Grandaughters bedtime

I agree with others that more investigation is needed - talking to a teacher, and perhaps more. Does she ever stay over with anybody? Watch how she plays with her dolls (if she does) or encourage story telling - you start a story, then pass it over, then she passes it back to you etc and see if there is a recurrent theme. Car journeys and walks could be a good time to do this. No mention is made as to if she has a tablet/ phone/tv to play on and/ or in her room. There are a lot if unsuitable tv programmes before the watershed - all the soaps including Hollyoaks, have violence and scary family situations.
One of my sons always maintained that he did not need a lot of sleep and this was probably true as he gets under 6 hours now, but as a single parent, I told my children that I needed grown up time to myself. We never watched anything other than childrens tv or nature or other very innocent programmes when they were small, (I saw lots of Lassie films on Sunday afternoons and always cried!) we often listened to music (light classical and some popular songs but listen to the words first), we had a games night once a week with no tv. They had plenty of exercise and we always went for a walk and or to a playground at the weekends. Of course it is easier with two, as they played together. Every night when they were small at bedtime I was a ‘horse’ and took them upstairs on my back! A bedtime story and lights out. They knew that if they were scared I would go and sit with them but they were never allowed to stay up except on Saturdays as a treat which was also the only night we ate dinner (pizza) in front of the tv. Sitting at a table is good for conversations.
However, being an only child can be lonely and harder for the parent too - if at all possible I would recommend a dog, or if not practical, a cat, and allow it to sleep in her bedroom.

Luckygirl I've just read out your reply to DH and we both had a wry smile as 30 odd years ago we had exactly the same problem and employed exactly the same solution, with the same result! Many years later I asked DD if she could remember what the problem had been and, without a moment's hesitation she replied 'witches' - of which she had not mentioned one word at the time! As another poster commented, imagination is really kicking in at that age.

7.30-8.30 seems late to me. My 6yo gd is in bed ready for sleep by 7pm. After a full school day and after school clubs it may be that your gd is over tired and unable to control her emotions. She can't say how she feels so 'kicks off' instead.

I'm with other grans suggesting a clear bed time, a wind down routine with quiet activities for at least half an hour before bed (no devices or TV), maybe a milk drink, a night light in her bedroom and permission to read in bed but lights must be out by a specified time.
Screaming, kicking and name calling is attention seeking behaviour and it needs to very clear to her that this is not OK behaviour and loss of privileges will result. If she gets up she needs to be quietly and promptly returned to her bedroom- no extra time sitting watching telly on the couch with Mum or other special attention. Just be very calm and matter of fact about enforcing this.
There may well be abandonment anxieties after the separation of her parents and she may need lots of cuddles and conversations about those fears. Rewarding unwanted behaviour will ensure that it continues. Although we all do have different sleep needs I find it unlikely that a busy active 6 year old is not tired and ready for bed by 8 ish.

Nannakathy. You say it is only recent this behaviour has started.?Have you thought of talking to GD's school teacher.? If your granddaughter has recently started to have this issue it could be connected with what is going on in her life when she is away from her mother and yourself. Kids get bullied, intimidated by other kids but afraid to tell their mums. In the mean time don't force her to bed.Sit with her read to her or let her read herself The more you react the more GD will react.I am sure it is a phase but only you can find out why she is like this so
school first.

Haven't time to read all posts but one of my granddaughters has recently been diagnosed with - as having? - ADHD. It does seem to make things easier, knowing she is not responsible or neither are her parents for her behaviour.

Like the attention seeking suggestions and overtired.
Where is she getting the graphic language from? Is she listening to adults shouting at each other or unsuitable television, school?
My eldest was frightened of being the last one in the house awake and shouted out often to check we were not asleep. He got in such a state sometimes he made himself sick. It will probably pass. He is 34 now with three kids of his own. Don't rush to medicate kids have all sorts of funny problems and phases.

I agree that physical exertion is a good idea. Also she is at an age where to feel secure she is testing the boundaries so they have to be strong and firm. Hard. So act as if you have no doubts at all about her bedtime and there are no alternatives and you are not stressed about it. Nothing to be scared about. (Award yourself and daughter an Oscar) she is scared of her strength and wants you to be stronger. So be brave and good luck it’s tough but worth it.

Error not dgs dgs.

Has your dgs done any physical activity to make her feel tired. I care for dgs who does not seem to sleep a lot. We went to sleep expert and told must do lots of physical activity. I now take him swimming 4 times each week, tramolining and he does a park run of 2k on a Sunday morning, I take him to play cricket and rugby and on days with no activity send him into garden to bounce on trampoline. He now sleeps much better. Also be very strict, bedtime is bedtime, whether he sleeps or not he must be in room at 8.30pm on School night and 9 weekend and then light goes off 30 mins later during which time he can read.

The thing that bothers me about this is the fact that she displays aggressive behaviour, both physical and verbal. To me this isn't 'overtired-ness' but some emotional problem. Could it be a case of her being bullied at school? Or as someone else has mooted, is there a new boyfriend on the scene? I'm not suggesting anything sinister about the latter, but children can get very stressed/angry (not unreasonably) about a new person in the family unit.

With a full day at school and after school activities she may be overstimulated and not able to wind down. Routine is a good idea, so warm bath, milk drink etc and then into bed at chosen time and if she doesn't want to sleep look at books, nothing electronic, or listen to stories on CD which often helps them to nod off. Has she had any night terrors, typical age for it as the imagination is really kicking in.

I suffered this with one of my girls and now she has it with one of hers. It is not unusual or needing medication.

Children like attention and even when we are telling them off, they prefer that to no attention.........ignoring this is the best way forward.

Make sure they have books and a night light etc and leave them to it.

The more you engage the more they do it. We have had some success with late night strolls , when dad takes the dog around the block in the evening, GD goes along, she enjoys this one to one time and get some energy release.

Sorry just wanted to add- we hadn’t noticed the signs of asd until it was mentioned to us and we read up on it- girls are so good at hiding it, and there were so many things we just thought of as ‘her’ or her quirks, that actually fitted the boxes.

My DD is 10- for the past year we have had the same problems, she has recently been put on melatonin and our lives have changed so much, we finally feel like we have our lives and our daughter back. She is currently on the pathway for an ASD diagnosis (high functioning aspergers). Have a look at some typical symptoms in girls online and see if you feel she matches them. Our last year has truly been awful for us all as a family. Nothing worked on our daughter- no amount of threats or punishments, reward charts, ignoring her, etc nothing. I got so wound up as people would tell me we needed to be ‘strict’ but I am certainly not a soft parent, we had always had a great routine and nothing worked at all. She couldn’t explain her behaviour and still can’t. Try magnesium baths, lavender massages, lavender scents in her room, banana before bed etc. We tried everything but nothing worked for us unfortunately until she began on medication. It was so frustrating that telling people how she was at night sounded fake- nobody could truly see it until they were there. She would actually stay awake the whole night. In the day she is a lovely girl and hates to go against rules. If you or your daughter need to talk I’m happy to DM, I know how hard it is dealing with a non sleeper.

I think deciding on a bed-time routine and sticking to it is always helpful. My children all went to bed at a set time and were then allowed to read for a while. The one who was anxious used to listen to audiobooks instead and I would pop in and switch the machine off when he was asleep. My children often used to take themselves off to bed when they were tired and were all early risers.

I think an awful lot of children’s behaviour issues are a way of attention seeking. I wonder how much time is devoted to getting the child to sleep.
I’d suggest sitting down and drawing up some bedtime rules, then following them with no comments or interaction.

I would recommend looking at the mindfulness resource for little ones that Mind do, it’s called Mindful Monsters and can help with anxiety or concentration issues it’s worth a look

Ok, I'm sorry, but I have to ask this. Has your daughter had any boyfriends? Have any of them ever stayed over or even been around in the evening?

I do not think the answer is medication. In fact I would say that the answer isnot medication but a change like this will have a cause, and this cause needs to be found out. I doubt just asking the cause will work but perhaps someone she knows and loves talking to her gently about it at a time not near bedtime might provide a cause. You could talk to her teacher at school. She could be unhappy about something there and think that delaying sleeping delays when she next goes back to school.

She may not be tired in which case a wind down routine and then insisting she goes to her bedroom and stays there at bedtime, but leaving her free to play quietly or read until she wants to sleep may help, but be strict about her having to go to her room and stay there.

If she is doing this because if she does she is allowed to stay up then the answer is strictness about bedtimes, regardless of the fuss she makes, is the best solution. Put her in her bedroom and insist she stays there. If necessary sit on a chair outside her room silently shutting the door every time she opens it.

However, the core of this problem is finding out why this change has happened. The solution will then be clear.

If proper bedtime is 8 p.m., then sit her down and say you need a "grown up" conversation with her. That you understand 8 p.m. is the right time for little girls her age, but if she absolutely promises to go to bed at 9 p.m. very nicely with absolutely no fuss (ever) then you will allow her to be more grown up and go at 9.

Every night you must remind her at 8 that it is bedtime, and is she going to go nicely at 9.

If it works (it did for one of ours) then everyone is happy. If not ......

I was strict about an 8pm bedtime during the week even though DD1 didn't go to sleep straight away. She was a very poor sleeper so we had a play quietly but stay in your room rule. It took ages to get to this stage though. We used a system where she gradually got used to us not being with her. When she was in bed I promised that I would come up and say 'Hello' at a specific time. Originally it was five minutes and gradually extended. The only word spoken was 'Hello'. No long stays or conversations. Eventually she got used to being alone.

I wonder if your DGD has got to the stage where she realises that people don't always stay with you and she's beginning to worry her mum will leave like her dad did.

I suspect she isn’t tired at 7-30 and needs less sleep at 6 than she did previously.
Compared with most of you, we must have been very lenient parents with regard to bedtime! Our children (had 5 of them) were rarely in bed before 9 pm, we enjoyed a relaxed time with them in living room after bath, then stories, songs etc. We would watch for signs of tiredness, as obviously getting overtired causes problems falling asleep.

I notice my son and dil seem to have a lot of difficulty at bedtime. It can take them literally hours to get their children to sleep, I think because parents decided 7 pm should be bedtime, whether children are tired or not.

Medication at for sleep problems at 6 is definitely not an answer- some of the other suggestions in this thread about anxiety might be addressed though. I also like the idea of turning off TV, lights etc, but for this child it might cause more problems.

I agree with other posters, allay any fears your granddaughter may have. Then encourage her to stay in bed even if she does not sleep. Books, tapes etc can all be used but not screens. I would avoid the medication route at all costs.
I hope things improve soon.

I agree with other posters it’s most likely a fear that’s arisen out of something that’s nothing, and the clue is ‘she used to go to bed very well’ Please don’t think about medications for sleep
At six she is an ideal age for a star chart with a small present at the end of a week without fuss
If she does have an unsettling fear, how your daughter reacts can be the difference of the little ones ways of dealing with fears throughout life When a fear isn’t addressed it gets bigger and bigger and should never be dismissed as it is very real to her
You don’t say how it eventually ends each night ?