SUPPORT for all living with estrangement

Great to see your post here Zander as I know you were having problems getting onto and posting on this thread.

So many of us have found this past year difficult because as you say, with Covid there's been so much emphasis on the importance of family, and that has increased our sense of isolation from the ones we love who no longer want us in our lives.

Your D was particularly unkind, so you wrote to explain how upset you were and as a result, have been stopped from seeing your GD's. This is indeed a case where children are being withdrawn from your life in order to punish you, with no thought for how they will be affected.

The silence is deafening isn't it, and it's virtually impossible to stop those tormenting thoughts from coming into your mind and affecting every part of your life.

It takes time, not to never have those thoughts and feelings because I don't think they ever do stop, but for their frequency to lessen.

From my own experience, this is not something you can force, it comes with time and it was a while before it registered that I wasn't thinking about our ES and our only GC all of the time, then several times a day, just once a day and then days would go by and I hadn't 'gone there'. Those days became weeks and those weeks have become months.

To begin with I felt guilty that I was no longer consumed with the pain that our estrangement had brought, and when I realised that that was how I felt, I realised that I was subconsciously holding onto that pain and that that was preventing me and Mr. S. from moving on with our lives.

You have "exhausted every way to resolve this" so I hope that knowing this will in itself bring you some peace. You've done all that you can; there's nothing more you can do to try and get your D to communicate with you.

If you're unable to send your GD's birthday cards and cards at Christmas, perhaps because they're being returned to you, think about making a memory box where you can keep the cards you've written but were unable to send.

At some point in the future, you may see your GD's and they'll know that you never forgot them. If that never happens, the memory box can be left to them in your will so at least you'll know that they knew you loved them.

Take each day as it comes, there's no road map which gives the best route through this and no time scale either; it takes as long as it takes. Make the most of the fact that you're "a fit, active and positive person" and find new projects to fill the time.

Think about counselling or reading books on estrangement. The best I ever read was by Sharon Anne Wildey 'Abandoned Parents: the devil's dilemma' which is available from Amazon.

You're not alone as you'll have realised by reading the accounts of others and simply knowing this can be a source of comfort.

Now you've found us, post again as talking to others who really understand can be priceless.

Zander glad you found this thread. This is the right one for you. After my son sent that email in May I read this thread and then reached out to Smiles. Because of the wonderful woman she helped me come to terms with his rejection. Eventually I plucked up the courage to post. So glad I did. Being here means you are no longer alone.

I reached out to my son as in his email he asked for time. Which I gave him until the August it was his and 2nd son's birthday plus my new grandson would have been born. I sent cards and presents for them all. Everything came back all unopened with a vile letter stating he wanted zero contact.

I haven't contacted him since I will not let him hurt me again. I miss him and my grandson's very much. But he has made his choice I hope he lives to regret it. My 3 grandson's will ask questions when they are older.

Your granddaughter's are at the age to ask questions now. But your granddaughters will get older and their parents can no longer control them. Then they will be free you find you themselves.

As your daughter is thoughtless and moody your granddaughter's will know what their mom is like. As they are growing up in that atmosphere.
When my brother's second marriage broke up because of how their mother is my nephew and eldest niece went with him. Their sister stayed as she was only 8.

We bring our children up the best way we can and instill into them good values. Unfortunately as they become adults they become a law unto themselves. We try to find reasons why they act as they do but you end up.driving yourself mad.

With the help here I have come to terms with what my son has done it was cruel and cowardly. He wasn't brought up to be that. Finding out my daughter in law has hated me for a long time was a shock. I don't hate either of them but will never trust him or forgive either of them. Any love I had died for my daughter in law when I found out something she had written on Reddit. But still love my son and grandson's. I suppose over the coming years the love for my son will be for the son I knew not the son of the last year. But my love for my grandson's will never lessen.

By posting on here Zander it will help you learn to cope with the loss. To me losing my son and grandson's it's like a beveveament . You go though all the same emotions. You like me are widowed and know the hell of grieving for the one person in our lives that made us whole. As you have come to terms with that loss you will come to terms with this. Is not easy but you learn to cope. Take each day at a time. And don't blame yourself. After August I put away any photos I had out of my son and daughter in law. And only have photos of the 2 grandsons I now in my living room and bedroom.

Others here will help you. This is a safe place . You won't be judged but helped. ?

Hi I think I am on the right thread now..?..I am widowed and my only family ( apart from nieces and nephews in South Africa) are my daughter/s-in-l and 2 12yr.old grandaughters.
My daughter can be thoughtless and moody as well as charming, and although I have supported them in every way over the years she has often been curt and inconsiderate...I know she is oblivious and not the easiest person to talk to but I love seeing the girls so keep quiet and accept the way she is.
Two years ago she was particularly unkind and I was so hurt I left and wrote a letter to her to explain how I felt.
She hasn't spoken to me since and although I have exhausted every way to resolve this there is a wall of silence, and I have been denied any contact with the girls.
I have confided in friends and coped, but this last year has been devastating especially as the focus has been on the importance of family getting you through the covid lockdowns.
Reading other accounts I see the pain inflicted by selfish parents using their children to punish, and wish there was a way to switch off the constant thoughts which torment me.
I am a fit, active and positive person but this is affecting my life and making me ill..any help on how to live with this..Zander

Smiles don't worry I look after myself. My husband knew me so well he knew what I needed to live without him. When he got so ill from the November he made me promise a lot of things. One I would not that was he wanted me to re marry . He was my one and only.

I looked after his mom even though I hated her up until her death. She was an evil woman she denigned she ever had a son or had 2 grandchildren. She told people about her daughter . She died aged 12 my husband was 5. After he died all the photos of him ,our wedding photo and all the photos of our children where hidden away.

When she had the button that went round her neck I was there . She asked me to be with her. She had a large photo of her brother,sister in law and 3 children on the wall she told the women who came he was her son and family. I soon put them right. Her brother is 12 years younger and it was an old photo.

We never said anything bad about his parents. Our children decided what their grandmother was like themselves and when they asked about their grandfather we told them exactly what he was like.

The day he died he had a private phone talk with our daughter whilst she was on the train coming home. He had the same with our son who was at home. I know he would have made them promise things as well and one would have been to look after me. My daughter has kept her word to her dad my son has not.

He said live the best life you can and I do and always will. It gets harder without him. The grief never ends you just cope better.

When I saw the Queen sitting there all alone she looked so small and lost and knew how she felt. She is now a member of a club no body wants to join.

It doesn't matter if you have been with your other half of you a year or 50+ the loss is the same. Once you lose your other half you are never whole again. I still feel half of me is missing. That's why I try and help some on the breavenment forum with mainly PM s sometimes posting openly. Not just widows but daughter's and anyone one else I can.

We need to cherish our loved ones as life is short. That's why I can't understand how our adult children can treat good parents so badly. And denigh our grandchildren our love and attention. At lot of my cherished memories are of being with my grandparents. Mainly my nan as my granddad died when I was 8. My nan lived to she was 89. Dad's dad died the year I was born. I never considered his step mother my nan. But we visited every week along with all mom's side.

Because I am back on antibiotics have to have the first one at 5am to fit the 3 in around my usual bunch of tablets. Hence me waffling on as usual. Hopefully sometimes I make sense.

Being here is like having a chat with friends . That makes me feel happy. We don't always agree but are still here for eachother none the less.

It may well have been a one off Whiff what with your birthday just a few days away and that also being the last time you saw your son.

"Well what doesn't kill me makes me stronger" I agree with that but just you make sure you look after yourself all the samex

I am feeling a lot better . Thank you for all your good wishes and concern. Walked to the post only in the next road . Think I should be called Neil Armstrong the way I am walking.?. Need to be on top form for my Friday outing with my daughter and grandson's and then fish and chip.dinner at their's. Haven't had fish and chips from chippie for a couple of years.
At least it was only the 3 seizures on Saturday. They upset me so much because it had been over a year since my last one. But like my daughter said today it was probably a one off. Just not going to worry about what ifs. Life is to short for that. Speaking to my GP on the 14th but expect to have to be in touch before then as can't seem to go a fortnight without another kidney infection. Well what doesn't kill me makes me stronger. ?

Oh goodness Whiff, thank goodness it's nothing worse, but I'm sure you could have done without the alarm on top of everything else.

Take care of you. xxx

Thank goodness you're OK Whiff, you gave us all a bit of a scare.

Take things easy xx

?? Yogin. Feeling ok. Limbs are sore because of the seizures but will just rest today and probably tomorrow see how I feel. Thank you all for your good wishes.

Whiff wish you better

??? 3nanny6 and Madgran77

Got home just before 7pm. Got another kidney infection back on the antibiotics. My heart is fine and only had the 3 seizures which did upset me as it's been a year without. They did lots of tests including a chest X ray Aintree hospital is wonderful. The health care up here is far superior to that of the West Midlands. Resting up for a few days.

Just feel awful as my daughter was upset when the ambulance came. Mind you she made me laugh when she picked me up. My grandson asked why nannie not got my potty chair out and my step to wash my hands. He knows nannie always has everything ready when he comes.

Will just rest for a few days and be back to my normal self. The infections always makes my balance worse and co ordination is off plus I have to concentrate more before I say anything as my words can be garbled .

My daughter thought I didn't seem quite myself yesterday and repeated myself a lot. We now know that's another warning sign I have an infection. Going to speak to my GP and see if I can have a prescription at home ready to get antibiotics straight away ready for when I have another one. Be glad when I speak to the urologist and get tested.

Hugs back Smiles. ???

Whiff

Oh goodness Whiff that is not good, so glad you got to the A@E where you will be in the best of hands let us know how things went. You may have tired yourself out yesterday with the visit from your daughter and grandsons they can be tiring when they are young. I know it tired me out when I used to take my GC out and the next day I always had to rest.
Sending you flowers.

OMG Whiff please let us know as soon as you can that you're OK. Sending love, (((hugs))) and xx

Famous last words. I am in A&E. Got chest pains and pain in my arm. Felt unwell. Had 3 seizures not had one in a year. See the Dr waiting for results from a lot of tests.

Good Afternoon all and hope everyone is well. I do feel better
when the weather is good just the fact of some sunshine can be cheerful and often gives me more energy.

I am fascinated to hear of all the dreams all of you have (not
so good the nightmares) and I would like to have some good dreams and remember them the next morning only often
I do not dream once I get into bed and drop off asleep then I
know nothing more until I wake up again, my daughter with my GC once told me that she has such vivid dreams and often she said she dreamt of her gran and grand-dad.

Smileless2012 that must have been a shock for the photograph to have come up on FB, although at least it was of you and Mr. S. as before I remember something about your E.S. f.i.l on there and you did not like it. A wedding blessing that must have been a memorable occasion.
I do not have any account or photographs on F.B but one of my cousins youngest children had a baby that was born two weeks ago and I know he has an account on F.B. so I was able to see photos of the baby she is gorgeous and he is the proud dad of his new little girl.
I think it was Whiff who said she hopes I get to see my new GC, even if my d.i.l does not bring the baby around then I know my son will bring it. He patiently puts up with some of her moods but when he puts his foot down she knows he is a man and not a mouse although he never gets angry towards her I just stay out of things and let them work through their own relationship, to say very little is my best option.

Time to get my Best Babies in the world out my dogs who are the best friends in my life although they are getting older now so time for them to be looked after and loved and hopefully they will be with me for awhile yet.

All enjoy the rest of the day and the lovely sunshine.

I too, often dream of my ES as a boy smiles.
Glad you had a good night whiff - nothing silly about sharing what bothers you and fantastic that it seemed to help. Hope you get whatever the greenhouse problem is sorted, I do hate having to chase things up and faff about when thing's don't work properly. I am so glad your DD and family are being good to you, we really do have to cherish those that do love us. Your GS sounds adorable.

Hope you have a good last day smiles and safe journey home. x

I'm so pleased that you had a good night's sleep Whiff. Your GS sounds an absolute delight and imagining you rushing around with a broom, carpet sweeper and dusters gave me a giggle.

So lucky to have Mr. S. in my life so never knew heart break until our estrangement and I think my heart was more shattered than broken.

Put together again now though although there is a rather large piece missing.

We go home tomorrow and both want to stay but things to do, people to see and all that. We'll be back again in a couple of weeks when we combine coming here with our first stay for this year in our motor home 'Charlie 2'.

Can't help but wonder how either of us ever had the time to go to work.

Sharing with you all helped as I sleep really well last night . Didn't wake until 7.20 which is late for me as I usually wake between 5-6. Thank you for your support. To be honest did feel a bit silly writing about my nightmare but knew you would understand.

My daughter and grandson's where here yesterday. We couldn't plan seeds as planned as the greenhouse was still being put up. There must be a bit missing as there isn't a groove for the door to run on at the bottom. Emailed and sent photos to firm I had it from. Speak to them Monday they aren't open of a weekend.

My grandson decided after playing nannies bungalow needed a good clean. So had me charging room to room with the broom ,dusters and carpet sweeper. It does it at his home. Told my daughter to enjoy as trying to get a teenager to put his washing out let clean is a up hill battle.

3nanny6 glad your BP was a bit better. Blood test will just rule out if you have problems with your heart etc. Must admit blood tests fascinate me . It amazing what they can tell from your blood. But then again I think our bodies are amazing. When I was younger used to take it for granted but when mine started to go wrong you become more aware of what everything does. It's like Covid my daughter and family all got it . 2 days before I spend hours each day with them all and didn't get it!

I hope you get to see the baby. Or at least know when it's born and name and a photo or video. .

I assume my 4th grandson's looks like his brothers did. And assume he has a lovely name as they do. My grandson's with my son are in age order 1st,3rd and 4th. My grandson's with my daughter are 2nd and 5th.
2nd and 3rd where born in the same year as where 4th and 5th.

Smiles my daughter and family are doing everything they can on my birthday to make it special and erase what happened last year. Makes me love them all the more. Why when you raise your the children the same one will bend your heart. Don't say broken . As what he has done hasn't broken me just got a bit bent. For all him and my daughter in law have done and said. Nothing comes close to my husband dieing.

Hugshelp sorry you have nightmares to . But in a funny way it means our brains are functioning on all cylinders. We haven't lost our marbles yet.

Well it's a sunny day here will peg my washing out and varnish my bench ready to go out. Have a good day everyone ?

It was totally unexpected Madgran Mr. S. bless him said he wouldn't have shown it to me if he'd realised but thank goodness, what would have reduced me to tears 3 or 4 years ago doesn't anymore.

It is what it is, we can't change what's happened and I'm simply thankful that we've moved on and have a happy and peaceful life.

Dreams are strange aren't they hugshelp. If I ever dream about our ES it's more often than not, when he's a boy. If he comes into my dreams as a man, he doesn't look like our ES and his name isn't mentioned but I know that it's him.

I agree with what you say about the Reddit site not for the feint hearted.

I have spells of nightmares too Whiff - especially ones about my kids, usually when I'm anxious about them. They certainly intensified when my son estranged from me and dreaming about him still makes me feel really odd when I wake.

Glad you're a bit better 3nanny. The fairy lights are a lovely idea.

Your dream sounds healing, though sad smiles.

There is some very divisive stuff on reddit, from what I've seen, not just on estrangement forums, a lot of entitlement and dismissiveness of other viewpoints is the feel I got.

Oh Smileless what a reminder, that wedding blessing reception

Whiff I hope that being able to share with your new on line friends has helped a little.

Nightmares are horrible and I can understand that you're worried that what happened last night may indicate a resurgence of the nightmares you had all those years ago for so long.

You're fast approaching that awful first anniversary of losing your son, so it's understandable that at this time you're dreams are going to plagued by the tragic loss of your DH and your son too.

That doesn't mean though that the cycle of nightmares is starting again long term, so please try not to worry.

A night light is a brilliant idea, nothing to be ashamed of and if knowing that it's there as you drift off to sleep provides some comfort and reassurance, the dreams themselves may well reduce if not cease all together. I think 3nanny's suggestion of twinkling fairy lights is even better, something pretty to see when waking up from a bad dream.

Our dreams are how are subconscious 'deals' with the thoughts, memories and feelings that during the day time we're not always conscious of and/or are unable to face.

This is going to be a difficult week for you, not just because it will be a year since you last saw your son, but because your birthdays, like your life, will never be the same again due to your estrangement.

To have had to face life without your lovely DH must be so much harder without the love and support that you once had from your son.

I had a lovely dream about my mum last night but it was so sad because it was about how things should have been at the end of her life and not how they were. I woke up saying "I love you mum, I hope you know that" and she was smiling at me as we hugged.

Good news about your blood pressure 3nanny, I hope it stays that way and that your blood test results will be positive.

I don't do FB but know from Mr. S. that at certain times, on the anniversary of a special occasion, a photograph will pop up. Well one did last night and he showed it me. It was a lovely pic of us dancing together and I asked him if he knew where it had been taken.

He said it was 11 years ago and asked if it was from one of the charity fund raising dinner dances we used to go too. I put my glasses on to have another look, just to make sure I was right, and I was.

No I said, it's from our ES's wedding blessing reception!!

Sparkling : thank-you for the message and yes she is a little bit odd and I am not playing her games. The baby will soon be here and so I am waiting to see how things go. My son knows I am here for him and he can come to my home whenever he needs to. My blood pressure was a bit better when I went to the nurse at the clinic although the doctor wants some blood tests now but I think I am a bit better.
Whiff : sorry to hear you are having those nightmares it must be frightening for you. Do not worry about having a night-time light on there is nothing wrong with that.
After losing my Mum many years ago and then lost Dad as well also after that the children left home spaced out over about a 2 year gap and the house felt empty and quiet especially at night. I did not have nightmares but it seemed so dark at night and I have some twinkling small fairylights
in the bedroom and they just take the edge of the darkness and feel comforting it works for me.
Have a lovely birthday next week it is mine as well.