Extremely challenging two year old.

I would, without criticism to anyone, approach the parents and just say that bedtime has become a struggle and is there any sort of routine you can all follow or put in place to help him transition between homes.

All children are different, I have 5, one of which is autistic, and 2 were terrible at bed time.

I never believed in leaving children to cry it out as that leads to unmet needs so I would comfort until calm and put back to bed. The lead up to bedtime was always very quiet and calm.

It's distressing but children get over tired or over stimulated. 2 tear olds have no emotional control and not enough words to communicate the issue so that leads to outbursts.

I really think that the best way to help this little boy to settle is for all his carers to work together to find a solution.

I’d also like to add that this didn’t come as a complete surprise to us as my son has Asperger Syndrome. He wasnt diagnosed until he was 15 years old and had the most horrendous time for 11 years at school being bullied by both children and teachers as AS wasn’t really recognised 40 years ago, so please don’t anyone say we shouldn’t be putting labels on children as they can be very useful…..

I’d like to throw in another idea as the poster shimeld states in a second post that his wife have previously had experience of childminding 3 other grandchildren so they must both be fully aware of ‘normal’ toddler tantrums.
Our lovely 4 year old granddaughter took terrible 2 year old toddler tantrums to a whole new level which is difficult to imagine if you haven’t experienced this first hand . It was exhausting for everyone concerned, especially me when I looked after her. She was at day nursery three days a week and it wasn’t long before the nursery raised concerns over her behaviour although they had lots of coping mechanisms in place as obviously they’ve seen this sort of thing before. They strongly suspect that she is ADHD/autistic spectrum, and said she would need support in school to help her cope with this. She is bright, articulate, funny with a fantastic sense of humour but continues to have tantrums but not as often.
She has just started school and her parents are now going down the difficult route of getting a diagnosis which is not easy with high functioning children.
Perhaps this is something shimeld may want to consider as a possibility and that it has nothing to do with the iPad, TV or sweets?

In my experience 2 year olds are very articulate and perfectly able to express their needs.

It worries me when I read people saying it is normal for children to have tantrums. Not in my world it isn’t. When my children were that age we did see the odd tantrum with other children in the supermarket but my friends and neighbours children didn’t behave like that. What has happened in the last half century to make this “the norm”?

A 2yo can't put into words its feelings- tantrums are often their only way of communicating. This often seems so upsetting to grandparents- try not to take it so personally.

We look after our two year old grandson a couple of days a week. It's absolutely wonderful to be able to do this, but can be challenging at times. Someone on Mumsnet described them as the devils minions!!!! We had a laugh at that one. I think it's important to be as relaxed as possible, within some boundaries. Obviously keeping them safe is paramount here. We always take him out to the countryside when its fine so he can interact with other people, feed the ducks and generally run around. At home we have a mix of the usual activities on offer and allow him to lead with what he wants - for example stickers, crayons, reading books together, bricks, sandpit outside, etc. etc. We still feed him in his high chair. I think you need to focus on what you're doing rather than that the other Granny is doing - unkind and uncalled for I think.

Apart from checking with your daughter that yours and her routine with the child are as near as possible alike, there isn't much you can do.

Two year olds do have tantrums and tantrums should be ignored as much as possible. No child bothers with a tantrum if it is clearly not getting him what he wants.

What the other grandmother allows is her and your daughter's business, and your SIL's method of parenting is only his wife's concern, not yours.

Your grandson will soon be old enough to realise that rules and routines vary according to whose house he is in.

What do you actually do, when the boy has a tantrum?

As I said ignoring the tantrum is best - you can't reason with a two year old in a hizzy fit, nor has the child the words to tell you what he is reacting to.

Ground rules that everyone who is caring for him stick to so the poor child at some consistent boundaries

Sounds like the 'terrible twos' to me. I do think the parents should set guidelines to be followed by both sets of grandparents though....

I am now having a peaceful few minutes whilst looking after my two year old DGS.. we have just come through and hour of hysterical crying and screaming on his part. He is now happy and smiling and walking around the kitchen dragging a toy and talking to the dog. It all started because he wanted to play in the garden and it is tipping down so hence the terrible two year old arrived. Now he is like a little cherub. I have just turned 70 and love the happy smiling DGS and am glad when mum and dad come to take him home. I have him 2 days a week for 8 hours a time and am just glad I can help. Try not to diss the other GP as they are doing what they can to help. I must be a bad grannie as I have a supply of bears to eat when it gets too much plus Bing can be a life saver if I need the loo or a cuppa. It soon passes, I looked after his sister when she was little and now she has started school I miss her.

This might be completely off topic but are you checking what the little chap eats? Certain foodstuffs and additives can cause reactions in small children. Not bragging but my children never had tantrums and were fed a wholefood vegetarian diet. Maybe that might give a clue?

If I was the OP, I wonder why I had bothered posting his question.
He asks for advice, quite reasonably perplexed as to how to deal with this problem and brings down a storm of criticism by some frankly unpleasant posters.
Whatever “modern thinking” is, generally children do thrive with kindly routine/rules and interaction.
IMO, he is not being critical of the other grandparents, merely describing what goes on there. Surely no one considers stuffing a child with sweets is a good thing.
A conversation needs to take place between all concerned, and possibly a cofounder nursery place for this little boy found.
Meanwhile, well done for patiently trying to find a solutionn.

That's why they call it the "terrible twos" I thought !
Either his parents are unaware of what happens while he is being looked after by the other grandparents or they are quite happy with the situation. Either way, but sorry, it's none of your business, even though I can fully understand that you want the best for your GC.
As others have suggested, you could offer to pay towards nursery fees - but you have to make sure it will mean that neither sets of grandparents have caring responsibility - if you just pay so that the other grandparents no longer have him at all, it could cause such ructions in the family, it really wouldn't be worth it.

I would offer to pay towards child care fees. It must be very difficult to look after a two year if you are working from home.

(I only have them on an occasional or emergency basis - as I don't want too look after them regularly.)

Oh dear, it is the terrible two’s, tantrums for no apparent reason. Stick to your structure while he is with you, he will slowly realise that you have boundaries and will adjust.

shimeld it's very common for two year olds to throw tantrums, especially when tired. OK - you may well find it 'extremely challenging' but it's an everyday thing for some.

I don't think it's helpful to blame it on a lack of routine or how he's cared for elsewhere. Instead, it's best to understand the warning signs, try distraction - and, once the tantrum's in full flow, recognise that he's unable to respond to reason by that point, so needs comfort and calm.

I do think your daughter needs to organise plenty of childcare options - instead of relying on you. My daughter uses a nursery, grandparents - and two friends with toddlers, all interchangeable at short notice in case of sickness etc.

Try not having so many ‘rules’ maybe? Don’t sweat the small stuff. And, my main mantra in childcare, don’t argue with a two year old. It’s a waste of time and energy. Make sure they’re safe and then walk away and do something else. Until they’ve calmed down. Then lots of cuddles and distraction. If you seriously can’t cope though you must tell the parents. It’s their responsibility not yours.

For the last 7 years, since DGD was almost newborn, she's slept over at ours, the other grandparents, Daddy's as well as living with mum. There's been very little pattern to this. Genuinely, I've always felt that wherever she is, she's adapted to that environment. For example I've never heard her say that grannie lets me... or at Daddy's I'm allowed...
However the adult never had work pressures on them (retired, part-time or their own boss who could choose their work hours). You 2 are wonderful to look after him at short notice and work.

We provide childcare for our youngest 2 grandsons while their parents work. I wfh but my husband is retired. I would describe it as having been a mixture of great pleasure and sometimes pain lol. I believe in getting the children outdoors whenever possible so they can see different things, play with sand or water in the garden and use their energy. I love books and so encourage them to 'read'.
I think its tempting to look back to when your own children were young and think that they weren't like that (feeling they were better behaved) but I think we should remember that memory isn't always totally reliable and that we ourselves have got older and sometimes less tolerant nowadays. There are things that are allowed at nanny's house (messy play is one example) that don't happen at home and vice versa. Children are remarkably adaptable and resilient. The child is only 2 and is learning the world so to speak and I feel that it is a joy and a privilege to be part of that.

You sound very critical of the other grandparents, no doubt they have their hands full with their own severely disabled son , so maybe letting the 2 year old play with iPad and watch tv keeps him happy ? Why all the worry about ‘ rules ‘ , we all have different ways with children, that’s life . Also I don’t think it’s fair that you all have to do your bit in child care while the daughter can go to work and escape the tantrums of the 2 year old . Why is it in this day and age it that parents seem to feel they have the ‘ right ‘ to return to work while the poor older grandparents have to do all the running around looking after young grandchildren when they should be enjoying their well earned retirement in pursuing their own pleasures in life .

May I ask how you know what happens in the other grandparents' home that’s a very good question * hithere*

Your opening title Very challenging 2 year old and then your description sound very different This little chap sounds a VERY very normal 2 year old

Consistency is key on a childcare arrangement. This child is bounced around too much with no common rules at all.

The terrible twos and threes are adding to this as well.

It is up to the parents of the child to pick the child carers.
That being said, this arrangement is clearly not beneficial at all.

May I ask how you know what happens in the other grandparents' home?
As a paretn, that would be a deal breaker for me. They have too much on their plate too add childcare on top of it.

Bluebelle: My youngest was a breath holder as well. She actually passed out during the middle of a tantrum one time. Luckily as soon as she hit the floor, her brain kicked in and she started breathing again. I was torn between being horrified and being thankful she stopped her screaming for a second.

Some kids are just more difficult than others. My oldest was a very easy child, so I was not prepared for the second.

OP; does he know baby signs? I just throw that out there because some children at age 2 have trouble communicating and I have seen when they learn baby signs it helps. Not sure if lack of communication skills is part of the problem, but you could certainly try to learn a few things with him to see if it helps.