Desperate for Advice

Don't say or do anything you might regret and keep the lines of communication open! (See the threads about GPS cut out of their children's lives, and take them as a warning)
However, if you have said not unreasonably that you have a prior commitment but would love to babysit another time (even "offer" e,g, next week) I think you cannot be wrong footed. She may be out to cause trouble, but it takes two to quarrel. As for "keeping the children away" again, you may just have to live with that and pretend it is not deliberate. It may well not be! These young people all have busy lives, see their friends, have other commitments, she may just be being thoughtless.
If her baby is only a few days old, the poor girl is probably totally frazzled and sleep starved, she may have PND too.
Given the circumstances, I would counsel patience, offers of help/ shopping/ laundry/food/having the 3 year old for a bit , as acts of a generous spirit.

That sounds awful, Allison.

There is no reason or possible excuse for nastiness or abuse, and of course you don't have to tolerate that.

Presumably the mum wanted you to care for the toddler to give her a chance to rest and care for the new baby? Was she waiting for you to offer to do this, and was disappointed when you didn't?

Perhaps you can build bridges by writing a note (maybe with a new baby card and present if you have not given this yet) and saying you'd be delighted to help out with the toddler and give some possible dates when you can arrange it? And yes, as Alea suggests, offer to help with laundry or shopping, and maybe take a supper dish round for them to share?

Has there been history of unpleasantness? Why do neither of them work?

I sympathise Allison. I think it is simply that you have to make a choice, do it her way or never see your GC. Sorry, I know that sounds hard but it sounds just like someone I know about whom we all say "xxxxxx's way or no way". Intransigent is far too mild for this person.

Best of luck.

That's tough Alison. No easy answer. Agree with other thoughts that if you can it's best not to rock the boat. Or not too much. Last minute demands are unreasonable. Think I would offer what worked for me and see how that settled. You could give a choice so there is some sense of control for you all. Do hope it settles and you can see your grandchildren with less tension.

Don't, don't, don't rock the boat. Sometimes it's necessary to bite one's tongue until it bleeds. It's not fair I know, that grandparents have to do this... . It annoys me like you can't imagine..... but once, in 45 years, I critised my daughter and her idiot boyfriend (now her husband, God help her) and that was it. Ka-boom! End of relationship. And with DILs/SIL its like walking through a minefield on egg shells.I'm very much afraid if you want to se anything of your grandchildren you're going to have to tread so very carefully. All you can do is offer help, and wait for it to be accepted. It will be sod's law that they will want you to babysit when you've something else on, so you'll have to decide what you're going to do. Its a real problem, but hang on in there.....all being well It will get better as long as you keep your thoughts and emotions on a tight rein.

I'm a bit puzzled Allison. Presumably your DiL sought your help on a day when you weren't working.
I remember what it was like having a four-day old baby and a three year old.
Emotionally fraught just about sums it up.
When my DiL and DD had babies, I would have done anything, and did, to help them out.

Perhaps your DiL had had no sleep for hours.
Perhaps she was struggling to feed her new little one.
Perhaps she's very sore down below.
Perhaps your son isn't doing his bit.
Perhaps the 3 year old's nose is out of joint, as 3 year olds' noses tend to be, when they've been supplanted by a new baby, and perhaps he's playing up big-time.
Perhaps she feels she can't cope.

Perhaps you saying you were going out for the day when she needed you felt like the final straw. It probably would for me.

All good advice. If you are happy to risk not seeing the GC again, then express your views; if you are not then button the lip.

Both approaches are viable and reasonable (in the face of the unreasonable!) and only you and your OH can know which you prefer to choose. I am sorry you are having to make this choice - what a pain.

Feel for you as I have very similar with one of my DiL's. Always called at short notice, made to feel very second rate. Her own mother died suddenly in May this year. I have been there for her at a drop of a hat. But still am treated like you but the best thing to do is stay calm, say little, do not argue, but if you are unable to babysit, say so. She might not like it but she will need you more than you need her. Just work on your relationship with your grandchildren, have fun with them and never let them know how you feel about their mum or dad. It's hard but it does work. Good luck but hang in there. X

Thanks everyone, I have read all comments, some I agree with some I tend not to but then I know the full story and you lovely people dont.

For two days I have helped out by having my grandson, ran my son to the hospital, collected shopping etc. I feel that I had really done my bit and had made plans to go out before I was asked to babysit. The plans couldnt be changed and literally not 1 minuted later she exploded, she has said some disgusting things to me in the 6 years I have known her so I am used to it (should I be used to it?) but this was even worse than normal. She has made it clear in no uncertain terms am I to go to their house and I am never seeing my grandchildren again. This sadly has been the same story for the past 3 years. I am a patient good person but boy I am seething inside now. 90% of me has taken the decision to cut all ties, I simply cannot live a life like this and I fear for my grandchildren in that all this contact one minute and then none the next is doing them absolutely no good. She simply is someone who I will never get along with and goodness knows I have tried but this constant hitting me with a stick for the problems in their lives is no good. I really feel so angry inside, usually its upset and tears but this time I really feel enough is enough.

One of the questions was why dont they work, good point and I simply do not know the answer to that question. They rely heavily on me and great grandparents financially and if this isnt forcoming then they stop contact with the children for that reason too.

Her mother cant do a thing wrong but never ever has the children and I feel now that whatever we do isnt ever going to be enough. I feel that they are now taking the pee out of our decent natures and literally are out for what they can get.

Thanks everyone, just getting it off my chest is helping more than you will all ever know.

The best and most frequently given advice, difficult as it must be to do at times, is to bite your tongue if you want any kind of relationship with your grandchildren. Smile apologetically if you really cannot get out of a prior engagement, but always offer to help out another day (as soon as possible). Ask your DiL what she needs you to do - shopping, laundry, taking the toddler off her hands at the weekend to give her a break and so on.
Those early days and weeks with a new baby are so difficult, so exhausting and she may so desperately have needed your help that she just snapped when you weren't able to. I'm not trying to excuse any bad behaviour, just explain it .
I do feel for you Allison, we GPs all have to tread such a careful path with our DC and their partners. Please don't do anything rash, something you may live to regret for the rest of your life. Give them time (and your patience and understanding!), and things may improve slowly.

All this is a common problem now-a-days. When most of us Grans were younger we took our parents criticisms on the chin but things have changed. Many young mothers feel very powerful and don't hesitate in saying what they think.

I've just emerged from a long battle with one of my daughters-in-law and during that time I've cried in private, gritted my teeth, posted on Grans net, kept calm and carried on. It's been especially hard because I lost my DH and have to cope alone.

As other Grans have said, don't rock the boat, contact with your grandchildren is vital for us and for them. I now have what you might call a "working relationship" with my daughter-in-law. She no longer feels threatened by me, heaven knows why she was in the first place, and we get along quite well and she is beginning to see me as a person and not the dreaded Mil.

Do you have any other GC?

Have you been racking your brains for what you did wrong? It is so easy to blame yourself and think you could have done something better but maybe it isn't you, maybe you just have a nasty DiL and a weak DS?

If you get on well with another DiL or more than one then don't beat yourself up, it is probably all her.

Just read Falconbird's message, good advise, she has been through same as me. I too am widowed, but at the end of the day your grandchildren are the important ones. I have a saying "what you hand out wil come back to you 10 times but not at MY HAND". This covers good and bad, so walk away when things get tough, don't get involved, but continue to be YOU. You seem to have bent over backwards but still get the backlash, try to not take it too personally, shout at your walls, get it off your chest the let it go. It does work, have been there and still have to deal with it but I have learnt not to get upset and I do feel things are getting better. It will take time ??

Awful situation Allison.Only you know if you can put up with this for evermore.It depends on your age, health and all round vigour.
if you don't know why your son and dil don't work,( laziness)? Then you should not support them financially.
although I would think you want a good relationship with grandchildren,it sounds like a rocky road to me.

The advice you have all given is just wonderful but after 6 years (that is the length of time she has been in my son's life) I feel that there really is no alternative but to have nothing to do with her. I literally could write a book about her disgusting behaviour but I have always soldiered on as I do try and be a good patient person.

I have returned from work (at this time they were both living with us) and found them literally scrapping on the front lawn, neighbours had called the Police. I have returned from holiday to find my home in a heck of a state. The Police have been called on many occasions for them rowing when we are at work, oh it goes on and on.

I really cannot see a relationship of any kind with her and it really saddens me to say I dislike her very very much. She is not like this with me but also neighbours and frequently falls out with her own mother.

For now I think distance is the answer or I really think that 6 years of biting my tongue will tumble out. That will do no good.

I shall keep you all posted on developments and I thank you all so much.

Well - here's my two-pennyworth....if the situation at home is as insecure and volatile as you describe, then I think these grandchildren need you to be in their lives.

Goodness me! I have had to forget what I heard screamed at me by both my daughters in those terrible days after the birth.
In my day we were in hospital for a week getting a night's sleep after having a baby. Now the new mothers are up and about and tired out.
Try to keep calm and zip up your lips until a future date. Things will get better. Have you thought of taking a home made soup or a pasta dish at the weekend?

Do you know MargaretX I think you may have hit on a good idea, even if I leave it on the doorstep and run for the hills! I know they love my cooking and I know leaving this small token may just be the ice breaker. Yes that is what I am going to do. Something so small may just do the trick to paving the way. Thank you and thank you all.

It sounds as if you really don't want to break contact, Allison42. If that's so, you need to try to distance yourself, mentally, from any future nastiness.
Don't take the insults to heart, but view them as just something that happened, that is not your responsibility. Easier said than done, of course.
Your DGC need you and your DH in their lives so I hope you can hang on in there.

If the police have been called and children are involved the Social Services will have been informed. Are they involved now? Are the children on the Child Protection Register?

I agree with those who say the GC need you so hang in there if necessary at a distance but don't break off communication altogether. I suspect they will need you before too long.