The next thread for friendship, advice and support if estrangement has affected your life

No, forums are about discussion. I’ve never seen a counsellor/therapist so I don’t comment on their effectiveness.

My mother was extremely difficult, but she was also a brilliant Nan, so we both made it work.

Good that you patched it up with you mum before she died.🙂

I apologize for all my typos! I forgot to preview my message. I also may have given the impression that I didn't speak to my mother for years, which wasn't at all the case--after patching things up we saw each other, phoned, and so on. But towards the end of her life we again took up the practice of calling nightly at 7. I am so glad we did.

I hope this won't be seen as disruptive to the tone of the thread, but I wanted to mention some times when therapy has helped people a lot, and a time long, long LONG ago when I blocked my mother temporarily. I apologize if I'm making the thread too argumentative. That isn't my intent.

I want to mention that at times on this thread and elsewhere on Gransnet people do sometimes advocate seeing therapists without necessarily calling them therapists: grief counselors, for instance. Therapy can make huge differences in the lives of people who need it. For instance, someone on this thread sometimes mentions therapy that has helped people with borderline personality disorder; soldiers with shellshock--post traumatic stress disorder--often manage to break free of their horrific memories and bad dreams after therapy.

There is sometimes a profound need for it in someone's life--for such soldiers, for instance. At one time I had a student who was almost catatonic, barely able to make sense, who did not turn in any assignments and spoke so oddly in class that her classmates stared at her oddly. In my office she happened to reveal in a halting, roundabout way that her father expected her to sleep with him. I got her to the university counseling office that same day and the university found her a free dorm room and a full scholarship. She didn't even have to go home to get her clothes. They sent someone to pick them up. I ran into her four years later and she was an articulate medical student--something I would never have expected her to become, granted how bizarrely she behaved in my class. We were PROFOUNDLY happy to see each other. In her case, therapy and social support turned her life around.

An instance of temporary blockage: my mother had many good qualities, but . . . despite having insurance coverage for medical care and dentistry, she never sent me or my siblings to a dentist and only took us to an MD when we were really, really sick. We were not Christian Scientists. The three of us eventually thought "Hey, people my age go to dentists . . . maybe I should? When we got around to it, in our late twenties, each of us had cavities in the double digits. My brother had 23. All three of us have memories of going to an MD late in an illness and having an MD very upset with her: the same brother was sick in bed with fevers for weeks but got no better and had to have the swollen glands under his jaw lanced and remembers the smell as horrible, and I remember a doctor telling her my tonsils "were like golf balls! Why didn't you bring her in?!?" I think, with hindsight, that my mother thought that having a sick child indicated that she was in some way a bad mother. At any rate: after the birth of my son, we had a lovely arrangement--every night she called and I would tell her how my day with him went turned out to be an asthmatic in childhoodwhen my baby was three months old he got pneumonia, and my husband and I were terrified. After a sleepless night involving two trips to A&E he was much better. That night, when I told my mother about it, she began shrieking at me: "You're a bad mother! You're a bad mother!" again and again. I froze; my husband had to take the phone away and ring off. She called the next night at the same time and . . . I just couldn't speak to her for months. I didn't block her, but when she called for the next two or three nights I didn't answer. We didn't speak for months. Eventually we came to a family gathering at her home and things were patched up somewhat, but that precious period of closeness to my mother when I was post-partum was gone.

Much later in life when she was a widow I started calling her every night at the same time, which was a very good thing; she was understandably lonely and needed someone to talk to. So that was the equivalent of a temporary phone blockage.

There’s certain people who I have blocked, who shall remain nameless lol, but they are out of my life for good. They are done and dusted.👍

It’s not complicated for me. 🙂

If you're blocking on certain days of the week for example, and don't want the person being blocked to think it's a permanent situation surely you should say so User.

If this is what's perceived as being a way to control/manage the amount of communication then this needs to be explained. Blocking, then unblocking and blocking again with no reasons given is IMO playing mind games.

I'd be the sameDL and if anyone blocked me, would view that as being out of their life permanently. Blocking someone you don't intend to have out of your life permanently is not the solution, discussions are.

Yes, I’ve got to be honest. If I block someone, whether on social media like FB, or on either of my phones, they are out of my life - permanently.

If I just want to restrain themselves, I would discuss it with them.🙂

I don't like to post in here because we often disagree on things and I know this is a support thread. I want to offer an explanation for the blocking behavior. I am not giving my opinion on it but I see that it can be confusing. I will explain this in general terms and not specific to any situation.

Typically when you block someone on your phone you would do it permanently. I didn't block my mother until I was not intending to speak to her again.

However, if someone is trying to put rules around frequency or timing of contact they may block on certain days or times. So if one party only wanted to speak once a week, but the other party communicates throughout the week, blocking would help curb that. It might seem excessive but unwanted contact (whether or not that's warranted) can be distressing when you're trying to set those communication rules.

So you might unblock on weekends when you are open to contact, and block at other times to prevent notifications. Modern phones make it really hard to avoid the communications you don't want.

Whether or not the rules are fair is a matter of opinion, but I think that's what's going on. It's just a tactic to control something that is otherwise not controllable.

I have to say that I have no experience of counsellors/therapists. I’ve got a good friend and for over 50 years, we’ve had honest advice sharing, and supported each other through so many things.

I’ve never seen that waffling at a stranger was helpful to me. Others view it differently. Some therapists are better than others, from what I’ve heard.

My American daughter in law has always had therapists. I think, in part, because it’s often part of the medical insurance package that Americans use. My son has never used one, despite also being covered for it over there - he takes my view that good friends are the best option.

So, I don’t know if your DILs therapist might have created a problem that wasn’t there to start with.

But, either way, your son and DIL are parents now. They need to be the adults here - if they want to set boundaries, then they can do that, but be consistent.

But, you also need to keep to your boundaries. We are only treated as we allow ourselves to be.

So, I’d stop trying to contact them, get on with your life and move, and let them wonder what’s going on.

💐.

@Smiles and DL yes I’m finding it wearing to say the least having the goalposts shifted all the time . I’m all for anyone having boundaries- but I think any rule ( because after all a boundary is a rule ) should be clearly communicated before it’s set up . I have boundaries too - mine are to be treated with respect, not spoken to in the ways I have been and also to respect my need for open communication. I think this is fair . When things change it would be nice to be given some advance notice of this change . If my son didn’t want me to see the baby then why did he offer to come and bring him to see me ? I didn’t ask for the visit.
Nmama I think you’ve got the wrong end of the stick by suggesting I’m bothering my son and his wife . I do think though , after previously having a lovely close relationship with him and his wife it would be nice to have some explanation as to why they do behave like this towards me . Might be something to do with the fact my DIL paid to see a private therapist for a while - she obviously had some issues going on . It was around this time that her attitude towards me changed. I’m totally confused and I do think therapists can often be blamed for introducing issues where they’re not there in the first place . She wasn’t having therapy due to me ! It was her own mental health that was suffering at the time . A bit of clear communication like others have said would be great .
@Whiff I hope you get well soon because shingles is very painful isn’t it - take care .
@Allsorts - yes you don’t need to make repeated calls to know you’ve been blocked. There’s a certain message that comes up more or less confirming this . So , yes I know without ringing more than once . Mind you , sometimes he does unblock me , making this whole charade even more confusing.

I have a feeling it will be a quieter day DL.

Explanation and consistency are vital if you have boundaries you need to be respected, and some respect for the one you need to adhere to those boundaries is needed too.

If someone is feeling flaky and fragile,it's unkind to keep moving the goalposts absolutely.

Good morning all. 💐

Yesterday got a bit hectic, let’s hope it’s quieter today.

Whiff - hope you feel better soon.

In respect of boundaries, yes, we can work out what we can and can’t cope with, regarding others, but it needs to be explained and consistent.

If someone is feeling flaky and fragile, it’s unkind to keep moving the goalposts.

Hope everyone has a nice day.💐x

Morning everyone, hope you're not in too much discomfort Whiff .

I'm not suggesting there was a plan in place to let Ladysu see the baby and then turn on her Nmama, but months of threats and 'phone blocking have clearly taken their toll on her and IMO this is a cruel and unacceptable way to behave.

I hope you're OK Ladysu and keeping your focus on your upcoming move. Stay strong .

Yes--it's easier all around if everyone's clear about the boundaries they need to have. If they don't want to aid in the move and they'd said "Please don't ask us to move anything--we are just exhausted and tapped out, and even if it seems like a small thing, we just cannot do it" that would be one thing. Or "please don't call, DS will call on Saturday, the baby is on no kind of schedule yet and the telephone wakes him up, we haven't gotten a night's sleep since he was born, DS will call on Saturday as usual" that would be another thing. Perhaps the young mother has post-partum depression / is struggling to nurse / has mastitis / who knows what and a call asking for even a small favour is just too much now. Or perhaps they are just difficult. We don't know. But I agree that they're unlikely to have made a devious plan to let the Nan see the baby and then turn on her. Something's gone wrong with the communication.

I know ES had blocked us Allsorts because there was a recorded message which said 'the number you are calling is no longer accepting calls from this number'. That was a landline though but it might be the same on mobiles.

Oh Whiff you poor thing, shingles is very painful; get well soon x

That's a good saying Nmama and I agree that having boundaries can be a good thing as long as they're clearly given but talking one day and refusing to talk the next IMO isn't the right way to go about it which is what's happening with Ladysu.

That awful Whiff, do hope it’s a mild case. Just keep warm and rest up💐

Rest up Whiff and take care.

Smileless, How would anyone know after one call they were blocked it either rings out or goes to voice mail? That is what I understand, does a message tell you that you’re blocked now.? Ladysui it is apparent that there are no solutions between your son and yourself, he has said he doesn't want to talk about it and your dil has said you’re too demanding. You’re at stalemate. You just have to busy yourself with your move etc. I think taking the baby to see you was a nice thing to do and they just didn’t want to talk about your move.

Best wishes, Whiff. Take good care of yourself!

Just as an exercise in asking "What would you have done?"--I have a church friend who ended up at my house for four days during a blizzard. I am disabled, and my husband was recovering from surgery. She brought nothing with her but an extra pair of knickers. During her stay she did not so much as carry her dirty dishes from the dining table to the kitchen, and she lost control of her bladder twice and said nothing about it. (My husband cleaned it up because I was asleep.) Afterwards she was evicted from her apartment and she popped in or called repeatedly to ask me to find her a new place to rent because she didn't understand the internet. Once when we didn't answer the phone immediately she drove over and leaned on the doorbell till we answered the door. She wasn't to know that I once had a stalker who made obscene calls to me for years back when I was single and when the police were of no help to me--I still just about curl up like a hedgehog when my phone rings at the best of times. My husband persuaded her to call him instead and does not answer his phone when she rings--he listens to her messages and we decide what, if anything, we can do. She has announced that he is her "brother" so we are "family" to her. Even if she was family, even if she was my mother, I would put up the same boundaries, would not answer the phone, would listen to messages instead, and would not necessarily do everything she asks us to do. The American poet Robert Frost wrote that "Good fences make good neighbors" and I think he's right--sometimes the other person doesn't understand how disruptive his or her requests are, so sometimes we need boundaries for our own health or peace of mind.

Probably be AWOL for a few days I have shingles . GP given me the anti virals. Take care everyone. 😘

Thankfully we were spared all the mind games Otter. We were estranged within a year of our first GC being born and when I read about what some parents are subjected too, I can see we spared a lot of grief.

I think the poster said it best that they should make a decision and stick to it (the son and DIL) Its all the back and forth that is so hurtful, glimmers of hope then pulling the rug from beneath the feet of lady time and time again. But I guess the decision making is a two way street, only the person in the situation ( LADY ) knows how much they can handle of walking on eggshells and what they are willing to put up with for potential peace and coexistence of the family.

Above post to Singco.

If you read her posts, you’d see that LadySu has already decided to do her own thing and let her son/DIL get on with it.

Most on here had already suggested that she do that.

No one's attempting to fuel her resentment of her DIL or convince her that her son and DIL hate her SingcoTime. That's a ridiculous suggestion and if it were ever the case here, this thread would not have been here for than 11 years.

As I posted earlier, we don't come here to create arguments with one another. It is possible to give the advice you think appropriate without seeking to denigrate what others have provided, and there's certainly no need attempt to put 'words into the mouths' of those you happen to disagree with.