Friendship,advice and support if estrangement has affected your life.

That's lovely Whiff. It's amazing how the words of a stranger can resonate so much that you feel they were written just for you.

As you say we are accused, judged and condemned without even being given the opportunity to defend ourselves. Is it any wonder that we have days when we wobble.

Does anyone remember the Weebles (might not be the correct spelling) they were advertised as 'weebles wobble but they don't fall down'; a bit like all of us.

I'm so pleased you feel a sense of relief Allsorts. It shows that all the time taken to make that decision, and all the agonising that went into it was worth it, and you have done what's right for you.

?Whiff, you wouldn’t be normal if you didn’t get the odd wobble, tomorrow you’ll be feeling right as rain. I’ve only made my decision the last few day, but feel a sense of relief, there’s only so much you can take and for finally knowing where you stand. We are all stronger than we think, but our love for our families sometimes blind us to the obvious.
Grannieunite, good news your daughter has broken free from that brute. You will see her blossom as time goes by and be her old self?

No one ever said it would be easy being a parent. And we all knew that when we decided to have our children. But who would have thought those little bundles of joy who we gave unconditional love and attention to . Put up with plenty of crap from them through the teenage years . Saw them grow into what we thought was sensible, loving adults instilled with all the values we hold dear turn against us. And for what. Being loving parents . I like all of us here will never know why our children decide let's throw out all unwanted crap starting with our parents.

I hated my in laws from when we first met and they hated me . I don't think they thought we would get married. But my husband never gave up on them. My father in law adored our children seems we did something right by having them. He died when our son was 8 months old. My mother in law took against our daughter from the first time she held her because she cried. She was all our son until he got old enough to have a mind of his own.

I asked my husband many times why bother with them his answer was always the same he loved them but didn't like them. So we went every week and still did after my father in law died. We would never dream of separating grandparents and grandchildren .

As the children got older they saw for themselves the difference between my husband's family and mine. Even after he died they never gave up on their grandmother. Made sure she had a nan card on Mother's Day. Even thought she denied having a son or grandchildren. My daughter in law and son in law knew her. And saw how she treated us. And how different my parents where. Unfortunately my dad died 3 years after my husband and never got to see them get married. But my mom was at both weddings and danced at both. My mother in law refused to go to either wedding.

My son and daughter in law know what a bad mother, mother in law and grandmother is. I will never understand why they are treating me this way.

As you can see having a bit of a wobble today. I suppose it's because I having a pain flare. Which means can't do what I wanted to do today. So having to rest . It annoys me when I can't do what I want.

Smiles your poem is lovely. This is one that I found after my husband died and means something to me. By W H Auden

Stop the clocks,cut off the telephone,
Prevent the dog from barking with a juicy bone,
Silence the piano and with muffled drum bring out the coffin,let the mourners come.

Let aeroplanes circle moaning overhead scribbling on the sky the message He is Dead.
Put crepe bows round the white necks of the public doves
Let the traffic policeman wear black cotton gloves

He was my north,my south,my east and my west
My working week and my Sunday rest
My noon,my midnight,my talk,my song;
I thought that love would last for ever : I was wrong

The stars are not wanted now : put out everyone ;
Pack up the moon and dismantle the sun ;
Pour away the ocean and sweep up the wood.
For nothing can ever come to any good.

Even though it's means something to me the last line doesn't . As I have 5 grandson's who carry part of my husband in them . Also knowing our children do to gives me comfort.

I am glad Allsorts and DerbyshireLass have made very hard decisions. But I hope your lives will be easier and you can move on. My son made it easy for me in a way by saying zero contact . So he has his wish. After his email and then that letter. It felt like I had been tried,convicted , sentenced
and punished . I didn't even know I had committed a crime. Criminals at least get their day in court .

Like I said having a wobble today.

Hope you are all having a better day. Thank you for being here. ❤️

It is always hard to decide what to keep. I have two boxes of stuff from my mam’s house and I sometimes have a look through them. They are worth nothing to anyone else as they are packed with memories.

Granniesunite - I hope your daughter can find peace now but I do understand what you have all gone through. For years I was in an abusive relationships. I married someone who my parents hated. My stomach churns when I think what I put them through and also what I went through. The whole thing has affected me mentally. So glad you are able to support her now.

I know that this weekend my eldest son, DIL and grand kids will be heading to Devon to their holiday home. They have excluded me from so much. My grandson will be 16 soon and he is looking forward to having driving lessons. Maybe in the future I will see him. Fed up with the whole bloody thing!!! Why me? Well, why not! Onwards and upwards but it is so hard at times.

You've made a decision DSL "to stick with it" which is probably why you're feeling a bit better and stronger today.

A period of not being able to decide and make up your mind about which is the best course of action is mentally exhausting. Now you've decided what you want to do for the time being, your mind will be free to think about and concentrate on other things.

Yes, it has been mental abuse Allsorts, behaviour that you tolerate because it's coming from your own child, and would be less likely to put up with if it was coming from anyone else.

It's a very powerful poem isn't and for me really puts into words the inner turmoil and struggle it is to let go, walk away and 'save' ourselves.

It's not just for ourselves that we wish we could be a part of our GC's lives, it's for our GC too. I was particularly close to my maternal GM and have wonderful memories to last a life time.

Our boys were particularly close to their paternal GP's so ES must know what he's depriving his own children of.

What a lovely surprise Yogin, hope you were able to find a vase to put the flowers in. I'm sure you still have loads to do but does it feel good to be there? Are you already happy that you've made the move?

I'm sure you are. I still get up out of bed everyday with a feeling of happiness and relief that we are where we are, even though we've been here for just over 5 years now.

to welcome you to your new home x

Whiff not weird to keep your DH jacket. I've kept my dad's jacket which has his clubs & military badges on and the buttons are special military ones too, couldn't throw it. I still have little dresses from my estD, my other daughter, plus their christening dress and bonnet and my son's christening outfit and his page boy outfit etc. I had an outfit of my mum's, not a special one, so gave it to charity when I moved.

Lovely poem Smiles Sorry to hear of your anxiety over Mr.S, I do feel the same about my DD on occasions.

Quotehugshelp Tue 08-Feb-22 22:57:
but I always tell myself that at least I have a warm comfy bed and couch. When I'm feeling a bit frustrated at not being able to crack on I often lie listening to the rain and wind and think of those who don't have a warm dry place to rest their heads. That how I think sometimes Hugs

QuoteGranniesunite Thu 10-Feb-22 17:16:52
I suspected he was controlling my daughter as she would do nothing without asking him first, never had any money and, didn’t have a decent coat jacket clothes etc in spite of earning really good money. He was dressed for every occasion she looked a poor soul at times. Same here, I said to my D to choose a coat for Xmas, but was cut out beforehand. Just thought, wonder if she thought 'darn I could have had a nice new coat'

Oh dear Petit you are going through it, so sorry to hear about your Dm.i.l. It will be hard for you to be in the same church as for your DH. I just couldn't go to a funeral after my D estranged herself, I went to my m.i.l funeral and wept buckets, my s.i.l said you cried more than me!!, but it was all the withheld emotions bubbling up at losing my D&GC, so I missed my neighbours, my friends and my Aunt & Uncles, as I just couldn't go there! I would probably be ok now, 9yrs on.

Yes settling in now Smiles thank you. Still tons to do though. I had a lovely surprise yesterday afternoon, a good friend knocked on the door with some lovely flowers & a card. It was so good to see her, with the lockdown we hadn't seen each other for, must be, 2yrs! Seemed as if I'd only seen her the week before when we got chatting. We have had lovely holidays together, one 2 weeks in India. When I told her about my nightmare move, she decided not to think about moving and downsizing like me.

Smileless, that poem made me cry, it’s what I’m doing at the moment as I can’t take any more as explained on the thread I started repairing estrangement. Anything is better than what I’ve had for years, as my friend said. It was mental abuse.

I would not sign a petition to see my grandchildren, it makes them in the middle of a tug of war. I would always send cards, open a bank account for them, because presents usually get binned. One day they will see parents as they are and make their minds up. I would have cut off for good if anyone tried that with mine. Luckily my children had lovely gp who we took on holiday and we’re a big part of their lives, and there was mutual love. Everyone had their minor faults but don’t we all.

Granniesunite..,,,,so good to hear that your daughter managed to get out of her evil husbands clutches. The years of abuse must have taken a huge toll on her. She must be a very strong and brave woman. You too for managing to stand by her all thise years, all that cheek biting paid off in the end. How sad that her daughter estranged her, after all she's been through.

This has been my thinking too - that I am after all my sons mother, that I must be there for him for when he needs me. It's so difficult isn't it. I hope I can be like you and somehow manage to stay strong enough to support my son, I do feel it's the right thing for me to do.

Hugshelp......I hope you get a reply to your letter. You were very brave to write. Hope it helps clear the air for you and your ES has a change of heart. We can but live in hope.

I feel a little better today, a little bit stronger. I think my rest yesterday might have done some good. Riding this rollercoaster is exhausting,

I have decided not to do anything at the moment. Just continue to let things stand as they are. I know that maybe sounds like a cop out but maybe sometimes doing nothing is the best course of action,

It's a decision - of sorts. Hopefully having made a decision to "stick with it" I can stop the endless ruminating and just switch my brain off. I am going to really try to focus on me now, lose weight, get fitter and get the house market ready.

Spring is round the corner, hopefully that will work it's magic and it will help lift all our spirits.

I did manage to spend a bit of time in the garden the other day, just gathering up leaves and weeding, I really enjoyed it. I find pottering about in the garden very therapeutic so hopefully there will be more mild days soon.

The good news is, the rest, milder weather and gentle yoga type exercises are definitely helping with my fibro. Starting to feel much better in that department.

Just need to keep up the exercises....?

I'm glad you all liked the poem. I hope it helps your friend Madgran.

The poem is back on our fridge where I can stop and read it whenever I feel the need.

Job not just

Granniesunite glad your daughter got away from that man . It's a good just she has you and the family. But how awful of her daughter. Surely she saw the hell her mom went through . How can she treat her this way . Your daughter is a very strong woman. ?

Lovely poem smiles.

I do think there is a chasm between how generations view things now. I think we try and see other points of view but sometimes it feels like that's a one-way street and we are the generation to be discarded for our antiquated views.

I'm glad your DD eventually saw the light GrannieS.

I know what you mean about committing things to paper and expecting them to be twisted DSL. I did reply to our ES and took a great deal of time with the wording. We'll see if I get a reply.

Another really low energy day for me. Been sleeping a lot and reading a bit but looking forward to watching dragon's den and the apprentice with DH tonight. We're not big TV watchers but this is our telly night atm.

That is a lovely and appropriate poem smileless ?

That is a lovely poem Smileless I have shared it with someone (a relative) who I am supporting through her estrangement from her daughter. She is trying to make a very difficult decision and I think this will help her. Thankyou!

Your daughter is an amazing and courageous woman Granniesunite and you must be immensely proud of her.

for you both x

My ex son in law was like thatDSL
We had years of biting cheeks til I was exhausted and bloody angry. I suspected he was controlling my daughter as she would do nothing without asking him first, never had any money and, didn’t have a decent coat jacket clothes etc in spite of earning really good money. He was dressed for every occasion she looked a poor soul at times. To say I was distressed is an understatement….

It was very difficult and at times I could have thrown her out the door never mind him, but it took years for her to admit to herself never mind us and her friends that she was being abused emotionally and financially. But one day she did.

She left him ,got a divorce but has been through hell with him since and her daughter has now estranged her. It’s a nightmare. But my daughter has said that she is lucky that we as a family stayed the course with her so she knew we’d support her when she was ready…

Mentally disengaging will take time DSL and the time that takes will give you the time to think about what you want to do.

I just don't understand how anyone could possibly think this is the way to treat your mother/m..i.l. and GM to your children. I feel so angry on your behalf.

You must have needed that afternoon nap so I'm glad you feel better for it.

Lovely poem Smiles......

I did think about writing to my son but decided against it. I think it might be a mistake to put anything in writing because I know that DIL would deliberately twist my words. As they say in the best police dramas "anything I say maybe used in evidence against me". It's probably better if I don't give her any ammunition,

Anything I have to say to him will have to be said face to face.

Last August, when everything blew up with DIL, I swore I would not let her over my threshold ever again. I relented for my sons sake because I felt sorry for him and didn't want to make life even more difficult for him.

A complete waste of time because she's not changed, actually her behaviour has gotten worse. So far I have said nothing but have been biding my time, giving her enough rope as it were. However, he is so blind and so under her control that she has turned him into a carbon copy of herself. At present there's not much to choose between them.

This is not just me saying this but even outsiders such as our builder have commented on the change in him and the dynamics of their marriage. It really does come to something when people outside the family have begun to notice and comment that there is something seriously wrong in that household.

Smiles you have advised me to give the matter time and thought, I shall take your advice and do exactly that. I wont do anything rash, I will continue with my "wait and see" policy. At the same time I need to mentally disengage, just try and stop my brain whirring away. Just need to concentrate on other, more pleasant things.

I've been very lazy today, have even had a nap on the sofa this afternoon. Actually I do feel better for it, I obviously needed the sleep. ?

sorry, missed of an 'e'

Oh that's great Granniesunit.

Just sent that poem to my daughter smileless.

It’s exactly what she is doing… ?

That is a sobering thought Whiff especially when you realise that when it happened to each and everyone of us, we thought we were the only ones.