My Son/DIL are verbally abusing 12 year old grandson

If the child isn't being sweet all the time (and no child is!) that is absolutely no excuse for screaming at him and belittling him all the time.
Probably the growing drink problem has much to do with the problems.

Constantly belittling a child is emotional abuse. If he disclosed the sorts of things he is telling you to a teacher at school it would be referred on to the safeguarding team at the school and action would be taken.

All school staff are trained in safeguarding and I really think it is a shame that parents don’t have to undertake the same training.

Have you considered that when you don't see him, he isn't being the sweetie you seem to think he is?

I know as kids we acted like sweethearts around our grandparents and they never believed we could be horrid to our parents but we all went through our stages.

Make sure you know the whole truth before you start chucking allegations around.

Nannabilly, so deeply sorry for what you went through!

Polyester, you sound a note of hope! And yes, a lot of parents have huge conflicts with the kids in their teens and even before. Please realize, though, that these parents aren't just "yelling" at YeyYey's gs, they are "belittling" him. That is not ok, imo. Maybe he will "come through it" reasonably all right, but there is bound to be some damage to his sense of confidence. I just hope YeyYey can balance that with lots of love and praise.

Sorry, my post was addressed to OP YeyYey not nannabilly

YeyYey I don't know if you've heard of the scapegoated child. If you google it there are a lot of articles about it. Most seem to say that the child will come through it. Here's one parenting.exposed/the-family-scapegoat-set-up/
It is an awful situation and I hope you are able to help him through it. Stay strong and loving for him. He is lucky to have you.

nanabilly aplogoies for not having read through all the responses, but do you live near your GS's school? if so, could you suggest he come to live with you for a while, put it to your son as giving them a break, he might be more likely to go for that?

I would also speak to your DGSs school pastorial care and explain your concerns,maybe they can call in the parents and they would then be aware that your DGS has someone watching over him.
Does your DGD go to school yet ? and is she looked after properly when you or her brother are not around.

Like everyone else here I find this heartbreaking. But possibly not so uncommon. I see many parents around me who go absolutely overboard with young children, take them to all sorts of afterschool activities, fuss about their diet and their clothes, change schools and then, when the children reach their teenage and want to start breaking away on their own, they cannot cope with their new independence. Some relatives confided in me some years ago that they really did not like their son! I don´t live in the UK so don´t know about social services, around here, they certainly wouldn´t follow up on a child that was fed and clothed and the only problem was that the parents shouted occasionally. My suggestion would be that you get him to spend time with you, during holidays if you live too far away, his parents may be grateful to have a break and it may help to bring things into perspective. I send you my sincerest wishes that this situation may resolve itself and no-one gets hurt. Btw. the relatives who did not like their son somehow carried on and he is now a fine young man with a family of his own and very close to his parents, who are immensely proud of him.

What a heart breaking situation for you? I don’t feel qualified to offer advice here but wanted to let you know I was thinking about you and the DGC

nanabilly you could be telling my story so I am sending you a big hug.

yeyyey I am so sorry this is going on. I witnessed something very similar in a neighbours child over several months. One weekend it was so bad I telephoned NSPCC - something happened I dont know what and things improved from there on.

If you chat to the school, I believe they will have a duty to report the concerns to social services and it’s my belief that they will not have the choice to withhold details, such as the source of the reported concerns. I would not be sure that your identity would or could be kept confidential. Might it be an idea to phone social services yourself, without disclosing your identity, as someone who has witnessed concerning behaviour? I think that the situation needs to be addressed but you need to do all you can to maintain your relationship with the children. You are an important source of support for them.

Heartbreaking! Problem is verbal/emotional abuse is hard to prove. I agree with those who say to discuss it with a trusted member of the boy's school, someone you can count on to keep your name out of it. If they think the situation warrants it, they will notify CPS and it won't be you who did it.

Still, if your son and dil suspect you were involved in any way, you may find yourself co (cut out) for a while. So you may want to think about whether it's more important for gs (and gd) to have you and dh in their lives or to possibly get help for their family, even if you get co. Tough call, I know.

If you do decide to take action, please stick to your "don't... say a word" policy where son and dil are concerned. If you never say anything against their parenting, they're less likely to suspect you of having done anything.

You must do something that's for sure!
I am one of 5 children who were all regularly verbally and physically abused often left with severe bruising but it was the mental scars that did us most damage. The bruises heal the mind not so easily. We used to hope and pray that someone would help us but it never happened and it was bad until one by one we left home to get married. The mental abuse still carried on with venom from our mother til we cut her off in one way or another one by one. Most of us anyway .
I was never really free until the day I sat and watched her pass away in her 70s and I breathed a huge sigh of relief and then wept for what I had missed out on and I've never missed her once since . Do you want this to happen to your dear gs ..I don't think you do so that's why I say you must do something and do it asap as at 12 years old your gs may all ready be damaged but it might be repairable or treatable.
I can't say where to go to get help but anywhere is a start.

I also think the school would be the place to turn to.
Something needs to be done.
What an awful situation!

You are feeling stressed and trapped because you care so much.
Honestly, I'd have a word with the relevant teacher in school. The SENCO teacher deals with special needs and disabilities. I'm sure there has to be a teacher for vulnerable children.

P.S. I understand that schools now have a Pastoral Care Teacher who is trained. Deal with children with certain needs, but also with children who may be coping with trauma. Perhaps if that teacher (following a wee chat from yourself with him/her of course keeping it confidential) was to take note, have a chat with your dgc, he/she could speak with the parents. No obvious input from yourself, keeping you out of the equation.

Thanks for the concern for me....I'm pretty strong, but I am so worried about this boy. The most ironic part of this is that he is the sweetest-natured, kind child I have ever been around. I almost think that makes his parents bully him even more....especially my son because he wanted a "tough boy" and got a more sensitive kind. I work in social services and if I were to see any of our clients treating a child this way, I would report them to child protective services. But if I were to to do this and they found out - I would never see that child again if they could help it, and, my grandson would no longer have me as a support system. See why I am so stressed and feel so trapped by the situation?

How heartbreaking for you and what an awful burden for your dgs. And probably your young dgd as she gets older.
Are you in the USA, their services may be different to the UK. ( I ask only because of the different US spelling in your post.)

I'd start with one of the child protection services and take it from there. It's so good that your dgs is coming to you and that he trusts you.

Do the children have any good times with their parents, is the shouting and bullying going on all of the time.
You mention your son's drinking, does your dil drink also?

I do understand that you do not wish to antagonise your ds and dil, the last thing needed is that the dgc are kept away from you. This age is a difficult one anyway, confusing for your dgs and can get difficult for all parents. It doesn't sound like his parents will be best able to deal with the normal teenage growing up. Poor boy and also his sister.

I can recall my own at just a bit older when he tried to put forward a little attitude. It took all my willpower sometimes to stay calm.

You're in a very difficult place YeyYey, apologies for stating the obvious. You identify your sons growing dependence on alcohol and its impact on his behaviour and relationship with his children.
He will be in year 7 or possibly 8 at the age of 12. It's easier for children to get lost in High School, though he will have a year head who is responsible for his overall welfare. I've found Heads of Year responsive to grandparents. They will of course maintain confidentiality but they are likely to listen to a loving grandparent who isn't attempting to overstate concerns or cause family rifts but who wants to alert the school to the pressure the child is living with.
Is your daughter in law drinking with your son?
How are things for their 4 year old. Fighting in front of children, as I'm sure you know, is damaging in many ways. They sound miserable and that will affect their children.

Is there anyone at school your grandson could talk to? Some schools have counsellors (though that's another area that's been slashed due to cuts). Does he like his form tutor, is there a group he's involved with where he likes the member of staff responsible. It's great that he can talk to you, maybe you could explore gently other areas of support. I don't want to up the ante but it may also help your grandson to know he can always come to you if he's fearful or miserable. There is a fine line here in making sure he feels safe and encouraging him to run to you.

That poor boy
He has you and your husband though and he knows he can come to you. I don't know what to suggest. Is he allowed sleepovers? Could he say to his parents he wants to stay with you for a few days?

This sounds awful YeyYey. I have no real advice, just want to send you. I don't know if this would be deemed bad enough behaviour for social services to be involved - maybe someone else on GN would know this
Perhaps you could phone NSPCC for advice. You sound like very caring grandparents, and if you read the thread entitled Mothers, you'll see just how important loving grandparents are to children of toxic parents. Just one thought, could your grandson come to live with you?