Is the government trying to break the GP service?

JessM my experience of "out of hours GP" is very different to your description , numerous phone calls, each promising a call back for my elderly DM with a chest infection, after several hours we did get a visit from a GP who left a Prescription which we could collect a few hours later. Sleepless night all round

I imagine a lot of telephone appointments go like this:

Hello Mrs Smith, what can I do for you
I've got a urinary infection again - can I have a prescription please
Yes, make sure you take all the pills
Thank you.

I do not believe that UK nurses are expected to go thirteen hours with no refreshment and no loo visits.

It might happen during a major disaster, though even then I doubt the lack of loo visits. How many people can go that long without peeing, and what about during menstruation. I don't think exaggeration helps anyone or any cause.

They certainly do thirteen hour shifts, thatbags. I once stayed in hospital with my son for nearly four weeks and couldn't believe how long some of the shifts were. Whether or not they had time to have a loo or snack break, I don't know.

They possibly do, JessM - same as face-to-face appointments.

thatbags, As a teacher I usually started at 7.30 and didn't go home until 6 in the evening. If there was a staff meeting or parents' evening, it could be 9. It really wasn't uncommon not to have a loo break during the schoolday. It's not healthy, but it's possible.

So you didn't urinate for over 12 hours, dahpnedill? Sorry, I can't actually believe that...

I know nurses can have twelve hour shifts and possibly thirteen. I was not questioning that. I think it highly unlikely, highly, that many people can go twelve or thirteen hours without a loo stop, and especially not women who are menstruating, who will need to change their blood soaker-uppers/collectors. Sorry to be so bluntly practical.

All the schools I've been familiar with, as a governor, parent, and teacher, had teacher refreshment times.

And if any nurse or teacher in the UK does have to work under the conditions you state, dd, why the hell is their union not doing something about it?

They are not slaves!

Remember Margaret Thatcher "The NHS is safe in our hands"? I didn't believe her and I see no reason to think differently now. The Tory government is out to destroy the NHS - why should it bother them when they can afford private health care?

Teachers may well have breaks on the timetable but that doesn't mean they get to take their breaks. Wet playtime means you have to stay and supervise the children, organising lessons, preparing classrooms, dealing with parent phone calls etc all cut into break times and often, before you know it, it's time for the children to be back in class and you haven't been to the loo, had a drink or even eaten lunch.

thatbags, They might have had official refreshment times, but teachers get caught up in detentions, meetings, seeing pupils, last minute marking, etc.

I left teaching with a 'compromise agreement'. In other words, the school wanted to sack me, bunged me a few quid and I couldn't wait to do a runner.

The reason they wanted to sack me was that I'm diabetic and they claimed they couldn't make necessary adjustments for me. Diabetes is covered by the Equality Act (the old Disablity Discrimination Act) and they had to consider adjustments. In my case, those adjustments were having a guaranteed snack and loo break every three hours. I wasn't getting them and it was affecting my health - I often felt dizzy and/or light-headed and couldn't work effectively. The school said that they couldn't be guaranteed. There seriously were many times when I didn't go to the loo or have a drink from the time I started until I went home. Quite a number of pupils don't go to the loo during the school day either. I guess we develop strong bladders.

Don't even talk to me about the menopause - it was a nightmare!

Indeed vq! I forgot phone calls, photocopying, last minute supervision, rearranging classroom furniture, finding sets of books, setting up videos, etc etc. Headteachers don't tell governors about that kind of thing, thatbags.

I agree joannenewton. Cameron said something about turning away ministers who came to him wanting to make cuts to front line services - I can't remember his exact words.

Just before Claire Rayner, the agony aunt, died she warned that she would “come back and haunt” David Cameron if he did not protect the NHS. Well, I hope she really is haunting him and Hunt!

And it's a good question why my union did so little to support me. Frankly, they were cr*p.

I'm sorry you had such a rotten time, dd. It shouldn't have been allowed. I must have only had to do with schools—in Edinburgh, Oxfordshire and Argyll, not to mention the schools where I was a pupil in Yorkshire and Lancashire—that didn't push their teachers so unreasonably.

Governors don't need telling this stuff. It's obvious when teachers are stressed and when they are getting reasonable breaks and time out from teaching to do other essential teaching-related tasks. Besides, when I was a governor I was often in school during the school day and saw teachers in the staff room at break times.

In the last school where I worked - middle-sized comprehensive, the staffroom was rarely used. The only people who used it regularly were TAs and admin staff.

I'm not claiming that I didn't ever have a break or eat lunch, but it could never be guaranteed, so I think my bladder made contingency plans not to be emptied. I never ever thought of the 15 minute morning break as a 'break' and never had a hot drink. I walked around with a bottle of water and took the occasional slurp. Even now, I don't empty my bladder as often as I should - I guess from years of conditioning.

When I complained about the lack of breaks, I was labelled as a trouble-maker. I can quite believe that the same situation exists in nursing. I know from my own observations that nursing staff worked two shifts back-to-back. My daughter shared a flat with a junior doctor, who did the same.

Fortunately there are staff toilets on most wards, unlike in departments in secondary schools.

I don't understand why some people think having private health insurance means we aren't "bothered" about the current GP crisis. You still have to make an appointment with the GP to get a referral, he/she has to listen to your problem, make a diagnosis, then write a letter to the consultant. Even during your treatment letters fly back and forth between GP and consultant, so all in all the GP is as vital to someone with private health insurance as to someone without.

Except that those with private health insurance often get preferential treatment, queue jumping, in other words.
Has anyone actually said that on this thread, anyway?
We're more concerned about those who don't have private medical insurance and can't get to see a doctor.
One third want to retire in the next five years, before the new ones promised by Hunt finish their training. Where do we get the replacemnets from?

Yes, Jen, someone made a political comment on this page about members of the Tory party not being bothered what happens to the NHS because they have private medical insurance.
You can't jump the queue to get the initial appointment with a GP. If I phone up tomorrow I have to wait just as long as the next person to get a consultation.

Not quite, Lillie.
The Tory government was mentioned.
"The Tory government is out to destroy the NHS - why should it bother them when they can afford private health care?"

Not quite the same. I bet ministers can jump the queue.
In fact, wasn't it Hunt wqho took his children to A&E instead of waiting for an appointment with his GP or phoning 111?
Just what he's complaining about everyone else doing.

Yes. On a recent tour of the Houses of Parliament we were told MPs had direct, (and no doubt very speedy), access to St. Thomas' Hospital opposite.