Toxic Mother

'I do think toxic people have to justify their actions be it mother, daughter, sister or neighbour.'

If they could or would do that, they wouldn't be a toxic person
It's like trying to communicate with a brick wall.

I'm not sure where it comes from but it's such a useful tactic.
I'm from the UK.

It's a way of protecting yourself from toxic people, just giving them small snippets of information that they can't 'use' to guilt you, manipulate you or make you feel bad.

You still have a relationship with them up but hold apart of you back. It's a shame that it has to be like that but the guilt trips from walking away can eat you up inside.

I hope I've explained that right.

Do all the phrases come from America as I have never heard of Grey Rocking someone. Unfortunately there are very toxic children out there and nobody can deny that. I do think toxic people have to justify their actions be it mother, daughter, sister or neighbour.

Grey rock it all the way.
I've used this in the past and it worked a treat.

Best way to win with these people is stop playing the game. Best advice I was given 10+ years ago.

I think that for those of you who wish to retain a relationship with a difficult parent, no matter what the cost, you must once, or maybe still do love them.
For those of us without that, who don’t like our parent, and have never had a satisfactory relationship, it is asking way too much.

My mother is 101. She is in a hospital bed unable to do anything for herself. I have been her carer for 15 years. Yes it has been hard but I have learnt so much about her. Her parents were very strict and she spent most of her childhood terrified. She stated she never knew what she had done wrong. She was told every misdemeanor was in the book of life She left school at 14 and wanted to be a hairdresser She had to work in her father's shop. She married and had children She followed her parents in disciplining her children. It was hard but I coped by being an avid reader.
She is still.terrified of everyone and lived a very sad life.
Human beings cope with the life in whatever manner they can
I am the last relative and I will not give up. Everyone can change.

I am truly sorry for anyone in an abusive relationship and entirely agree no one should be subjected to it. I know I made the point badly. I think to wait until someone is getting frail, in their eighties and on their own is just a little late to walk away. The original poster was not going to abandon her mother, just start to reduce contact to what she could cope with and agree her mother truly sounds a nightmare, I would not be subjected to that treatment. I did post and entirely support that. I was talking about the many older parents who are never visited when old as they have become a nuisance. Then yes, I do think you have a duty.
I do not condone in any way any abusive relationship, you get out ASAP .

Allsorts

I have looked at all these posts and afraid I rather agree with Pammeil, . Mother gets very old and more annoying, what’s new? Lost her partner and memory not so good, let someone else have the problem. This should have been confronted many many years ago, but obviously wasn’t. In my book you don’t just walk away from responsibilities. Totally think the opposite of Hithere, we are responsible for our elderly parents, however difficult, find a way to sort it. Cowards walk away.
Perhaps one day you will be judged and your children do the same.

This is a really horrible thing to say.
The mother had a responsibility to not abuse her children. The op has no responsibility at all to her.

Allsorts none of us chose to be born. None of us signed up to be responsible for elderly parents one day. Parents make the choice to have children.

Those who care for their parents do so out of love and respect or misplaced duty and guilt.

Which would anyone rather have? If the answer is either, then the parent deserves neither.

Abusive parents do incredible damage to their children. Many do not believe this as they do not believe children capable of great stress and feeling. They view them as less than. They say that they want to raise strong independant adults while demanding meek, quiet, subservient children.

It doesn't matter if an abusive person is 18 or 80. We do not forgive crimes because of the elderly status of those who commit them and emotional abuse is now a criminal offence.

It is only justice that comes when their victims finally decide they will not be one any more.

Allsorts In my view, responsibility works both ways but, in the first instance, parents are responsible for the emotional and psychological wellbeing of their children, to stand them in good stead for the future. It appears to me, from the OP's post, that her mother undermined the confidence and general self esteem of her and her brother, which has affected them in later life.

Of course, most, if not all parents make mistakes - and sometimes bad mistakes - in the way they care for their children. I am the first to admit that I made many mistakes with my first child which I believe affected her ability to cope with life as an adult. However, I acknowledged those mistakes and did my best to be a more caring and supportive parent in later life. Conversely, the OP's mother continues to undermine and manipulate her adult children and, from what the OP has said, remains critical and self-centred.

It is easy to be judgmental about other people's feelings and actions but I feel the OP has gone out of her way to manage a very difficult and soul-destroying situation. She does not need any more criticism - it sounds as if she has had a lifetime of that.

Allsorts
That's a bit harsh .. in these circumstances it's not cowardly to walk away from a toxic parent that hasn't been a decent parent to you and has harmed your mental health enough. You walk away to prevent them from destroying you completely. I've been in counselling for years trying to deal with the damage my mother did to me in childhood and beyond and I stuck it out until my father passed away to help him through her torment of him too. She showed her true colours and proved she had no interest in me from that point on so did I walk or was I finally pushed, whichever I feel no guilt but I wonder if she does!!!

"Where the mind goes the body follows."

So take care of yourself.

Guilt is a wasted emotion.

I have looked at all these posts and afraid I rather agree with Pammeil, . Mother gets very old and more annoying, what’s new? Lost her partner and memory not so good, let someone else have the problem. This should have been confronted many many years ago, but obviously wasn’t. In my book you don’t just walk away from responsibilities. Totally think the opposite of Hithere, we are responsible for our elderly parents, however difficult, find a way to sort it. Cowards walk away.
Perhaps one day you will be judged and your children do the same.

This really struck home to me. My mother was very similar, not quite as toxic but emotionally manipulated me and my sister, and played us off against each other. I didn't cut contact with her but when she died I realised how free I felt. I wish I'd had the courage to end the relationship years earlier, so I strongly recommend you do. good Luck thou - its very hard.

I think Grey Rock sounds a powerful strategy. I haven’t heard of it before either. I haven’t had any experience of this since my own mother died many years ago but Gampsy’s mother certainly sounds extremely self-centered and controlling. Perhaps give Grey Rock a try - you’ll be satisfying daughterly duties but might feel you’re clawing back some control over a difficult situation. I wish you well.

Let Social Care know she may now support as you are no longer able or willing to assist her, then put as much distance between you as you can !!

Walk away. You only have one life.

You have had enough abuse and now as an adult you can fight back by putting yourself and your family first. Don’t call her and most importantly have no guilt about doing so. You are so worth it and I think we would all feel better for you and applaud you. Put on your big boy pants, you can do this.

Your mother is unwell clearly. Why is it children from toxic parents often keep going back for more? because they live in hope one they will receive the love they so desired in childhood.Ever noticed that folk with good relationships with their parents don't have the same obligations to their parents?
Its a tough call for sure to walk away ,some folk do, some don't.

There comes a time when one day you have to say”Enough is enough”. Yes, she’s you’re mum, but she’s also a very nasty person, and would you allow anyone else to treat you like this. I have not spoken to my first born son for 11 years now as he became so rude ans nasty and blocked out all our friends and family for absolutely no reason, and we found out that other people who knew him had a very bad opinion of him. It broke my heart when this happened and was very hard to come to terms with, but after some years I accepted it and there is more peace within the family. We felt we always had to walk on eggshells around him. My advice is sever your ties with your mum and find some peace and happiness.

I agree wholeheartedly with Grey Rock treatment.

Your life is and has been affected by your mother's behaviour for a long time. You know yourself that if this was anyone else you would give them short shift . Take a break from it all. If you can't make a clean break reduce your contact and then end it. The old adage if you can pick your friends but not your relations comes to mind.

The only thing I felt I was entitled to was a mother who loved me and was someone who made me feel safe.

I haven't had the best example of how to parent but I certainly have tried to be those things for my children, even if I don't agree with them or they push the limits of my patience. I love them and I am a person they can come to for any reason, be heard and feel safe.

They have been encouraged to be themselves, take risks, form their own opinions, treat others with kindness and I've only ever asked for them to try their best but not so hard it hurts.

I don't think children these days feel entitled but I do think they know what they deserve from a parent and they are right.

Hi all I can say is I was in a similar situation to yourself only with one of brothers and my mother toxic wasn’t the word. She blamed me for having to marry my dad. I knew when he was alive she didn’t like me. My dad always tried to make up what she never did. When he died she had nothing to lose. Well cut along story short. I walked away 25yrs and never looked back. Like they say you can pick your friends but not your family but doesn’t mean you have to stick with them. You will feel better for it. I also moved away for a fresh start.

i find dr les carter on youtube very helpful.