Too many "expert" theories

fwiw Choxaway, whenever one of my family members went against "expert" advice, the healthvisitor or other health worker were understanding and ok about it.

Grammaretto

I loved this film about the first year in the lives of 4 babies from around the world. The only background where baby books can be seen is the American one.
no doubt if there was a British baby it would be the same

babies (film) trailer g.co/kgs/QkJsCS

That looks so lovely Grammaretto; thanks for posting the link!

I loved this film about the first year in the lives of 4 babies from around the world. The only background where baby books can be seen is the American one.
no doubt if there was a British baby it would be the same

babies (film) trailer g.co/kgs/QkJsCS

There has always been and will always be conflicting "expert" opinions. Remember when we were all told that margarine was healthier than butter? Then the advice did a 180 and now butter is preferred. It's also hard to believe that cigarette manufacturers actually used to claim that smoking was good for your lungs, according to expert advice... Just check out some of the old "Craven A" adverts. Bottom line... yes, we need our experts to promote continued progress and improvement, but I'm also aware that they don't always get it right, so will continue to keep an open mind, and not be afraid to also let my instinct guide me on occasion.

I assumed the tongue tie was diagnosed and cut by a qualified person - it does seem to occur in some babies but not the only reason why there may be difficulty breastfeeding.

Some parents, particularly older ones, are very anxious and rely totally on advice from books, Internet etc. I feel the anxiety may be transmitted to baby who then becomes more difficult. Not sure what the answer is, but when my scientist daughter was expecting her first baby I came across a website - The science of Mom. Website is no longer accessible as author published a book. www.press.jhu.edu/books/title/12424/science-mom

Basically the author scientifically researched all the theories about baby rearing and came to some conclusions. Particularly issues about sleep, weaning etc.

Coming from a scientific background myself, I found it useful, as did my daughter, I think. Not all books etc are useless - I found a few good ones when I had the first of my 5! I was an only child and we had few relatives to ask advice from, so books helped!

I have seen a lot of influencers pushing products at parents, and proclaiming themselves experts. Velcro-fastening swaddles, moulded plates with compartments for baby-led weaving, little socks with oxygen monitors built in - that sort of thing. To market these products (none of which were available until recently) they produce charts with 'routines' for the babies to follow. Age birth to 6 weeks - X minutes of 'tummy time' Y times a day, Z number of naps x A minutes long, B nappy changes a day etc. This 'transitions' to different figures when the baby is 6 weeks to 3 months and so on. For a fee, the mother can subscribe to videos with hints and tips on ensuring that the baby 'achieves' these milestones. Oh, and to get the opportunity to buy the next level products (eg swaddles with sleeves, or spoons with hollow handles).

IMO there is a huge difference between this and advice from midwives, HVs or other professionals. I wonder if Covid and the lockdowns, which stopped pregnant mums going to ante-natal classes and toddler groups has made them more dependent on this sort of thing? I know what the OP means about didactic - expecting babies to all develop in the same way at the same time (to that level - obviously there have always been developmental stages) seems to me to be inviting anxiety, and the cynic in me isn't surprised to find that the influencers have a product to cure every 'problem' they describe.

I queried whether or not the cutting the tongue tie cutting was a joke Callistemon but others were taking it seriously and so I then assumed it must be serious. I could hardly believe what I’d read. And obviously I realise that it needs to be done by a properly qualified person Fleurpepper which is why I queried it. It seems a strange thing to put into the post if it’s either a joke or if it was cut at home by anyone. To my mind it should be diagnosed and treated by a properly qualified medic.

All my babies slept on their tummies - my own six plus the twenty or thirty different babies I fostered. That was what we were told to do back in the sixties/seventies. Indeed, I can even remember one enterprising pram company that produced a pram with see through panels in the front corners for babies on their tummies. One of my friends insisted on putting her babies on their sides, despite health visitor after health visitor telling her not to do so.

One foster child came to me when he was just under a year old, having spent those eleven months in a nursery where I was told he had been so very difficult to feed. He was then on solids and we had no problems except he was a little messier than the norm. He was four when I watched him struggling to lick an ice cream that it dawned on me that he was tongue tied. This was then dealt with, under a whiff of anaesthetic. by a surgeon at the local Paediatric ward, involving an over-night stay for him and me.

Breast IS best - BUT it must be what Mum wants. Too often they receive bad, incorrect advice, like telling them to let baby suck longer to get enough milk. Most of the nourishment babes get from breast milk comes very early on, then some babies like to use the breast like a dummy - but this can lead to sore nipples. To build up breast supply, little and often is the answer. Feed for five minutes every two or three hours for a couple of days AND Mum needs something to eat (like sandwich and a drink) about twenty minutes prior to feeding. If baby and she are not happy then turn over to formula.

Must say I managed to feed my twins even when I got a attack bad bout of mastitus in one breast. It was horrible and extremely painful, like someone sticking a red hot needle into that breast if baby tried to feed, but I did manage to express from that breast and, fortunately the other breast was fine. Was put on a course of anti biotics which then resulted in myself getting thrush and both the twins getting oral thrush. I persevered, as I really did want to b.feed them both as long as possible as I had three other very young children and did not feel up to making so many bottles each day. Got through that (about a fortnight), and then totally b.fed both babies until they were nearly a year old.

Obviously, I bottle fed my foster babies, some of whom came to me direct from hospital, as newborns as pre-adoption. They all thrived.

I can remember saying that with my first (b 1969) I was glad he was not a twin as I had him in one arm and the other hand needed to be free for that Dr Spock book!!!!!

Fleurpepper

maddyone

must be tongue tie, out come the scissors, screaming baby, no difference

Well the way I read it, it certainly sounds as if the parents read about tongue tie and did the cutting, that’s why I queried it upthread. Maybe the midwife did it, I don’t know, but certainly the scissors should be sterilised. I know I wouldn’t have been happy if my midwife had whipped out the scissors and wanted to cut anything in my baby’s mouth, I would have wanted a doctor and a sterile environment.

It'snot just about scissors being sterile, it is about knowing exactly how to cut it and how far.

That part of the OP must be a joke.

Hithere

Oh dear indeed!

There always have been experts and theories how to raise babies, it is not new

And yes, some parents do use common sense, even now

The issue may too many people given input to the new parents, not the new parents having access to those theories

Yes, and no. Nowdays most parents to be are encouraged to buy so many books, magazines, follow sites on internet, etc, etc. Some give good, sound advice, others not. And often contradicting. Very confusing and makes parents more stressed than anything.

maddyone

^must be tongue tie, out come the scissors, screaming baby, no difference ^

Well the way I read it, it certainly sounds as if the parents read about tongue tie and did the cutting, that’s why I queried it upthread. Maybe the midwife did it, I don’t know, but certainly the scissors should be sterilised. I know I wouldn’t have been happy if my midwife had whipped out the scissors and wanted to cut anything in my baby’s mouth, I would have wanted a doctor and a sterile environment.

It'snot just about scissors being sterile, it is about knowing exactly how to cut it and how far.

A new mother probably needs guidance, but after your first child, books probably won’t be necessary.
I did a lot with my first that I didn’t bother with for the others.
But going back to Anne Diamond, her little boy died shortly before I had my last child, and the advice was to slightly raise the baby end of the cot, and to put a rolled up towel behind baby to stop her rolling onto her back. We did both.
Breastfeeding was a nightmare for me, tried twice, failed twice, last one straight on the bottle, so much happier, me and baby.
I think the older you are when your first child is born, the more you worry, younger women just seem to get on with it.

It's the contradictions that are upsetting for new mums I think. We used to use good old Dr. Spock as a guide but apparently that is not politically correct at all now. Two of my grandchildren are recent new parents- one lets her 3 young kids under 3 eat and do what they like- she didn't want to breastfeed and so she didnt. They are 3 happy,healthy kids. The other one is a nurse, breastfeeds and does everything by the book. Food well balanced etc. They are 2 happy,healthy kids. Love is what they need and they all have that in spades.

I would never condemn anyone who follows expert advice.
In our culture we are often alone with a tiny infant and we have no previous experience.

Why do you feel unable to offer advice
Choxaway? Keeping your mouth shut doesn't sound helpful to me.

I didn't breast feed either of my two .My daughter was born on the same day of the month at the same time as her sister who had died 4 days later .I was spooked and worried and ure she would die too.My milk didn't come in ,thankfully my consultant was on board and it wasn't considered a problem .IF I wanted to try once I was in a better head space that was fine ,meantime I tried expressing ( I hate the new term pumping) .
Baby was happy on a bottle so we stuck with it .
The second surviving baby was over 11 weeks early and in special care for 11 week until he was almost 5 pounds ,the nurse put pennies in his nappy s he could get home for his Dads birthday.
He was an awful feeder we had to cut a huge hole in the bottle teat and more or less pour it down his throat No sucking reflex at all.Weaning was just as bad ,he refused food and I spent most days cooking things he MIGHT eat .At a year he was 12 and a bit pounds .
Some folkdid try to guilt trip me but it was no ones business but ours and they were ignored .My health visitor was the mother of 6 and had brilliant experience and was a great help.I never bought or read any baby books .Both my children were very healthy and had only chicken pox during childhood .My son ,baby 2 is 35 and still under 9 stone .
I think the best thing the OP can do is let her daughter /SIL get on with rasing THEIR child their way .I would never have interfered with mine its not a granny's place .

must be tongue tie, out come the scissors, screaming baby, no difference

Well the way I read it, it certainly sounds as if the parents read about tongue tie and did the cutting, that’s why I queried it upthread. Maybe the midwife did it, I don’t know, but certainly the scissors should be sterilised. I know I wouldn’t have been happy if my midwife had whipped out the scissors and wanted to cut anything in my baby’s mouth, I would have wanted a doctor and a sterile environment.

My GS who is now nearly 6 had tongue tie which was diagnosed after he was born. My DD was told that unless it was resolved she would have great difficulty breast feeding. She was sent to another hospital where they had a midwife who was qualified to cut it and all was well.

Foxygloves

Fleurpepper

But is should not be done by parents surely!

Of course not! Nobody suggested that.
I'd never heard of tongue tie when mine were born but who is to say how many (subsequently bottle fed) babies might have been able to breastfeed if it had been better known about in those days.
There always were self appointed experts even then, only they were called Mum or MIL or Auntie Mavis down the road. I have no argument with young mothers and fathers reading up and being better informed than we were. I have a sneaking suspicion that objections to the "experts" are only raised when their advice runs contrary to what we or our mothers did.

Well, this was rather disconcerting, Foxygloves! 😲

must be tongue tie, out come the scissors, screaming baby, no difference

Fleurpepper

But is should not be done by parents surely!

Of course not! Nobody suggested that.
I'd never heard of tongue tie when mine were born but who is to say how many (subsequently bottle fed) babies might have been able to breastfeed if it had been better known about in those days.
There always were self appointed experts even then, only they were called Mum or MIL or Auntie Mavis down the road. I have no argument with young mothers and fathers reading up and being better informed than we were. I have a sneaking suspicion that objections to the "experts" are only raised when their advice runs contrary to what we or our mothers did.

Yes annsixty
No two are the same and instinct is best followed. And Blondiescot , FED is best.
If you can breast feed, great.
If you are stressed about breast feeding for whatever reason, it will more than likely affect your milk production and make matters worse.

My DD came a few thousand miles to give birth to our first GS so she was staying with us.
After 24 hours in hospital she was discharged with a healthy baby who seemed to be screaming 24 hours a day.
She had terrible mastitis and was in such distress as we all were.
Our family GP visited and told my SIL to go up to the pharmacy, buy formula and bottles and peace was restored.
Second baby 3 years later took to the breast straight away, fed for 8 months.
No two are the same and instinct is best followed .

Hetty58

Choxaway:

'Do other grannies find it's all very didactic these days?'

Er - no, 'it' is just the same as ever, but now we have research based evidence for current trends. Most new parents will feel 'lost at sea' to begin with, will be shocked by how much a new baby can cry, will feel that they're somehow failing at parenthood, will be sleep deprived, exhausted and tearful at times.

What new mothers need hasn't changed, though. They need support, understanding, help with shopping, cooking, housework, plenty of rest and a calm atmosphere. They don't need any disagreement, interference and misguided 'advice' from the older generation - that's for sure!

Exactly - and I would also just echo imaround when it comes to feeding - FED is best. There may be any number of reasons why a mum either stops or chooses not to breastfeed. I breastfed both of my children, even after I went back to work when they were three months old, but in my DiL's case, it was far better for her mental health to stop breastfeeding so she could resume taking her medication. At the end of the day, the only thing which matters is that baby is thriving.

Oh dear indeed!

There always have been experts and theories how to raise babies, it is not new

And yes, some parents do use common sense, even now

The issue may too many people given input to the new parents, not the new parents having access to those theories

Cold

There have been expert views since the beginning of time - not a new phenomenon - when MIL died we found a copy of Dr Spock's book that she bought in the early 1950s to get expert advice

Advice changes as a result of more research and knowledge. For example it is over 30 years since Anne Diamond campaigned for research into cot death after the death of her baby and that research found that babies who slept on their backs were less likely to die than those that slept on their tummy. In the late 1980s over 2000 babies a year died from cot death - by 2015 it had dropped to around 200 following the expert advice

Whether to stop breastfeeding or not can be a very sensitive and difficult thing for new mums and something each one has to make a decision on for themselves

Very true, but I did read that the experts at the time were saying that babies should sleep on their tummies then changed their tune after all the many sad cot deaths.
Seemed obvious to me that my baby should sleep on her back.
Choxaway tell your DD to follow her own sensible feelings and chuck away the baby books.

Fleurpepper

But is should not be done by parents surely!

No, the health visitor probably referred them