Immunity to colds etc.

Thank you for reading the book anno I think the answer is that nobody knows yet. Auto-immune diseases are vile and the scientific answers are very complicated. Scientists are beavering away, trying to unravel incredibly complex molecular processes so as to understand them and why the go wrong.
I guess the simple answer is that the ability of the immune system, the part that learns to differentiate between "self and non-self" and "friend and foe", can get it wrong now and again, identify a kind of cell in your body as an enemy and start attacking it. For the moment the only treatment is to use steroids etc to damp down the immune response.

My GP told me there is good evidence that a combined vitamin C and Zinc supplement supports the immune system. Last year, I had a series of colds, sinus infections, viruses that left me me no energy - this year, I've been fine..

Oh Anno- what a tough question and hope this condition is in check.

I got a bad cold when in UK last, in Jan- and have still got it. Yesterday I gave in and went to the doc's and now on antibiotics (which I hate taking)- so hopefully my sinuses and chest will begin to clear. Not had such a bad cold for yonks- but it has left me feeling very low, exhausted and yuk...

Managed to get some energy together last week to welcome DD1, sil and grandchildren for a week- and loved it- but the energy levels are now at minus lots! Onwards and forwards... Perhaps all the stress of recent months, with DD2 coming back from Spain in difficult circumstances, and other very sad events- all coming up to the surface at once- in the form of that yuk cold.

Thought of an analogy for auto-immune disease anno. Picture the London underground system. It all runs smoothly if all the signals are working. However if just one signal in central area during the rush hour shows red instead of green there are huge knock on effects. Trains stuck in tunnels. Passengers accumulating in stations and spilling out onto pavements. etc etc Just one tiny error in the immune system's yes/no decision making can cause similar chaos throughout the joints, or in other diseases, other systems (skin, nervous system, intestines etc) The immune system is a million times more complicated than the tube system.

Good analogy, jess.

My immune system has mucked up somewhere too. I think it is just a bit excessive and doesn't know when to calm down!

Hi JessM

I am sorry but I don't understand this at all

You obviously have a youthful immune system (or at least that aspect of your immune system) overthehill, which is not a good thing. Please don't start getting febrile convulsions (the ones toddlers get because they are running excessively high temperatures)

Could you perhaps re-do in another way. I thought my immune system was shot rather than youthful, but then you say it is not a good thing?? I don't understand why I would get febrile convulsion, nor do I know that they are??

Are you drinking neat cider vinegar??

No, I take a dessertspoonful in a glass of warm water.

Thank you in advance.

Sorry.

Start again. Small children produce a lot of immune chemicals that cause their streaming noses and high temperatures. These sometimes cause convulsions - nothing wrong with their brains other than the brain is just too hot. These are very rare in adults.
But the temperature also helps to kill the bugs and protect the child.
Adults, as they get older, usually have less reactive immune systems. Fewer immune chemicals released so they have less snotty noses and don't often get a temperature with a common cold. Apparently we "pick up a cold" every few weeks and mostly, at our age, don't get a full blown one. Sniffle or nothing. But some adults seem to have a more reactive immune system and get stinkers. So in fact a very bad cold is not a sign of a weak immune system!
Zinc while you have a cold may help to make it less bad.
Chest infections in old age are a sign of a weakening immune system though.

Hope this is clear now.

Yes JessM I understand now.

Thank you.

I've had very frequent, very severe colds all of my adult life. From October through to spring I go straight from cold to cold, many of them so bad that normal life stops for a month, then the next begins.
I had to give up work when my grandson started nursery and I caught every infection he brought home.
I currently have a cold, mouth ulcers and a cough which has kept me awake every night for a week. Most winters I get a virus which leaves me exhausted for up to a month but hurrah, I DON'T get flu!
I eats loads of oranges in the belief that they ward off colds!

So, jess, the fact that I fight colds off better (have fewer actual 'cold' symptoms) than MrB doesn't mean my immune system is working harder at all?

And the fact that I had a natural immunity to rubella and TB and that i wasn't really very ill at all with measles, mumps and chicken pox (5 spots) doesn't mean i have a good immune system either?

I don't get it.

Well it is not really a case of good or bad is it bags. Its hugely complicated and not a "thing". Because it is doing a balancing act all the time an overreactive one can cause lots of problems - allergies, auto-immune diseases etc. But they are overreacting in very specific ways. And when it comes to bacteria, viruses etc they have each evolved their way of invading us and causing symptoms that help to pass them on to other humans (sneezing, diarrhoea, an uncontrollable urge to kiss nana when you have a snotty nose etc). And we have evolved a whole suite of ways of fighting back.
So one person could be really good at fighting off viruses but be rather vulnerable to fungal infections. Someone else gets chest infections but never had a filling.
The bit of the immune system in my mouth is pretty useless - lots of dental decay when i was young and gum disease later on. But if I scratch my skin it always heals pretty well without infection.

JessM

Have you heard the theory about germs entering our bodies via the ear? This sounds quite fanciful to me but some doctor somewhere believes it to be true.

Thanks, jess. Do you think the snottiness in children has evolved because they are so good at passing on cold viruses, etc? Natural selection would seem to favour the most successful 'hosts'.

What I'm wondering is if children's immune systems are not so much more reactive and simply more invaded because children are better for the invaders' survival.

Could be - I have often thought that bags. Diarrhoea is a brilliant way for Noro virus and the like to share the love around too isn't it.
overthehill it does sound a bit far fetched. If you travel up the outer ear canal you reach the tough ear drum (it really is like a drum, with no gaps unless it is damaged) So it would be a very specialised bacterium or virus that could get through. The linings of nose, mouth and eyes are a much easier target - nice and damp. Not beyond the possibilities that a kind of bug has evolved to get through the ear drum but as a general rule it sounds like more of a magical pre-scientific idea. (the bad spirits get into your ear and make you ill - )

I personally have to blame this thread for the worst cold I have had for nearly 2 years . Can we have a thread about lottery winnings instead please?

Aw soutra you poor dab. ( strange expression - dab being a small flatfish - but it is meant kindly )

Aahh Soutra- I commiserate. 6 weeks now, but anitbiotics are kicking in and sinuses and chestz slowly clearing. Never ever had one like that (:

Yes, lottery win would be good- although to think of it, not really, as I never buy a ticket. Take care and get better soon.

Jessm, is hay fever is an over-reaction of the immune system to an outside stimulus? If so, should it lessen as a person gets older?

On the subject of auto immune problems, my husband suffered from rheumatoid arthritis for many years and we found that keeping a food diary helped us to identify some of the foods that triggered it. We found that, as with migraine, cheese triggered it within half an hour and lasted three days, but chocolate reacted the following day and lasted a week. other interesting things were that tomatoes, peppers (capsicum) and new potatoes did the same. these are all from the nightshade family and had just enough toxins to trigger the immune system and set the ball rolling. Old potatoes had no effect. It may be worth your while anno to keep a diary to find out if anything triggers your problems.

That's interesting, Experigran. I find certain foods trigger joint pains and headaches, unfortunately usually the ones I like best.
Interesting about the nightshade family foods, didn't know that.

A chinese meal out once triggered a dreadful headache that lasted for nearly 10 days.

Haven't got the energy to take discussion foods further although sis-IL who has IBS is a total convert and seems to have turned her condition around. What I want to ask is should one just live with the misery of a bad but only common cold i.e. stay in bed drink lots etc or struggle on doped up with Lemsip / Boots Flu Relief or whatever? Given that there is never an ideal time to feel c**p and DH may mean well but is not in a place to mop the fevered brow or hold the fort, which course of action do you choose?

Echinacea works for me. I start taking it whenever a cold threatens and it either doesn't happen or is very mild. May be a placebo effect, but I don't care. It works!

I would take the rest and try to get better more quickly route, but it's not always possible. Lots of drinks, nourishing light food and vitamins plus vitamin d in the winter. Plus paracetamol, if you are achey. Apparently lemon, honey and cinnamon is supposed to be good so DD1 tells me and she has studied nutrition extensively. I don't like lemsip anyway. If someone has already said this in a post, please excuse repetition (it could even have been me). This is what I would do, but of course life is often too busy to do so.
I wouldn't necessarily stay in bed, just stay warm and rest. Of course, if you are up there is the danger other people may expect you to be getting on with things.
DH had food poisoning many years ago (prawns) and after a day or so of feeling absolutely terrible decided the best thing to do was 'work it out'. After 3 weeks he had to go to the GP because he still felt terrible. GP said he was by not resting he was just sending it round and round his system and told him to rest, so he did and got better fairly quickly

Typo in penultimate line but meaning is clear I think

I always smile when people say that humans are top of the food chain - I really think it is viruses. They beat us hands down. If we are so very special, how come a towering genius like Mozart is wiped out by a virus?

Our lives are one long battle and the world is predicated on survival of the fittest - and viruses are pretty fit!