Benefits and Bypasses.

Going back to the subject of smoking which was in the OP, this is happening in the rest of the world now. If you do not want our government to be sued next, sign up.

https://secure.avaaz.org/en/uruguay_vs_big_tobacco_wa_ctrl/?bkHcnjb&v=56744

We couldn't afford a fullsize violin for DD1 when the time came to buy one, so she gave up which is what happens often I think.
Music lessons are well funded in Wales - in primary anyway as far as I know.

Often wished my daughters had rosequartz

Local authorities are making massive cuts in the amount of money allocated for music education because they feel they must prioritise "essential" services as far as is possible.

DS excluded himself from violin lessons. Probably wise.

Sorry, not making a post in jest, just remembering.

rosequartz , children from poor families are excluded from violin lessons etc because they exclude themselves , not so sure about the joys, remembering one on the Cello and one on the flute at the same time . I weep for these children in the underclass of this country because one can see they are preparing to be the next generation of the underclass of the UK .

I agree Eloethan

Many of these firms are totally irresponsible.

You also need to look at the people with the power.
This man is not going to agree to a tax on sugar, I do not think.

"Iain Ferguson is the lead non-executive board member for the department, and was appointed in January 2012.

He is Chairman of Wilton Park, an agency of the Foreign and Commonwealth Office. He also holds the following posts:

non-executive director for Balfour Beatty plc, Davis Service Group plc and Gregg’s plc
member of the PWC (UK llp) advisory board

Iain is also a member of the Foresight Global Food and Farming project, the Better Regulation Strategy Group and the Honorary Vice-President of the British Nutrition Foundation. He was CEO of Tate & Lyle plc from May 2003 until the end of 2009, and previously worked with Unilever for 26 years."

He is on the board of Defra.

X post
However, if we are talking about 'class' then I would say that obesity occurs across the class divide.

It is not just 'the poor on benefits' who may get depressed.
They do not have ownership of feelings of hopelessness and 'reaching for the biscuit packet' as you put it.
And why mention violin lessons if it had nothing to do with the argument. Poor children whose families are on benefits are not excluded from the joys (or otherwise) of violin lessons.
I was just trying to point out that it is all a lot more complex than coming down to 'class' ' poverty' and 'benefits'.

rosequartz , yes it was those who do isolate them as prone to obesity I was speaking to. Some just do not listen to this underclass and I mean listen

I don't think the message is getting across because the government doesn't have the resources to fund a multi-million pound marketing campaign to counteract that of the food industry. And this, and previous governments, have been too gutless to stand up to the food industry and insist that it behaves responsibly and shows some concern for people's health instead of just its own profits.

anniebach I tried to point out too that it is not just 'the poor on benefits' who are obese, but some posters seem intent on isolating them as a group prone to obesity. There must be far more 'people on benefits' who eat sensibly.
I know people who are on a reasonable income who are obese because they just eat and drink far too much of the 'good things in life'.

Thank you soontobe , it really distresses me to constantly see one section of our society criticised , in America these people are dismissed as trailer trash , we don't do that here, we just sniff and point out their laziness and condemn them

Rosequartz , Thatcher had much to do with it , she taught a generation to become dependant on benefits and children learn from their parents do they not . You just don't get it, that violin lessons are free has nothing to do with it, this country is and always has been obsessed by class .

It is more complex than lack of time and lack of education I should have said.

It is pushy big business and a giving in to pressure from a plethora of fast food outlets, in fact all kinds of reasons. If some posters state people eat junk food because they are on benefits and could be depressed, then that is not due to lack of time, if due to depression then it is a catch 22 situation because junk food will not help, although it may be comforting.
I expect many will remember the schools trying to introduce healthier lunches and the mothers who went to the chippie at lunchtime to push chips, battered sausages, deep fried junk food, through the railings because their children didn't want to eat that healthy muck! And the woman who was giving her little girls a big bar of Dairy milk each day because it was packed full of milk - and ' they need milk don't they'.

With all the education in school and all the government campaigns to eat 5 a day etc etc you wonder why the message is not getting across.

But they are also people who had home economics lessons at school where they learnt not just cookery but about nutrition too
I do fail to see what MT has to do with it, my friend was a home ec. teacher during the MT years and there were at least 3 at my DC's school - another person I know was unable to get a job as a home ec. teacher there because she had not had sufficient training in nutrition etc having been a 'domestic science teacher' before having her family).

I never had a cookery lesson in my life but we don't live on takeaways and junk food. However my diet and exercise regime are not exemplary.

It is more complex than lack of time.

Violin lessons are free in school, at least they are in Wales and they were in England when my DC were young.
I can hear one now.

That is one of the best posts I have read on gransnet Anniebach.

Dear God, how perfect some are . People give up , they have so little self esteem , they sink into a form of depression, if they are on benefits they are attacked daily, they are not the hard working British families the government keep on and on about, they are the lazy benefit cheats the Daily Mail and Sun attack , they don't live in Lilac Avenue or Cherry Tree Close, many are the child victims of the thatcher years , their children don't go to a free school , have violin lessons, the mothers don't belong to book reading groups, they are treated as the under class by the government , and certaintly by some here.

If I lived their lives I would reach for a bag of chips or packet of biscuits before a bloody pear .

These people cry, love, fear, dream, laugh, feel pain too, what they don't have is hope

Of course no one is "forced" into buying high fat, high sugar foods - if they were, they wouldn't want them. Any parent knows that. People are initially drawn in by the manipulative practices of the food industry which uses highly effective marketing/branding techniques to convince consumers of their products' desirability. In addition, they incorporate into their products ingredients that they are well aware have addictive qualities.

And, yes, it is easier to get a take away or buy a convenience meal rather than cook a nutritious meal from scratch. There are plenty of people working long hours in low paid jobs who are probably pretty knackered by the end of the day and yet they still have to do washing, ironning, cleaning, food preparation, while at the same time trying to give some time to their children and partners.

It's so easy to criticise other people's lifestyles and yet I wonder which amongst us can say that their own diet and exercise regime is absolutely examplary. Anyway, is it automatically the case that if people faithfully follow the recommendations re diet and exercise that they will be the picture of health, or is it sometimes just the luck of the draw?

I do believe that it is better if people understand the need for a good diet and regular exercise and try to follow the guidelines, but the santimonious tone of some of the posters on here makes me want to go and eat a doughnut.

There are many reasons for people being unable or unwilling to cook nutritious meals from scratch eg lack of time or even the knowledge to do it..

The article says nothing we haven't been hearing for years, and it doesn't attempt to address the problem of how to educate people about healthy eating. No one is 'forced' to buy high-fat, high-sugar foods, in most cases it's just easier than cooking nutritious meals from scratch.

Thanks soontobe. This is exactly what I was trying to say. A very good article!

www.theguardian.com/society/2014/aug/30/child-poverty-link-malnutrition-rickets

I do know a lot of people who don't I'm afraid. I'm thinking mainly of younger people but not all of course. And I would like to see more practical cookery lessons brought back into schools at both the junior and senior levels. I think this might help.

And I still disagree! You seem to be assuming that no one on a tight budget ever does any actual cooking, Greenfinch!

And my point is that if you are on a tight budget it is still cheaper to buy bread ,economy biscuits,crisps and cheap cake to fill your family up than it is to give them fruit and vegetables not to mention meat.
I think we will have to agree to disagree.