Tantrums

nanej, i did this with one of my 3 prone to tantrums and refusals. Going to school without a coat when the temperature was freezing, she didn't do it twice. I think it is a case of picking your battles also. If they want to do something that isn't a danger to themselves, let them do it. They will soon learn that being in their PJs in the supermarket isn't that cool!
My grand son nearly 3 had a few weeks of demands and tantrums behavior, and my son, his uncle, who has no experience of young children found the perfect way to handle it: showing sympathy and agreeing.
I don't want to put my shoes on says GS
No, I know, it's a right pain says son, I don't like it either
and by the time he finished talking, the shoes were on!
Don't know if it would work for everyone, but I saw this approach of my son working when none of us could do anything with GS and were at our wits end !

I think my GDs' school would have a bit of an issue with the pyjamas thing, tantrum or not. They're very hot on school uniform!

Different children seem to arrive with different personalities. My youngest has just grown out of tantrums and she is nearly 14. Biggest problem with the public ones is the overwhelming urge to thrash the living daylights out of them for embarrassing you in front of people.

My grandsons are identical twins, but only one of them has done the pyjamas to nursery school thing, which seems the most practical response to refusal to change out of superman pyjamas before leaving the house. But if they want to wear pjs all day, then why not? Or maybe buy more comfortable day clothes?

A lot of the time the tantrums seem to happen when you don't have time or inclination to do what they want, usually because you have to get on with what you want to do, and you're in a hurry, so you don't handle things so well.

The choices thing within boundaries works well (in a job I had before the last one I used it on clients .

Mishap I don't think the adult in the video (or the dog for that matter) was actually coming and going. It looked to me as if they were going from the living room into the kitchen and back, so presuming that was the childs home, that sort of coming and going would be quite normal?

Under non tantrum circumstances that would happen quite a bit, e.g. child playing in living room, mother goes into the kitchen to make a coffee etc?

That's spot on nanapug.
It's also the approach that's central to the Montessori teaching method, so I suppose I instinctively carried it into parenting, having been a Montessori teacher in one of my many previous roles: To give children choices within clearly defined boundaries. They feel in control, so it avoids frustration.

Video makes the point very well - that tantrums are fueled by attention.

But still I cannot help feeling uncomfortable about the making of the vid - it seems disturbing to almost mock the child like that - it was a bit confusing for him/her as the adult came and went. Can't say I would want anyone doing that to a child of mine. Perhaps I am over-squeamish.

My DD operates very much like nanpug's - wish I had been as wise.

Wonderful. I wonder if the mumsnet people have seen it?

Have a look at this, classic example of the attention getting tantrum and what happens when it's ignored!

www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gk-OfmmRaqs

Have passed on your daughter's method Nanapug. Excellent!

I am sure my 7 year old GD has tantrums at home but she has never had one at my house, possibly because I have more time to listen to her. I can honestly say I have never seen the 3 year old have one, she is a very placid child.
They do have time wasting tactics, at bedtime, which drives me nuts.

Feeling thwarted was usually the trigger for a tantrum in my experience. I remember my younger GD having a stupendous one at the age of 5. There was nothing anyone could do about it as she simply could not have what she wanted but no explanation or reasoning would placate her. DS just picked her up and took her back to the caravan where we were spending a cold half term, must be five years ago this week! Even now she can go off on one, but not for long! Is an explosion better than a prolonged sulk?

Don't know if it is any help but my DD has a great way of preventing tantrums. She believes it is a power thing, that they want to be in charge; so what she does is instead of saying "please take your PJs off" (or put them on), she will say "Do you want to take your PJ top or your trousers off first?" i.e. she always gives them a choice but within her boundaries. It takes a bit of thinking about at first but it truly works. At bed time she says "Would you like to have your story before you clean your teeth or after" for another example. They are still cleaning their teeth but they feel in control. Good luck xx

I wanted to have a tantrum in Walsall M and S where they have the food section crammed into a tiny area, cramped checkouts, and the last bloody straw are scouts offering to pack your bag. Instead I filled in the "tell us what you think" questionnaire which takes about 15 minutes and asks you bloody daft questions like "were you inspired by the window display" For flip sake. I have never been inspired by a window display so how likely am I to start with the one in Walsall M and S? (which i did not notice at all)
So I wanted to have another tantrum then, about bloody stupid questionnaires!

(why, you may ask, did i go there, again...? because MIL lives on M and S ready meals that's why)

I remember a shop assistant in BHS helped me stop my daughter's tantrums. DD was throwing a spectacular heeling kicking flat on the floor screaming tantrum over goodness knows what. The assistant told me to leave her and move out of sight around the counter while she kept an eye on her. No risk of DD being kidnapped! When DD ran out of breath and realised she was, she thought, alone the tantrum switched off, I walked back, picked her up and carried on as if nothing had happened.

Good-enough mums and supermums all have children who have tantrums! It's boundary-testing, uncontrolled emotions and an attempt to exercise the little power they have. In fact, it's the job of a toddler/under-five year old to test out what they can achieve by using charm, resistance and kick-offs, before they learn to reason and negotiate. Some children are overwhelmed by the strength of these feelings, whilst others learn that they can suppress or control them.

I would SOOOO love to be able to have a tantrum in Tesco's. just lie on the floor and scream until the manager comes running to put me at the front of the checkout queue!

Tantrums happen whatever - not always avoidable. It is not just because they are not listened too - it is because they are testing the boundaries.

Children need to be free to show a bit of spirit - we do not want to breed automatons.

I remember my youngest screaming blue murder one holiday as she did not want to join the walk we were going on - it was a one-off unmissable experience, so her protestations (which she could not be reasoned out of) had to be simply ignored. She kept it up for a very long time; but she realised that it would not achieve the desired result as we just kept on going. Notle. our finest hour I must say.

We have all been there - sometimes we realise it is our fault, and we wish we had done things differently; and other times it is unavoidable. So no guilt trips chapettes - we can only do our best.

Well good on you NannaAnna - must be nice to be the perfect mother with the perfect children, and now perfect grand-mother with perfect grand-children - hurrah

Ahahaha

I can honestly say that my children very rarely had tantrums. My belief is that tantrums are the result of children not being listened to, or not being understood, or not having their needs met.
For instance, why would a small child be happy stuck in a shopping trolley going round a huge supermarket?
When mine were very little, I did a big weekly shop of an evening, while their dad put them to bed. Far more civilised for everyone! When they were each a little older, and I felt they could interact with the shopping experience I would write a few items of shopping on a separate list, and it was their responsibility to chose them. (Obviously items within their reach and safe to get. Something like 4 apples also added practice with counting.)
Mine also knew that when I said 'No' I meant 'No', and they would get a rational (brief) explanation as to why. It would, if at all possible, be qualified with a promise to meet their request at a later, more appropriate, time.
On the odd occasion that a tantrum was thrown I usually found it very amusing, and laughter soon took the wind out of the tantrum-throwers sails

Yes I understand what you mean JessM, I sometimes wonder if that doesn't help, my grandson has started one morning and two full days since DD went back to work after mat leave after having another DGS and behaviour has got worse. Hmm could be new baby, mummy back to work and nursery, so many buttons to press as they say. DD can occasionally throw a tantrum and she is 31 ha ha, wonder if the naughty step would work?

I meant that most children do the tantrum thing during their 3rd year and after 3rd birthday they should be turning the corner. If a 3.5 year old is still having them, odds are they have been going on for a while.
Most children in this area start school part time at 3.

Hello, well I have to disagree, I don't think that 3.5yrs is too old for a tantrum. I have seen many children of this age performing such an act and I think it is just a stage that many children go through. It is when they are starting to realise they are separate from their mums and it is when ground rules are or should be set. My grandchildren have tried it out and my two daughters deal with it in different ways. I think and I don't know if anyone agrees, that a lot of kids seem to rule the roost now? Parents give too many options and let them make a lot of decisions, such as, "what shall we have for tea?" With my children I said we are having this for tea and that was that. I am a great believer in either ignoring or changing the subject. Does anybody think that there is a lack of discipline nowadays as well? And I do not mean smacking. My one DD uses the naughty step from Supernanny for tantrums and other DD ignores or leaves the shop if need be and totally ignores.
Just thought, what are actually defining a "tantrum"to be, never quite sure what the difference is between that and just being downright naughty? Oops, rambling on again, sorry GNers.

The first day of the summer holidays my DGD then just over 4 decided in the small shopping in the next village, to throw the biggest tantrum I have ever seen..
she rolled all over the path outside the green grocers while I stood and looked to see what I wanted, it went on for 10 minutes she was deafening, it was not something she had done before, passerby's looked on in horror.
Then one the teaching assistant's from school walked up to me and we had a conversation while ignoring DGD, as she went on her way she said she hoped I had a good holiday with a wink.
I felt like handing in the towel with DD, the thought of putting up with 6 weeks of tantrums filled me with dread, funnily enough it never happen again

I remember carrying my daughter round Tesco, dangling from her harness like a bag of shopping while she SCREAMED. Now she's nearly 40 she's not quite so bad once she's had a coffee My mother used to say that you should be ready to hug a child having a tantrum because they get frightened by the strength of their fury. Not sure if it worked on me?

I think it really hard when children have a full blown outburst. Me being a younger gran feel so sorry for the parent the stares odd whispers from the older generation is I say loudly enough for all to hear I say you can't switch them off . Then I carry on trying to snap my grandchild out of it. There is a no win situation with children I agree with them I hate shopping as well but we still have to do it.