Suicide? Selfish ?

Jings Talking about it on here is one of the best things you could have done. I am not surprised you found any talk on the subject upsetting.

jingl

That is so much sorrow for anyone to bear alone jingl but at 19 specially hard I think

ditto

Oh, jingl

Ok. I did n't really want to talk about this here, but still.

My mother took her own life when I was nineteen. There was only her and me at home, no father, no siblings. I was, of course, completely overwhelmed with grief. I loved her so much, and I know she loved me. I cried on and off for years. I never thought to blame her. It has only been in the last two or three years, in my seventies, that it has occurred to me that perhaps it was, in part, a selfish thing to have done. I would never have thought so at the time. Then, there was just the dreadful, incredible, finality of death.

That doesn't lessen the love of her, or the gratitude for the lovely childhood she, and my grandmother, gave me. She was the best mother anyone could have wished for.

I am sorry if my previous post seemed unkind, and upset any other posters.

So glad to hear you are feeling better sunseeker. I totally understand the utter despair- although maybe not totally in as much as, having had very dark and difficult moments myself, I've never suffered from true depression. But if a mother with vulnerable children feels they have no other way- surely they would ensure that the children would not find her.

Different of course for a very elderly parent with adult children (even though that must still be so awful).

I wasn't going to post on this thread as I too suffer with depression, I have at times thought about ending my life but am too much of a coward. I am now much better than I was but have complete sympathy for anyone who is so deep in the dark pit of despair that the only way out they can see is to kill themselves.

I think that too, Rowantree about the terrible loneliness these people must feel - desolation! I have a friend who lost two children to suicide. She says she thinks it took a great deal of courage, which is one way of coping with the sorrow, about which she never speaks.

My daughter tried to take her own life several times and was very nearly successful at least twice. We lived with her severe depression, struggling to understand it, but anyone who thinks that sufferers are 'selfish' are missing the point.
I too have suffered - still suffer - from depression, though thankfully haven't been as ill as DD2 was. I have considered taking my life on occasion but only fleetingly, and at the time I felt that I couldn't put my family through the resulting mess. However, if I was desperately ill, I wouldn't be able to think in those terms at all. DD2 has said since that she wanted relief from the terrible emotional pain and turmoil she was in. Others did judge her: even those purporting to be friends, and their attitude made me angry for DD2 and at their lack of empathy. I'd never judge anyone for taking their own lives, or attempting to do so. Sufferers need help, not censure.
Each time I hear that someone else has taken their own life, I feel terribly sad for the loneliness, desperation and emptiness they must have felt just prior to doing it. It's truly awful that anyone should have to suffer alone in that way.

No words, just - which seem so inadequate.

Soutra and Aka, again just can't find the words so.

For children to find their mother must be unbearable and leave terrible marks for ever.

Thank goodness we have moved on (only in 1961) from the days when it was a criminal offence, and if you did not succeed you could be prosecuted and sent to prison.

Had a long chat not long ago with a friend who said that she had felt suicidal earlier in the year for various reasons. She said she nearly did commit suicide, it was as if something black came over and was propelling her towards it, it did not feel like her own free will. She did not, thank goodness, and has come through the dark times.

* Soutra*

My mother took her own life. I found her. She suffered from schizophrenia and wrestled with this particular demon for many years. I am sure she took her own life when she was perfectly sane and 'of sound mind' when she took the decision as she couldn't bear to life with this awful illness.

Walk a mile in another mans moccasins before you judge him!

41 years ago I was trying to cross Victoria Street in London to buy a pair of bkack tights at the Army&Navy for our 3 week old baby son's funeral. I was this close to stepping in front of the bus approaching me.
I didn't as it happened, but I can still feel the sensation of the black abyss facing me. Consequently I have every sympathy possible for those facing the abyss on a daily basis. It is not for us to judge.

And much as we'd like to think we would never leave our loved ones, especially small children, we just cannot know what it's like to feel such terrible despair and possibly lack of self-worth.

sometimes it is not that a person wishes to die, it is that they cannot face living.

That is precisely it; I remember hearing someone say once that 'there is a world of difference between wanting to die and not wanting to live' even though the end result is the same.

for some, because they have young children who need them and love them and that they've brought into the world. Sorry.

When I was much younger and someone would ring in sick at work with
depression, I would think 'oh for goodness sake'. When my brother was struggling with it and ultimately took his own life, I still couldn't see what the problem was. It was incomprehensible to me that someone would not want to live. I am now older (and I hope wiser) and I have struggled badly myself I can fully see why people would want to 'get out' of the misery they are suffering. I would never do that to my family, as I am only too aware of the distress it causes. Some people suffer terrible events in their lives, which they don't always tell anyone about, which I believe to have been the case with my brother, together with our awful childhood. They then see life as horrible and traumatic, why would they want to go on.

Bags what you said is worth repeating, many times:

^People who think suicide is selfish do not understand depression.

I think people who think suicide is selfish are the selfish ones. They are thinking more about how a suicide affects them than how a depressed person got to the stage of wanting to kill themselves. Just think about it! Most of us have never been there. Most of us can hardly even imagine it.^

If someone is in such a place that they commit suicide they are far too distraught to be thinking of the consequences to other people. As I have already said - sometimes it is not that a person wishes to die, it is that they cannot face living.

Anyone who wants to understand depression should read a little book entitled Depression the Curse of the Strong by Doctor Tim Cantopher, then they will have a little understanding of what it is like. It is not something that the weak necessarily suffer from.

My DiL throws it at someone that they suffer from mental health issues and uses it as the ultimate insult and in order to show that they are not a good person.

merlot it is and uncomfortable. Many people are affected by suicide as this thread shows, some directly, some indirectly.

The biggest lesson about suicide for me was a friend's gay son who was a very lovely boy, but was someone who was just "not for this world" - too sensitive, too different, too unique.

Things came to a head for him when he had an affair with a married teacher when he was in high school (it all became public knowledge). At this time he used to calmly tell his mum that he intended to end his life. He was saved from 2 suicide attempts and would say "You can't watch me 24/7". Eventually he succeeded, he was 22. His family has had to come to terms with the fact that he did not want to live the life he had. They had to accept that that was the choice he made. In some ways, it helped.

Tough, I know. But it really made me think.

I think depression and bi-polar illnesses are still hugely misunderstood. There is an article on the front page of The Guardian today saying how poor the treatment for mental health illness is.

My brother has attempted to take his life on more than one occasion. to meet him you would not guess his turmoil and pain. When he is well he is a charming and friendly person, interested in all sorts of things, loves a joke etc etc but in his dark periods it is almost impossible to get him to speak.

If someone is dying from a terminal disease like MND or late stage cancer families often support a loved one who may choose to take a route to earlier death. What a severely depressed person may feel about choosing early death is possibly similar. I would not judge them so harshly.

Just to ad that my grandfather committed suicide when I was about 5; and also, as a social worker, a woman committed suicide immediately after I left her house - so I do know how it makes those left behind feel.

Interestingly, one of the DDs of the lady who I saw as a SW rang me afterwards - quite spontaneously - and said that I should not feel bad about about, as no-one in the family had any inkling that she might do such a thing and it was none of my fault. I was very grateful for her call and have always admired her generosity of spirit. It is an example that I have kept with me and I hope has guided my actions.