uses to illustrate parenting that isn't meeting the needs of the children, definitely need help. Many schools have close links with their social work teams who used to be able to offer 1-1 advice and referrals to sure start/other family centres for parenting skills groups. The mum definitely needs that kind of support and it would also enable a proper assessment of the children's needs. Whether any resources are left after 10 years of austerity, to meet those needs is another story.
Our prisons and youth offending centres are full of boys who were neglected and/or subject to extremes of physical and emotional abuse. The levels of illiteracy are high. Children can't learn when they're terrified or exhausted as too many children are.
There is a lot of focus on the 'old methods, clip round the ear' etc as though somehow returning to that kind of approach would solve our social problems. Society is different than it was 50 years ago. The young parents I know are child focussed, the children loved and cared for and no they're never hit. Hitting hurts physically and emotionally.

Where are people lining up against minor children? This thread highlighted an all too often not talked about issue of parents being the victims of domestic violence perpetrated by their children.

The case I referred too was an example of the disruption caused to a family by a minor child, and the case Chewbacca referred too was an awful example of boys aged 7 and 9 physically abusing their mother.

Of even greater concern are the numbers of AC who physically abuse their parents, which as pointed out earlier, can include fathers as well as mothers.

This thread isn't about abused children being scapegoated by abusive parents, it isn't about child abuse, it's about children abusing parents. We don't stop referring to our own, or other peoples children as children when they become adults, they are always their parents children.

Bibbity

Violence against children has proven to produce violent adults.

So very true. I've worked at many schools (both low socioeconomic and high socioeconomic) also a prison. There was a distinct relation between physical punishment and the anger of the child. One family in particular in the jail. The mother would be constantly threatening and hurting her children (everything reported), her children were the worst. They had serious anger issues and every hit made it worse. This was also more common in the lower socioeconomic schools. Screaming angry parents creating angry children. In contrast, the calm parents whom I saw using redirection, negotiating and explaining had calm children.

My dad was very physically abusive to my brothers. If he ever heard about any kind of incident, he would be there hurting them badly. It never stopped them, they got worse. My brother is now a career criminal (currently in prison right now for armed robbery). My parents used to constantly brag about 'they just need a good beating' when hearing a story about a criminal teen, well guess what it doesn't work.

Chewbacca, elder abuse in the context of anybody abusing them (including their adult children). The problem is - that anyone over 74 seems to not count!

campaigns.ageuk.org.uk/page/68887/petition/1

MrsWarren -- I completely agree. When adults are labeling/blaming children for being/doing children like things it calls into question the mentally being employed by the 'adults' judging that behavior.

As I've said, I have been in the reverse situation and it's soul destroying being blamed by adults when all you want is fairness. How is it "fair" when you are being abused and the adult abuser convinces everyone else you are the problem and when someone doesn't see that "horrible you" then you are told they just aren't seeing you 'right'/you are manipulating them. Even when someone sees your "good" the abuser makes that a negative thing you have done/are.

That 'putting the child in a box' as 'bad'/manipulative etc. is often Scapegoating and it shows how a Scapegoat child can be isolated (even when around other adults) and systematically abused by the whole 'family'/community etc.

Starblaze

Already realised and apologised Chewbacca hope you can forgive the error?

Of course, no problem at all.

HolyHannah

MrsWarren -- It's amazing how some are willing to line up against a minor child who is likely reacting to "something". That's exactly what my 'mom' did to the adults around me. They ALL believed what a horrible/manipulative child I was. If anyone saw "good" or didn't see Me as 'the issue' then they were kept away. The only people that were allowed around Me were other abusers who loved having another Scapegoat around.

People labeling minor children as 'bad' and then acting on that belief is what drives children to suicide. I always look at the 'family unit' before I "buy" one child is causing all the problems in a home because leadership flows down-hill and the parent(s) are the leaders/in charge of the family.

HolyHannah - A child acting out is always reacting to something.

I am concerned about the term “domestic violence” being used to describe minor children’s behaviour.

I am concerned about minor children being labelled as nasty, manipulative etc.

They are children. They only know what they have been taught.

Assigning adult motives to children is wrong.

Already realised and apologised Chewbacca hope you can forgive the error?

Cross posts

Starblaze

I went back and checked and you said possibly Chewbacca, no "no" anywhere

Then you're not looking at my post @ 23.40 which said

23.40Chewbacca

"So you would consider a toddler hitting their parent during a tantrum domestic violence? No
What about a 7 year old SEN child hitting out at their parent. Is that domestic violence? Possibly, but as I have no experience of that, so it's hard to say.

That ok for you?"

Ah I see it now, sandwiched in the quoted text it blended in. My apologies

Good idea Callistemon

Chewbacca

^It is utterly shocking to hear someone say that a toddler hitting their parent (a developmentally^ normal behaviour) is possibly domestic violence Pardon me??

I'm fairly sure that when you asked me So you would consider a toddler hitting their parent during a tantrum domestic violence I replied at 23.40 with the word NO. I've just had another look at my reply, just to make sure and..... yep, there it is.

Just read back your reply and I apologise. I clearly misread it. It was quite difficult for my tired eyes to see.

Now I know why I don't normally venture on to the Estrangement threads.

Lavazza I'm not sure why this is under that heading - would you get more response if you asked GNHQ to move it?

I do agree that mum needs serious support and the children need counselling. By her behaviou as described she is too ashamed to get it and I would hope being judged by some out there as a single mum doesn't prevent that

I went back and checked and you said possibly Chewbacca, no "no" anywhere

This is becoming surreal.

Toddlers in our family usually lay on the floor and had a good scream until they were red in the face.

Any older child of normal intelligence hitting his mother and laughing needs to be referred to a psychologist.
They are extremely disturbed.

Message deleted by Gransnet as it repeats a post which has since been withdrawn. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

A clip round the ear from the friendly local policeman!
But of course not allowed now.

I'd probably leave them at school and fail to pick them up in the afternoon.

My mother abused me, her mother and father abused her in different ways, her father had scars from abuse. There I have no more history but the change came with me, not apparently the generations before

Callistemon

I think you're nit picking MrsW.

Sorry, I'm not playing games.

I really have no interest in playing games.

I actually had no interest in posting here tonight.

Until I seen the language being used and motives being assigned to minor children.

What is the difference now

The million dollar question Callistemon! That's what I'd like to know and why I asked whether the COVID lockdown has seriously impacted children's social, behavioural and developmental growth.

Callistemon

Most manage just fine. Some do not.
This mother needs help. Those boys obviously have no respect for females.

How many women brought up children singlehandedly during the war and probably afterwards without problems?
What is the difference now?

Social media, widespread news and awareness perhaps accounts for some of it.

Domestic violence from anyone to anyone is far from new

I think you're nit picking MrsW.

Sorry, I'm not playing games.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.